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Solution for the national debt

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by gatorknights, Sep 14, 2018.

  1. gatorknights

    gatorknights GC Hall of Fame

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    Just print more money. Sounds like a plan!

    Trump told Gary Cohn to 'print money' to lower the national debt, according to Bob Woodward's book

    "As a candidate, Donald Trump pledged to balance the federal budget and lower the national debt, promises that are proving difficult to keep.

    Once he won, Trump considered an unusual approach that was quickly slapped down by his chief economic advisor, according to veteran journalist Bob Woodward's new book, "Fear: Trump in the White House," which went on sale Tuesday."

    "Just run the presses — print money," Trump said, according to Woodward, during a discussion on the national debt with Gary Cohn, former director of the White House National Economic Council."

    [​IMG]
     
  2. hoyt233

    hoyt233 GC Hall of Fame

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    Prattvile, AL-Go Lions!
    How about a GoFundMe account?
     
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  3. NavyGator93

    NavyGator93 GC Legend

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    Less golf?
     
  4. exiledgator

    exiledgator Gruntled

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    More golf. Less presidenting.
     
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  5. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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    It worked for Zimbabwe ...

    But seriously, it shows how dumb Trump is. He thinks he has all the answers and everything has an easy solution so he can just play some golf. Did he really think that would work and that no one had thought of that before?
     
  6. grumpygator77

    grumpygator77 GC Legend

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    trump: the typical "know it all" you knew in High School.
    Elected by the all the other "know it all" kids.

    To wit: "who knew health care was so hard?"
     
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  7. gatorpika

    gatorpika Premium Member

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    The only way anybody buys off on that is if you come up with some catchy name.....maybe "quantitative easing 3"? Then get some economists to say they buy off on the idea.
     
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  8. StrangeGator

    StrangeGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Just read that part of the book. The conversations between Cohn and Trump were maddening. Our president doesn't have a clue about macro economics. How did he earn his MBA? I'm guessing Wharton would like to take it back.

    "Donald Trump was the dumbest g-d damn student I ever had." William T. Kelly, Professor of Marketing, Wharton School of Business
     
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  9. Spurffelbow833

    Spurffelbow833 GC Hall of Fame

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    Kevin Hassett should use the likely source of Trump's economical acumen to retrain him. After Trump has pumped a few spare sets of Monopoly money into the game, switch out the title deed cards. Purchase price $400,000, of course. He'll fire Hassett and learn nothing, but hey, it's all I got.

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. AgingGator

    AgingGator GC Hall of Fame

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    While the scenario depicted here is a bit dramatic, the reality is that "printing money" is the only viable solution to paying off the debt.

    Regardless of your political alliance, our government has borrowed $20 Trillion, assuming $350 Million citizens, that means that the USG has borrowed $57,000 in the name of every citizen of the U.S. Assuming that the claimed 47% of people do not pay any tax, that means that they have borrowed $108,000 in the name of every taxpayer.

    Assuming the average tax liability per taxpayer is between $5,000 and $10,000, that means it would take between 10 and 20 years to pay off the debt if 100% of our tax revenue went to retiring the debt. Since we are currently running a deficit, that means that currently we are paying 0% toward retiring the debt. By almost any reasonable financial analysis, the USG is already insolvent, but for the ability to borrow more money to pay interest pay off bonds at maturity, i.e. "print money". This has been going on for decades, regardless of whether Democrats or Republicans have been in power.

    The ONLY plausible way out of this mess to sustainably grow the U.S. economy by 3 - 5%/year for many years without letting inflation take hold so that interest rates remain relatively low, and let inflated dollars repay the base dollars that the debt was borrowed in.

    This is definitely easier said than done but I do applaud Trump for at least recognizing that if Congress will not reduce spending then aggressive growth is the only way out. Politicians and citizens sticking their heads in the sand in thinking we can continue to re-finance the debt forever while we continue to grow it is not a strategy.
     
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  11. tarponbro

    tarponbro GC Legend

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    National debt, I. e. budget deficits, is a game most of the countries and territories in the world are playing right now with just a few exceptions. Germany, South Korea and Taiwan stand out the most to me. The USA just has a lot more debt than other countries. Look at List of countries by government budget on Wikipedia. It gives numbers for 2017 and is pretty interesting, at least to me it is. BTW, Norway at 4.2% is the only country I see in the top 50 countries to have a surplus of more than 1%. Hong Kong was second at 1%. Another thing I noticed was that South Korea isn't in the top 10 in revenues.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2018
  12. Tasselhoff

    Tasselhoff GC Hall of Fame

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    No one really wants to fix the nationAl debt...well no one in power who could. Not trump, not Obama, not democrats not republicans. It would cause pain to people and thus lessen their chance of re election.
     
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  13. gatorknights

    gatorknights GC Hall of Fame

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    It's not only dramatic, it's a freaking Hail Mary attempt to think that printing money would knock down the debt. Printing money is highly inflationary as you have more physical dollars chasing the same supply of goods and services. It also leads directly to higher interest rates, which is highly inflationary as well. That makes the cost of servicing debt higher. Toss in that brilliant idea of the recent tax cuts reducing tax revenues and you have a recipe for disaster. Leave it to King Donnie the Terrible to take this route and claim victory. There are a bunch of 19 and 20 year old students down there on the corner of University Ave and 13th Street at UF college of Business Administration that are LMAO-ing at lord gawd Donnie's approach.

    We have a national debt bubble forming, a corporate junk bond bubble forming, a consumer debt bubble forming, and a student debt bubble forming. Printing money thus pushing up interest rates could easily make servicing those debt bubbles nearly impossible. But that won't stop El Jefe from screwing it up while claiming massive credit (pun intended) while blaming everything else for the debt bubble bursting. Did he learn nothing from 2008? Well he probably did, the problem is he just doesn't care.
     
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  14. AgingGator

    AgingGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Easy there, settle down. I acknowledged your point in my “easier said than done” section.
    The fact is that anytime federal reserve offers a discount rate lower than an equilibrium deposit rate, they ARE, in fact “printing money”

    My point, and I believe what Trump realizes is you have to “print” just enough money to generate 3-5% growth and adjust as necessary to keep inflation at bay.

    Those terrible tax cuts that you like to crucify are going to generate a near term budget deficit if the government does not reduce spending. They are also, along with reduced regulations stimulating massive investment in new products and additional capacity to produce existing products which will increase the supply capacity as the economy grows.
    If you have a better idea to paying off the $108K per citizen that they have borrowed, I’m all years. I pay over $30K per year in federal income taxes. If they increased my taxes by 15% and put it all toward debt reduction it would still take almost 4 years to pay off my $108K.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2018
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  15. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    He doesn't have an MBA.

    Five myths Donald Trump tells about Donald Trump

    Trump did graduate from the Wharton School of business at the University of Pennsylvania, an Ivy League college. But Trump did not get an MBA from Wharton; he has a much less prestigious undergraduate degree. He was a transfer student who arrived at Wharton after two years at Fordham University, which U.S. News & World Report currently ranks 66th among national universities. (Besides, simply going to an Ivy League school doesn’t prove you’re a genius.)


    Gwenda Blair, in her 2001 book “The Trumps,” said that Trump’s grades at Fordham were just “respectable” and that he got into Wharton mainly because he had an interview with an admissions officer who had been a high school classmate of his older brother. And Wharton’s admissions team surely knew that Trump was from one of New York’s wealthiest families.

    For years, numerous media reports said Trump graduated first in his class from Wharton, but that’s wrong. The 1968 commencement program does not list him as graduating with any sort of honors. In fact, the Boston Globe reported that he barely made an impression at all: “His former classmates said he seemed a student who spoke up a lot but rarely shined in class, who barely participated in campus activities, shunned fraternity parties.”
     
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  16. gatorknights

    gatorknights GC Hall of Fame

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    All good points, my problem with it though is that I don't trust donnie to reduce spending, I don't trust him to accurately gauge how much to print, and I'm pretty certain the tax cuts will only "trickle down" like a certain yellow liquid all over our respective legs while being given the weather report.

    In the world I live in, the RE industry, reduced regulations equal permission to steal (proven true over and over and over and over and over again). so I sure as heck don't trust him to use any of those responsibly either.

    And speaking of weather reports, donnie could tell me it's raining outside, but given his propensity to lie like a dog on a rug, he could tell me it's raining outside, but I'm still going over to the door or window to see for myself.
     
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  17. gtr2x

    gtr2x GC Hall of Fame

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    Won't happen with massive tax cuts and no spending cuts. This trickle down economics does not work. The gap between the top 10 % and the bottom 50% gets bigger every day. 5% growth and no inflation, cmon?!
    As for applauding Trump for having a plan to reduce the budget, that's funny. No sane economist thinks trumps tax plan will ever reduce the deficit, just the opposite and at record setting pace. Trump has one goal and reducing the deficit is obviously not it.
     
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  18. AgingGator

    AgingGator GC Hall of Fame

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    None of these "sane" economists have very good plans either.
    Face it, there's no easy way out of this mess whether you hate or love Trump. We have both political parties addicted to spending and playing Santa Claus.
     
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  19. studegator

    studegator Junior

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    Can you imagine somone running for office that ran on reducing the national debt ? They would have a snowballs chance in hell of being elected. We all want what we want. I don't want my VA benefits cut. I don't want my SS cut, I don't want my medicare cut. I do want our military streamlined and medicade gone over line by line. I'm sick of unmarried people having government (taxpayers) pay for their children's births. An acquaintance works for the Fl DOC and tells me I would be shocked at how many officers are unmarried and have their babies on the gov dime. It's not just a problem in the ghettos but in main stream america as well. Healthcare cost are greater here than any industrialised nation, something has to be done to bring it in line. And on and on-------
     
  20. AgingGator

    AgingGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Just take a look at the signs on the corners of the road from February to April 15th. Earned Income Credit, Refundable Child Tax Credits, as you said on and on-------