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Why Stars Matter

Discussion in 'Awesome Recruiting' started by g8torbrent, Dec 20, 2018.

  1. g8torbrent

    g8torbrent Sophomore

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  2. TJtheGator

    TJtheGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Still need great coaching. Zooker and Lumpy always got stars.
     
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  3. dadx4

    dadx4 GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 3, 2007
    Gainesville, Fl
    Their bag men are the best in the business too. Clemson's is pretty good too.
     
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  4. thale410

    thale410 GC Hall of Fame

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    "Florida clearly has lots of quality players coming into Gainesville next season. But the lack of can’t-miss prospects is an issue."

    I'm not sure what that is.

    Is 'can't miss' Percy, or Cam (at another school), or Leak, or Tebow, or VH3? C4 with one really great year? Bubba Caldwell with a solid body of work?

    Here are more than a few of our highest rated guys in the recent past that wouldn't really seem to fit a more grand definition of 'can't miss':

    Deonte Thompson
    Cam Newton
    James Wilson
    John Brantley
    Omar Hunter
    Andre DeBose
    Xavier Nixon
    Ron Powell
    Josh Shaw
    Jeff Driskel
    Gary Brown
    DJ Humphries
    Kelvin Taylor
    Tez Ivey
    CeCe Jeff


    You get the best guys you can at the right spots, while balancing your roster and creating LOS depth. Then have a good coach to maximize the talent they brought to campus. Then do it over a 3 year rolling cycle.

    A lot of things matter in recruiting, including 'stars'.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2018
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  5. INGATORSWETRUST

    INGATORSWETRUST GC Hall of Fame

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    Average star ranking is far different than the class rankings we see that are based on volume. Signing 30 versus 23 should not impact class rank. More is not best, as we can see from the waist size of those visiting the buffet line. Quality and average star ranking is best. Number of players signed in top 300 is better measure, as percentage difference in ranking between kids by ratings Service is so subjective
     
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  6. bvgator789

    bvgator789 All American

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    Alot of times when we see a guy that is a 3 star and we see his highlight film and are like damn he is good how is he not ranked higher??? Many of times its because the kid does not camp anywhere to be evaluated so all you go off is film and the competition he faced in high school.
     
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  7. 62gator

    62gator GC Hall of Fame

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    We would be crowing to no end if UF signed 12 5* players in the last 2 recruiting cycles like UGA has. UGA is pushing Bama for the top spot, while we’re pushing the likes of Washington for the 15th spot. Zero doubt about coaching, firmly believe Dan will throughly out coach most above us on game day. Need to get better on the trail though to move up into the top tier of teams. He will, imho.
     
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  8. GoCocks3877

    GoCocks3877 Senior

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    All those stars haven’t helped FSU..

    It’s all about great coaching with good talent. Alabama does pull in all those 5 and 4 stars, but it also helps having Nick Saban.
     
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  9. rpmGator

    rpmGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Zack Prescott was a two star as most of the team that was rated number one

    Who’s star system are you using

    Because our staff makes a lot more money than the tools on ESPN
     
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  10. Diesel350z

    Diesel350z GC Legend

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    Mullen needs to start closing the gap. Good coaching will only take you so far.
     
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  11. SeabudGator

    SeabudGator GC Legend

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    I think most agree but you keep posting new threads about "top 100" and stars - all attacking mullen on recruiting. Then people reply with these facts:
    - Getting a great class (star wise) with no offensive lineman (see Lumpy) is no good.
    - The services over represent and over value getting skill players in their rankings (only 1 RB and 5 OL on the field at a time).
    - Coaching matters.
    - For most current recruits and Florida coaches lives, UF has been embarrassing on the field with goofs leading the way. Not "not great". Bad. It takes more time to go from bad to great than from good to great.
    - Many, including me, believe that winning begets recruiting. Look at the 2020 class and winning seems to be building momentum.

    Your points about recruiting are fair (repetitive, but fair) AND all the above are true. People understand that you want some top 100 players. We do too and I'm pretty sure Dan does too. Do you agree that the other points are relevant?

    I'm just suggesting that the situation is better analyzed more holistically rather than picking at it with narrow attacks in multiple threads.
     
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  12. StrangeGator

    StrangeGator GC Hall of Fame

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    He is. He started in a pretty deep hole, selling a team that just had its worst season in decades. Good coaching got us in a major bowl game this year and this OL heavy recruiting class will keep the momentum going and allow Mullen to focus on skill positions in the next two classes. FWIW, UF is already ranked in the top five for the 2020 and 2021 classes.
     
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  13. DieAGator

    DieAGator GC Hall of Fame

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    That's true. Mullen still has a credibility gap. Mullen didn't land Tim and Percy, Urban Meyer did. I believe Mullen took a step towards becoming an "it" coach this season- he did a damn good job. What we don't know is his ceiling but I believe it's higher than this season revealed. If we are going to be elite four seasons from now he needs to get on the great players early. It's a tall order. But over the past two cycles how many guys have we not landed that, in the end, we said "we were just a little late recruiting him"? See Ika this cycle. So that's a big part of it imho. I have to say I am a little surprised we didn't see shades of the Percy position from some of our players. In the back of our minds I think we were looking for more from the offense- formations, wrinkes, jet sweeps etc but it wasn't there. He should go watch some of his old UF highlights.

    I'm convinced something criminal is happening at georgia with the FL LB getting an $80k truck and a 4 star QB signing without even a visit. There was too much reason to doubt Kirby from the start- Yes, a Saban disciple but most from Saban's tree have failed; He's a defensive coach, not an offensive coach; Had a poor first season yet continued to land top 5 players at all positions as if he was a multi season NC coach. Something not right there. I wish a group of coaches would conspire to alert the NCAA.

    It's a mystery to me how players can be induced almost as if coordinated between their recruiting department and booster/bagmen. It can't be that much a secret-- there has to be a trail.

    Credibility and coaching. Saban's good enough to hire coaches that can literally develop already good talent and can also recruit extremely well. They have credibiity and know what to say. Saban is a great "overseear" and knows how to close. TBH if Saban wanted me I would be listening even though I love UF.

    The only thing I can say or add is that we saw how poorly some looked under our last two staffs only to excel at another school then make bank in the NFL.

    I believe stars matter and unlike some people believe the recruiting services are very good at evaluating. When I see a 3 star with a mid major offer list I know the writing is on the wall.

    I don't see how they get away with it. How is it that georgia or Bama don't have some disgruntled players that tell their story?
     
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  14. Diesel350z

    Diesel350z GC Legend

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    You are misinterpreting my concerns as attacking. I'm not attacking him in any way, only voicing my concern as of right now. Fact is the more 5 stars you have on the roster the higher percentage those 5 star players will be starters and major contributors vs 3 stars. Next year we will have ZERO 5 stars on our roster. Will we have a good team? yes I believe so. Will we be able to beat the GA/Alabama's next year. I doubt it. I think it will take Mullen several years to close the gap between us and the GA/Alabama's of the world. Trust me I'd rather have Mullen than any of the previous dumpster fires we've had.
     
  15. gatorpower

    gatorpower GC Hall of Fame

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    I love how the article glosses over the fact that the range of average star ratings goes from 2.50- 4.10, but the winning percentage goes from 0% to 100%.

    So everything ON THAT ENTIRE GRAPH fits in 1.6 STARS?!!!

    I like the line though because it lets me do math. If you have two points, you can find the equation:

    X, Y
    ------
    0, 3.15
    100,3.65

    OMG, can you already see it? The slope is 0.005. Or 1/200 LOL y = X/200 + 3.15 IT'S PRETTY MUCH A STRAIGHT LINE
     
  16. StrangeGator

    StrangeGator GC Hall of Fame

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    One of the greatest mysteries of the universe. Whatever is going on with bagmen, I don't think there is coordination with the program. If you or I wanted to drop money off to the family of a player the Gators badly wanted, we wouldn't need to ask the coaches who to drop it off to. it's just the way things are done in Alabama and Georgia. Wouldn't be surprised if the current bagmen aren't descended from previous bagmen, kind of like corrupt real estate tycoons from Queens.
     
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  17. StrangeGator

    StrangeGator GC Hall of Fame

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    I was told there would be no math.
     
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  18. DieAGator

    DieAGator GC Hall of Fame

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    But am I going to pay you up front or tell you there's a pot of gold reserved if you sign. Then, what if I fail to pay you? There has to be communication on record(text messages at least) or what, I stalk you at your HS, come to your house, ? It's perplexing but I think it is happening.
     
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  19. manigordo

    manigordo GC Hall of Fame

    1. Stars matter.
    2. Distribution of stars matters more.
    3. Recognition of talent by coaches matters more (The 3 highest rate players in UF history are, in order, Ronald Powell, Brock Berlin and Martez Ivey.)
    4. Development of players matter.
    5. Playing the game on fire matters.
    6. Playing the game with perfect execution matters (see Boise vs Georgia)
    7. Having "difference makers," team leaders and a great QB matters.
    8. Calling a great game by the coaches matters.

    The "stars matter" discussion happens every year. No one should ever discount that having a talented team is better than NOT having a talented team. However, the above variables "matter" and they are not all about stars.
     
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  20. DieAGator

    DieAGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Great post.