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Will FSU and Clemson join the SEC?

Discussion in 'RayGator's Swamp Gas' started by Tolbert1906, Jul 26, 2021.

  1. g8orbill

    g8orbill Old Gator Moderator VIP Member

    Apr 3, 2007
    Clermont, Fl
    I could see Mizoo along with Kansas going to the Big10 as they are a better fit for that conference
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  2. garettk

    garettk GC Hall of Fame

    Oct 3, 2008
    Is there recent precedence for a major conference kicking a school out?
    • Like Like x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  3. Endless Excuses

    Endless Excuses GC Hall of Fame

    Jan 13, 2010
    Mizou may not belong but they laid the bricks to us a few times since they arrived.
    • Agree Agree x 4
  4. Crusher

    Crusher GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 19, 2007
    From your lips to God's ears....please make this happen.
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. Crusher

    Crusher GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 19, 2007
    Even more reason to tell them not to let the door hit them in the backside on the way out.
    • Funny Funny x 3
  6. g8orbill

    g8orbill Old Gator Moderator VIP Member

    Apr 3, 2007
    Clermont, Fl
    the SEC has no exit payoff so any school can leave at anytime-the Big!0 payout is slightly larger thn the SEC payout so I could see this being an easy jump for mizzoo
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  7. ajoseph

    ajoseph Premium Member

    Jan 15, 2008
    And, ask the students if they want this to happen. Tripping to Nashville is second only to tripping to NOLA for away games for the students (at least the Greeks).
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. thatguy

    thatguy Moderator VIP Member

    Oct 2, 2020
    Tallahassee, FL
    One oft overlooked element of all this is that Texas A&M and Missouri are both highly ranked academic and research institutions. Both, along with Vanderbilt and the University of Florida, are members of the prestigious Association of American Universities. The four universities are the only AAU members within the SEC.
    Texas is a member. Oklahoma is not.
    P S
    Within the ACC
    North Carolina, Virginia, Boston College and Georgia Tech are AAU members.

    Our Members | Association of American Universities (AAU)
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Informative Informative x 2
  9. sir percival harvin

    sir percival harvin Junior

    Oct 14, 2017
    As we have all noted, the ACC is a one horse league. But they have a bunch of schools that just will not be able to compete financially after the switch to the pro model. How much can Boston College, Wake Forrest, Duke, or Georgia Tech (particularly compared to instate rival Georgia) spend to keep up with Clemson or the SEC schools. I think it is likely that Va. Tech, Clemson, FSU, and maybe UNC look to merge with the Big 10.

    I also think that Miami is poorly positioned financially to keep a spot in the top flight in football. They may get some help from being in a larger metropolitan area, but they have a limited number of alumni and lack the financial clout of the larger schools. I think the allure of "staying home" will not be able to compete with the paycheck available at other schools.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. gatorempire

    gatorempire GC Legend

    Jul 23, 2021
    Well they have twice the endowment of Georgia, so they can spend ... a little.

    I think we're underestimating a lot of the ACC schools because:

    1) Screw FSU
    2) We have a proximity bias to the south

    A few of those schools have serious clout in other sports - namely hoops - and manage to actually bring in money from them.
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. I would like for Georgia Tech to be welcomed back into the conference.

    If this is not done, I expect the Big Ten to come after them first and then try and pull in a few select others..

    Television networks / streaming services are driving much of this, I suspect, and I think Big Ten (Fox) has finally figured out they need some Deep South outposts . . . for recruiting purposes *and* population growth purposes.

    I think they drool over Tech, UVa, & UNC.

    I think the SEC (ESPN / ABC) knows this.

    That's going to be the next battle.

    Does the academic Big Three in the ACC want to do the North-South thing with the Big Ten or do they want to save the ACC and affiliate with the SEC ???

    We shall see.
    • Informative Informative x 2
  12. thatguy

    thatguy Moderator VIP Member

    Oct 2, 2020
    Tallahassee, FL
    Highly recommended article

    College coaches, executives:
    OU, Texas just the first domino to fall as NCAA loses more ground

    JUL 26, 2021

    Nowhere near the end. The beginning of the end as college football has been known – at least for the past decade-plus.
    That's the consensus of myriad coaches, senior-level staffers and administrators around college athletics and specifically college football who spoke to FootballScoop in the wake of the seismic shifts generated across the landscape by the impending departures of both Oklahoma and Texas from the Big 12 Conference. Once again, the rest of college football – and therefore college athletics, by and large – is following the lead of Greg Sankey's Southeastern Conference, which presumably will add the Longhorns and Sooners – and sooner than later. Overall, it's the SEC out front – and everyone, including the NCAA, playing from behind.
    • “The move, I don’t think, is inherently bad for the game,” said one respondent. “The responses to it may be. What other conferences try to do will determine more in my opinion."
    • “What the Big 12/AAC/ACC do in terms of expanding or not impact G5 (Group of 5). More so – won’t be a G5 if it falls how we think. We will see the chain reaction it causes.”
    • “Good for the game,” he said. “It will obviously start the next and hopefully last round of realignment. Which is always good. Feel bad for those that will lose the traditional rivalries. Can't replace those.”
    • “Well, I think this is the first domino to fall,” said a college football administrator. “There's no chance Texas and Oklahoma stay in the Big 12 until 2025.
    • “Ultimately, I predict that there will be four conferences with 16 teams in them that will make their own rules and split off from the NCAA.”
    • “I don’t know where this leaves the Big 12, in particular. Financially I don’t know how they survive. Do some of the schools go to the PAC? Doesn’t make a lot of sense from a geographic standpoint … and to ask student-athletes to fly back-and-forth across the country every other weekend is tough. Is there a market for some of those weird matchups? I don’t know…
    • “Schools where players can earn big money for NIL will be fine. The rich will keep getting richer, with starters at high-profile schools getting upward of $500k from NIL. If all the money goes to the football players, will schools be forced to dump other male non-revenue sports? Football drives everything as you know. You might see two conferences with some Big 12, Big 10, PAC 12 and ACC teams.”
    • “As the NCAA continues to lose some ground and the conferences continue to ascend to positions of autonomy or control, this is a strategic move that will solidify the SEC’s position atop the collegiate landscape.”
    College coaches, executives: OU, Texas just the first domino to fall as NCAA loses more ground

    Bob Stoops writes op-ed praising Oklahoma's move to the SEC
    SEC Commish issues Oklahoma-Texas application statement
    What's next for Texas, Oklahoma and the SEC?
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. atlantagator86

    atlantagator86 GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 3, 2007
    Alpharetta, GA
    I don't see the SEC or Big-10 merging with any other conferences. There are only a small handful of programs in the ACC and Pac-12 (none in the Big-12) that would bring additional revenue to either the SEC or Big-10.

    In addition, I don't think super conferences are going to be built on size, but having the most marketable and financially sound elite programs. I have a feeling that 16 to 18 is going to be the size limit of the super conferences. 18 only because you could have 3 6-team divisions with a 5-2-2 rotation in a 9 game conference schedule. So I don't see the SEC and Big-10 doing anything drastic right now.

    But I think you'll likely see the Big-10 and SEC try to facilitate that the top 16-18 teams of their choice from the ACC, Pac-12 and remains of the Big-12 all agree to leave their conferences to form a new 3rd super conference and those 3 conferences will leave the NCAA.
  14. TrueGator

    TrueGator GC Hall of Fame

    Nov 11, 2014
    So, what's the point of a conference again?
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. Crusher

    Crusher GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 19, 2007
    I don't think the SEC will expand past 16, unless they are forced by market conditions. I do think that Mizzou would bolt in a NY second for the Big 10, which would be a good thing for the SEC IMO since I don't think they bring much to the table. They would have to be replaced and the following is the list that I think the SEC would move toward ranked 1st to last:
    1. North Carolina (Major, major footprint in a growing State with probably more Basketball tradition (and cheating, but that is irrelevant) than any other school outside of UCLA. Kentucky would lobby strongly for this. Long-shot, because to their detriment they appear to be tied at the hip to Duke and NCSt)
    2. Florida State (Sorry folks, although Gators won't like this they still are the second biggest draw in the 3rd biggest and getting bigger State in the nation. FSU would also jump all over this because it would, at least temporarily, solve their financial issues.)
    3. Georgia Tech (Because of the former SEC ties and being in the biggest metro area in the SEC footprint)
    4. tie: Okie State (I would put this as a tie with Tech if they were in Oklahoma City, but they are in Stillwater. They have oodles of oil money). Clemson (Great football program only in a small State already within the SEC footprint), NC State (see distant 2nd choice to #1 North Carolina).
    5. Kansas (a definite reach and only because of their Basketball tradition)
    Desperation time: Virginia Tech, WVU (I'm not even sure if the SEC would accept these schools even if they had to remain at 15 members for a few seasons. Either would give their left nut to join the SEC).

    I don't think the SEC wants any additional private schools (although they might take ND) which rules out the remainder of the TX schools other the TTU, Miami, and Duke.
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2021
    • Disagree Bacon! Disagree Bacon! x 1
  16. Sankey is The Godfather, the SEC has first mover advantage & is driving the train, so I'm enjoying the TOTAL FEAR in Tallahassee that they may be left behind, and I'm LOVING the flip flop in Austin where they've suddenly remembered they *are* Southerners.

    But I think people are forgetting the old AFL-NFL war.

    Those lamenting college football losing its charm need to remember that pro football "war" from days gone by.

    ESPN is attempting a power move, Fox will counter.

    But the Group of Five have a tremendous opportunity because a well-funded streaming service that needs product could easily rescue them and allow a funky brand of upstarts to gain favor.

    When I listen to dumbass Big Ten eggheads go on and on about AAU research universities being a requirement for admission I can't help but think these administrators are clueless. They tried to strong-arm the SEC last year, by deciding there would be no football.

    Wrong move, stupid move.

    Sankey is also wrong if he doesn't remember those pro football wars of days gone by. People talking about 32 or 64 exclusive teams are missing the long play.

    IMHO, the long play requires a minimum of 80 or so teams or you run the risk of giving the Group of Five a healthy base to mimic what FSU and Miami did in the 1980s + new forms of media partners ready to fund the "little engines that could" narrative.

    America *loves* that narrative.

    I'm in favor of the ACC bringing West Virginia into the fold, the SEC & ACC working out an arrangement with the AAC while the Pac 12 is working out an arrangement with the remnants of the Big XII.

    We need the SEC being supreme, yes, but we also need a national game and we as the SEC need to work hard to make that happen.
    • Winner Winner x 1
  17. insuragator

    insuragator Premium Member

    Apr 3, 2007
    "FSU can suck it".... Princess you may be my favorite poster of all time.
    • Agree Agree x 2
  18. GratefulGator

    GratefulGator GC Hall of Fame

    Oct 15, 2016
    Boulder Colorado
    I don't think Clemson or fsu want any part of joining the SEC. Why would they want to join a hard conference (SEC) vs playing in the weak ACC where they play one or two hard games a year as an easy path to the playoffs?

    I don't want fsu or Clemson to join the SEC. And I don't think they'd join SEC at this point.
  19. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 8, 2007
    Apparently: $$$$$$$$$
  20. bonpear

    bonpear Sophomore

    Jul 30, 2021
    The quickest reference point for football revenues is this Wallstreet Journal link that uses 2018 revenues.

    College Football Value Rankings - WSJ.com

    The difference between the SEC and ACC payouts for the main tv rights was $19 million positive for the SEC. So to see what an ACC team’s revenue would look like generally when it first moves to the SEC simply add $19 million to their 2018 revenue which includes tertiary and replay tv rights, ticket sales, and merchandising sales.

    For example, FSU made 94.6 million in the ACC but if it had been in the SEC it would have been 123.6 million which is more than Florida’s 118 million and would put it sixth in the NuSEC behind Texas, Alabama, Oklahoma, Georgia and Auburn in that order and just ahead of LSU. Clemson on the other hand would only be up to 91.2 million which is 10 million behind South Carolina and only above Ole Miss, Miss State, and Kentucky, Vanderbilt. So I do doubt how long Clemson would stay relevant as a superpower when it’s being outspent by most of its conference.

    Other valuable ACC schools from a revenue standpoint are obviously Notre Dame (which would only be behind Texas in revenue); Virginia Tech who is very similar to Clemson monetarily; Georgia Tech who is $13 million behind Clemson but who would be ahead of Kentucky, Ole Miss, Miss State and Vandy; and Louisville who is just right behind Georgia Tech. Pitt, Syracuse, NC State, North Carolina and LOL Miami would actually be behind Kentucky but ahead of the Miss Schools and Vandy. Duke, Wake Forest, Boston College and Virginia would be behind the Miss Schools and only ahead of Vandy. Vandy would still be dead last as they are utterly useless even Wake almost doubles them up.