Hegseth orders Navy ship USNS "Harvey Milk" to be stripped of its name

Caucuses of the United States Congress - Wikipedia

There is a candy caucus and an Albanian issues caucus, among many others ... I suppose they are paying as much attention to Albanians and candy if this is the metric.

 

Dems are walking right into this trap. "Oh so you support renaming things named after Washington and Jefferson but not this? You support Milk even though he did XYZ?" Dems keep falling for this kind of thing over and over. You can't win every battle.

 

Nailed it. And that's the point @enviroGator and I have been getting at. If the Republicans get to plant their flag on these issues, that automatically makes the Dems on the opposite side in today's political climate. It's why MAGA focuses on culture war shit above all else. "Oh, you don't want to deport migrant workers? Then you're pro-open borders." We see it here all the time. Binary nonsense.

 

The Russians came up with a concept called Reflexive Control Theory. The idea is that if you understand your adversary’s perception and decision-making processes, you can shape and impact it so they voluntarily make decisions favorable to you and possibly without realizing they’ve been manipulated. I'm wondering if some MAGA type staffers in this DoD studied them since that is what a lot of this looks like. They pick an 80/20 or 70/30 issue and go with that and Democrats immediately freak out and try to make a big deal of it.

 

Well the main problem is that the Dem leadership are anti-immigration and lots of their pols are on the same page as republicans on other culture war stuff, police funding, crypto, anti-union stuff, etc. Voters they need to build a winning coalition aren’t. Also triangulating has become a matter of religion to them. They are constantly attacking their own voters and creating or talking about internal wedge issues. They are always looking for someone or something to denounce, cargo culting Sista Soulja into the 21st century. Anyways the fretting over positions is really stupid … they should be more worried about finding a charismatic politician that can resolve those contradictions by force of personality. Obama could be anything to anyone - left to the lefties, a change candidate that wasn’t scary to centrists, a smart guy for the wonks, but a guy who knew ball for the bros. Not too black for the squishy racists not quite black enough for Jesse Jackson, black nationalists and other people that scare white people. Trump was the same for the fractured republican factions - same sort of type you can project onto despite their public statements.

 

Epic Pride Month Troll.

 

You're right and one would think that, but that would depend on if you agree with the name change like the ones that happened several years ago with Bragg etc..

 

Maybe so but there is a difference between changing the names of minor naval support ships (the Harvey Milk is an oiler manned by a civilian crew) that were named after consequential and generally admired Americans and changing the names of military bases named after officers who led an active rebellion against the government of the United States.

I would also add that the renaming of the bases that were named after Confederate Generals was based on a provision in 2021 Defense Authorization Act. Hegseth's decision to rename the ships is being done entirely on his own volition although I'm sure that he has the full support of the former reality television star who nominated him.

 

The issue here IMO is how we understand the separation of church and state. The whole premise of a secular society is the state is supposed to be a neutral entity with respect to religion.

Naming a boat after an other than honorable discharged gay man is not religious neutrality by the federal government. Neither is flying the pride flag at US embassies, which also was rightfully reversed by Trump. Both are examples that show the clear ambition of powerful politicians to orient the apparatus of the state to a position of non-neutrality in religious matters. Hegseth is completely justified in his actions to realign the military to be a neutral entity with respect to homosexuality

 

Maybe we should just keep naming ships after POTUS's, military heroes, and battlefields? There is not a ship named after every Navy Medal of Honor winner. Maybe we should get through them first before we start moving on to politicians.

 

What the hell? This cant be serious. If you honestly believe this, then wouldnt naming a ship after anyone who was a practicing Christian not be "neutral" also? You dont have to cook up a cockamamie argument like this, just say you dont want a ship named after a gay civil rights figure dude.

 

Although it's arguable as to whether Harvey Milk meets the criteria the John Lewis class of replenishment oilers are named after prominent civil rights activists and leaders. Following is a list of current and proposed ships in that class:

 

Why are we naming USNS ships after civil rights activists and leaders when there are still Navy Medal of Honor winners that do not have a ship named after them? Who was it that came up with this class' name?

 

Why is it arguable? He's more of a recognized civil rights figure than freaking Bobby Kennedy or RBG lol.

 

Destroyers are named after Naval and Marine Corps heroes including Medal of Honor winners. Edit: Also cruisers and guided missile frigates. Medal of Honor winners that do not have ships named after them will almost certainly be honored through the naming of future combat ships. Just my opinion but I think that memorializing a hero through the naming of a combat ship is both more of an honor as well as being somewhat more appropriate than naming a support vessel after him (or in the future her). As a point of information the previous generation of replenishment oilers, the Henry J. Kaiser class were named after prominent industrialists and later rivers with the first being the Henry J. Kaiser and the last (still in service) being the Rappahannock.

 

It has everything to do with why they are being honored. The equivalent action here would be putting Billy Graham’s name on a ship. Have we done that? No. Is anyone crusading to get Billy Graham’s name on a war ship? Not that I know of.

Now if Harvey Mudd was a distinguished hero on the battlefield….that would be different IMO.

 

Gay isnt a religion, so what the hell are you even talking about. You need to put this back in the oven, because its half-baked lol.

 

I think almost any family of a MoH winning sailor would be honored to see a Navy ship named after them, whether it is a USS or USNS. We have a lot of MoH and Navy Cross winners out there from WWII, Korea, Vietnam, and OIF/OEF. Let's get ships named after them before the SecNav starts naming them for other people.

 

Do you think this is an unlawful violation of the separation of church and state?

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The base of the newest statue installed at the National Statuary Hall features a familiar verse—John 3:16.

Fittingly, the verse that was foundational to Billy Graham’s ministry for more than half a century is inscribed on the pedestal of the 7-foot statue of his likeness.

The well-known Scripture, which succinctly communicates the Gospel plan of salvation, is listed beside the same verse that’s also etched on Mr. Graham’s gravestone marker at the Billy Graham Library: “Jesus answered, ‘I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me’” (John 14:6).

The statue created by Charlotte-based artist Chas Fagan depicts Mr. Graham pointing to an open Bible. It was unveiled at a private dedication ceremony today in the U.S. Capitol with remarks from Franklin Graham and House Speaker Mike Johnson. Grammy-winner and longtime ministry friend, Michael W. Smith played “I Surrender All.” The ceremony was televised on C-SPAN.