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Possibly The Most Casual Police Shooting You'll See All Year

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by fastsix, Aug 8, 2018.

  1. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    Both sides just don't seem to care. It's bizarre.

    And btw...for everybody who has always wanted the cops to shoot someone in the legs rather than center mass - this is your guy.

    I'm going to guess there's some NSFW language, but not 100% sure. Everybody is so casual about it.

     
  2. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    Prosecutor thought the shooting was unjustified. Not surprisingly his department disagreed.

    This is the second suspect he's purposely shot in the legs btw - in the video you'll hear a reference to "the last time".

    Utah officer cleared in shooting of woman holding a screwdriver

    A Utah police department has cleared an officer who opened fire on a woman in June after threatening to shoot her as she paced around holding a screwdriver and verbally taunted officers.

    But a county prosecutor had a different interpretation — that the shooting was not legally justified and that the officer came ready to open fire.


    Instead, Dunn was depicted as escalating the situation. He said later that he believed Casimiro had a "God complex" that made her feel invincible, and he's heard on the recording telling another officer, "I can take her out like last time."

    The Use of Force Review Board said Dunn was referring to a 2012 shooting that he and another officer were involved in, "in a near identical situation."

     
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  3. GatorNorth

    GatorNorth Premium Member Premium Member

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    Reminds me of this movie scene:



    But not quite as funny.
     
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  4. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

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    Unlike some of the other shootings that have been covered on this board, this perp was given many opportunities to drop her weapon.
     
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  5. ValdostaGatorFan

    ValdostaGatorFan GC Hall of Fame

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    What did these officers start becoming such little pansies?
     
  6. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    What made him a "pansy"? He simply seemed like a man who was tired of having to deal with criminals on a daily basis and took a "shortcut". Unfortunately for him dealing with these types of people is his job.
     
  7. ValdostaGatorFan

    ValdostaGatorFan GC Hall of Fame

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    A shortcut indeed, just like "last time."

    IMO, me and a buddy can apprehend a little lady with a screwdriver without needing to squeeze off rounds. I would bet money on it. Give us pepper spray and I'd bet 2:1.
     
  8. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    Im torn here. I’m usually on the prosecute the officer side of the fence in these situations. However,

    1) I think the officer, like is frequently the case due to their training, tried to take total immediate control of the situation. When someone doesnt comply the officer then proceeds to use physical force as required in the situation per their training. I’m not sure how much to fault the individual officer.

    2) There are much better cases to prosecute than this. Prosecuting this one could have public backlash.

    3) I’m happy the officer tried the taser first then went for the legs rather than simply going for center mass kill shots. More should do it. It still presents a risk hit much less of one.

    4) The suspect was literally inviting it which means my sympathy level is almost nil (reserved for mentally ill in that type of situation).
     
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  9. ValdostaGatorFan

    ValdostaGatorFan GC Hall of Fame

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    I will say... at least she is alive, and at least he tried the taser first. No where as egregious as some of the other ones I've seen.
     
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  10. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    But if you have to deal with people with sharpened screwdrivers on a regular basis, and rush them on a regular basis, eventually the odds will catch up with you. I don't think he should have shot her, at least not with a bullet. He either should have continued to try and talk her down, or called in someone with a shotgun with beanbag rounds, or some other less lethal weapon. At the very least he should have gave her a face full of pepper spray. I think I understand his reasoning, "Shooting her in the leg is less lethal," but then you hit the femoral artery or something and all of a sudden you've killed someone because you just didn't want to deal with her.

    I don't think this guy should be a cop any more, he obviously doesn't want to do the work.
     
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  11. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    I don’t think it’s that clear cut. The department clearly didn’t prohibit him for using these tactics in the shooting five years ago so I’m sure he thinks it’s a valid tactic.
     
  12. ValdostaGatorFan

    ValdostaGatorFan GC Hall of Fame

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    I agree with that.

    It seems like de-escalation is not really a thing these days. More than 2 minutes is too long to spend trying to talk sense into someone. She didn't look like a flight risk.

    As one of the county attorneys said, "Casimiro was not fleeing, had not made any verbal threats towards officers and there was sufficient distance between Casimiro and any bystander to remove any imminent threat of harm. It appears that the situation was manageable at the time Corporal Dunn arrived and it would have seemed reasonable for officers to continue de-escalation tactics until the situation could be more fully contained."
     
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  13. OaktownGator

    OaktownGator Guardian of the GC Galaxy Moderator VIP Member

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    He shouldn't have shot her, IMO, as he could have just kept talking to her and she was in no position to hurt anybody.

    Maybe I am a bit desensitized to police shootings due to coverage, but as questionable shootings go, this just doesn't seem bad at all. He tried to just take her down and not kill her. He was pretty restrained while cuffing her and tried to help make her comfortable. There was no ill intent involved.

    I think it probably comes down to how he was trained. Had he been trained to wait it out and deescalate things, I think that's what he would've done.
     
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  14. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    Absolutely. The dearth of deescalation training for police is “criminal.”
     
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  15. orangeblue_coop

    orangeblue_coop GC Hall of Fame

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    Methinks that wasn't her first time getting shot, she took that bullet like a champ.
     
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  16. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    Also might have been some high quality drugs involved, or if not high quality, maybe high quantity. Either ways she didn't seem to care about the threat of being shot, or actually being shot. Like I said, a very casual police shooting.

    Hmmm...that's my only taser. I guess I'll have to shoot you now.
    Well, if you have to I guess you have to. I don't see another option.
    Just know that it's not personal.
    No no no, of course not.
     
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  17. baygator1

    baygator1 Premium Member

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    She had plenty of opportunity to comply. Really dumb to continue holding what the police believe to be a weapon after being instructed several times to drop it. And the police don't have any idea what else she might have hiding under all that loose clothing.
     
  18. AndyGator

    AndyGator GC Hall of Fame

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    He was in no physical threat whatsoever. Why not just give her a warning shot at her feet?
     
  19. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    It's a weapon. Really common for people to carry screwdrivers as weapons and also boxcutters. Easy to steal out of a garage and probably a mistaken belief that they can claim, "But it's a tool, not a weapon".
     
  20. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

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    I'm confused about what the man is doing there. The officers indicate multiple times that they don't want him to be hurt. It seems that she was an immediate danger to that man.