Welcome home, fellow Gator

...to the Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

Crazy AAU fight...

Discussion in 'Nuttin' but Net' started by ArtVandelay, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida

    If you think that NBA & college officiating has gotten bad over the past 5-10 years, it's become absolutely horrific at the AAU and high school levels.

    In my experience, when things with a referee escalate to that point during the game, 99 times out of 100 it's the referees fault. Either they're frustratingly incompetent, biased, lazy, or in quite a few cases actually instigating the situation.
     
    • Informative Informative x 3
    • Wish I would have said that Wish I would have said that x 1
  3. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    Is there a situation other than a ref putting his hands on a player that would warrant that kind of action regardless of how incompetent, biased or lazy they are?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida
    Without seeing the video, I don't know what happened. But whatever did happen, I doubt it's something that just started out of nowhere. There had to be a chain of events building up to a physical melee

    and yes, in the past few years I have personally seen referees do and say things to encourage reactions and put players physical safety in jeopardy
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. cincinnatigator

    cincinnatigator GC Hall of Fame

    2,785
    753
    393
    Mar 5, 2017
    AAU ball is notorious for letting any bum off the street play. Half or more of this Chicago team are probably in some gang already and have no respect for authority. The ref obviously didn't account for this and deserved getting hit a few times to teach him a lesson of how to communicate properly. You can't talk down to players, it's an abuse of power.
     
  6. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    [​IMG]
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  7. cincinnatigator

    cincinnatigator GC Hall of Fame

    2,785
    753
    393
    Mar 5, 2017
    What part do you disagree with, Sheldon?
     
  8. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    "The ref obviously didn't account for this and deserved getting hit a few times to teach him a lesson of how to communicate properly. You can't talk down to players, it's an abuse of power."
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. cincinnatigator

    cincinnatigator GC Hall of Fame

    2,785
    753
    393
    Mar 5, 2017
    The ref can't go around challenging a player to escalate the situation especially given the situation that the game was pretty much already decided and the team was arguing between each other and their coach. It's not their job. Looks like the ref was asking for it too.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida

    After watching the video, there is no doubt that the referees had a hand in escalating the events. That tall, skinny ref in particular showed the willingness to get into a fight with a player (not to mention a minor) WAAYYYY too quickly. Even the other tall (fat) ref that came over to help, who was the tall skinny refs father went into attacking mode after trying to help for maybe 5 seconds or so.

    Not saying that they were singularly responsible but they are adults who rather than diffusing the situation with minors, chose to escalate things. Early on when that kid first swung at him, the ref did not do the right thing but instead chose to attack the kid who swung on him. Thus, he has no business being involved with youth sports.

    What I've noticed is that most refs these days want to make themselves an actual factor in the outcome of a game. Like they're actually participating rather than be a neutral arbitrator of the rules.

    But my decision would be that the coach of that team should be banned from AAU for at least a year and that two of those three refs should lose their certification for at least a year, with the tall skinny one maybe lifetime and that a few of the players from the white team should also be suspended from AAU for 2-3 years, thus ending their AAU careers.

    ****after watching again, that tall skinny ref and his father should definitely be banned from officiating for life. The son was obviously looking to enflame an already volatile situation which I doubt began with :45 seconds left on the clock. Perfect embodiment of a ref that wants to be a part of the game rather than an official.

    Looks like things would've calmed down after the first scrum when the son was pulled back but kept charging in completely unhinged and re-escalated the situation taking it to the next level.

    Then it looked like it was calming down and the father couldn't control himself from whatever the coach was saying to him.....and it all started up again

    Short fuse. Like father like son
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  11. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
  12. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    • Funny Funny x 5
  13. MtownGator

    MtownGator GC Hall of Fame

    2,683
    341
    128
    Sep 1, 2012
    Memphis,Tn
    What a mess. Way to ruin a perfectly fun game.
     
  14. NitroSmoke

    NitroSmoke GC Hall of Fame

    8,134
    49
    218
    Apr 9, 2007
    This happened right up the road from my house. Lake Point is also a major destination for baseball's Perfect Game organization, and the fields are right across the street from this gym. This week they have 408 16U travel baseball teams playing in a national tournament. We play out there quite a bit and used the facility for practice all last season. This isnt a huge shock to anyone around here as we've all seen stuff like this happen more and more often. Ive seen multiple fights in the parking lots as the AAU teams filed out of that gym following games.

    But to say this is just an AAU problem is short sighted. I saw a full on brawl during a 17U baseball tournament and one of the kids' dad was yelling "HELL YEAH!!! Kick that kids ass Nick!!!!" as his kid was pummeling a MUCH smaller player he sucker punched from the side. There was very little effort by any parents to try and control the situation - and the 2 umpires had absolutely no chance once it kicked off.

    Its a parenting problem and I dont see it getting any better. There is a general lack of respect from players towards adults even at my age group - 14U. If I had talked to an adult like some of these kids do ----- my dad would have yanked me up and made sure I understood the deal. And left zero chance that there was any confusion.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  15. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida

    What kind of action by whom? Sorry, I don't understand the question....
     
  16. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    Correct me if I am wrong, but you said the refs "deserved" to get punched. I was asking if talking down to them was enough of a reason for the players to punch/jump the refs or would the refs have to initiate the contact?
     
  17. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida
    I never said that anyone deserved to get punched......I said that they most likely had a hand in instigating the situation for it to get where it went. That doesn't justify or excuse it. But at the same time, that ref doesn't have clean hands and should be punished.

    From watching the video and reading the story from a few of the witnesses, that situation was already tense. A good official knows how to diffuse the situation or at least not make it any worse.

    That ref blew a ridiculous foul with 45 seconds left with the game already in hand with something like a 12-14 point lead. The kid that the foul was called on then mouthed off and the ref blew a tech. The kid was then walking back to the bench and bumped the ref (I'm sure mouthing something) and the ref IMMEDIATELY turned and put up his fists.

    Inexcusable action by the ref no matter what that kid did or said. There is no reason for an adult who is charged as being a superior/supervisor to ever put up his fists and challenge a minor to physical confrontation.

    Once he did that, then at that point, you can say that the refed deserved to get punched as he's the one that took it to that level. But even in the events leading up, assuming based on what I saw in those clips, that is a ref that wants to be part of the action of the game outside the scope of what a referees duties are. There is a very clear difference between a participant and officiate.

    Too many refs today do not understand the difference between the two.

    Either way, an individual like that should never be officiating sports, let alone youth sports.
     
  18. ArtVandelay

    ArtVandelay GC Hall of Fame

    5,315
    723
    248
    Dec 19, 2011
    South Florida
    In the same post that you say "I never said that anyone deserved to get punched", you also say "Once he did that, then at that point, he definitely deserved to get punched as he's the one that took it to that level."

    That was my question. I am not sure where you saw him put up his fists. To me it looks like after they made physical contact. Maybe defensive.

    I agree with you that the refs certainly have some fault here, but I can't see any justification for the players punching and jumping him. Crowding around 5 to 1.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  19. madgator

    madgator GC Hall of Fame

    10,981
    669
    688
    May 28, 2007
    South Florida

    Because I never said that anyone deserves to get punched.....in a vacuum. But if you watch the third video on the page, you will see where the player shoulders the ref as he walks by and the ref IMMEDIATELY squares up on the kid.

    at that point, that vacuum no longer exists. if the ref gets punched, it's the result of where he took it
     
  20. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

    12,816
    1,678
    698
    Apr 8, 2007
    northern MN
    This is just pathetic all around. A bunch of people who do not deserve the privilege of organized athletic competition. Circumstances or not, kick 'em all out for good. You want to fight, join the MMA or whatever it's called.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Wish I would have said that Wish I would have said that x 1