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Coronavirus in the United States - news and thoughts

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by GatorNorth, Feb 25, 2020.

  1. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    I don't see any exemption here for having had chickenpox or measles previously.

    Exemption from Required Immunizations | Florida Department of Health
     
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  2. prisch1

    prisch1 Freshman

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    I think part of the problem-I've been guilty--is the idea of herd immunity and covid basically being gone. I'm pro vaccine, but anti-mandate. I definitely thought if enough got vaccinated we could get to herd immunity. I guess the definition for the term can differ, but it's pretty clear from the England and Israel data we will never get to herd immunity with vaccinations. Their ability to prevent Sars-Cov-2 is definitely less than 90%, but their ability to limit actual illness is still a very big positive and makes the vaccine a good idea for a large number of people.

    But considering the vaccine wanes in efficacy, isn't sterilizing (prevents you from catching and spreading Sars-Cov-2), and the studies that show naturally acquired immunity is at least as protective of the vaccine and likely more protective the lack of opt out of a vaccine for recovered people makes little public health or personal health sense to me.

    Now that doesn't mean if you're 50 and not vaccinated you should go try and get COVID to get natural immunity, but for a 20 year old. They are probably better off protection wise.
     
  3. WESGATORS

    WESGATORS Moderator VIP Member

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    "the child's physician must state in writing, the reasons for exemption based on valid clinical reasoning or evidence"

    It's a legitimate medical exemption.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
     
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  4. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

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    northern MN
    A few hundred thousand lives
     
  5. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

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    What is the robustness and duration of immunity for people who have contracted Covid?
     
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  6. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    The full paragraph, emphasis mine:
    Having had measles isn't a reason why a child cannot be fully immunized.
     
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  7. ncargat1

    ncargat1 VIP Member

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  8. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    latest pier reviewed study says that reinfection can occur within 3 months and has a median risk of infection within 16 months. thsi is based on antibody degradation from previous sars-covid viruses, not covid 19 and not considering deviations

    COVID-19: How long will 'natural immunity' last? (medicalnewstoday.com)

    A team from Yale School of Public Health in New Haven, CT, and the University of North Carolina at Charlotte looked at the genes of 177 coronaviruses known to affect humans. The researchers then determined which were the closest viral relatives of SARS-CoV-2.

    They identified five viruses that met this criterion. They included SARS-CoV, responsible for the SARS outbreak in 2003, and MERS-CoV, which was first detected in 2012. They also included viruses that cause the common cold. The researchers then analyzed existing data on how antibody levels decline over time — from 128 days to 28 years after infection. They also looked at the risk of reinfection at different antibody levels for those viruses.

    Using this information, they predicted that natural immunity conferred by contracting SARS-CoV-2 would likely last less than half as long as the immunity due to contracting related coronaviruses. They found that reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 in people who had not received a vaccine could occur as soon as 3 months after initial infection, with a median risk of reinfection within 16 months, under endemic conditions.

    then you need to consider how many infected actually went through seroconversion. Current evidence is the less symptomatic and the lwoer viral load exposure, the less likely that you actually achieved immunity. Just having tested positive for covid doesn't guarantee that you had a significant enough to gain immunity from a larger viral exposure event or from a variant.

    What is Seroconversion? (news-medical.net)

    In their recent research on a cohort of diverse populations, published in January 2021, the authors found that a significant proportion of COVID-19 patients took three to six weeks for antibodies to be generated, and 2-8% of patients did not have detectable antibodies 60 days post-infection. They also found that certain variables affected seroconversion, such as older individuals being more likely to seroconvert and non-white individuals showing higher antibody concentrations.

    Jiang et al. carried out a study on antibody seroconversion in asymptomatic and symptomatic COVID-19 patients, obtaining results that suggested IgG and IgM levels post-infection were lower in those who had experience asymptomatic disease.

    A recent study by Masía et al. in January 2021 found a correlation between viral load and time taken for seroconversion. A higher peak viral load (SARS-CoV-2 RNA levels) was linked to earlier antibody detection, and low viral load in the initial stages of infection was observed in patients who lacked certain antibodies post-infection. These findings suggest that adaptive humoral immune response could be dependent on viral replication intensity.

    The same study found that some patients did not develop antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 and that most of these showed a very low virological profile, suggesting that a low viral load of SARS-CoV-2 may not be enough to stimulate adaptive humoral immunity.
     
  9. tilly

    tilly Superhero Mod. Fast witted. Bulletproof posts. Moderator VIP Member

    Selfish! ;)
     
  10. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    can you say union sympathy tour? this is planned PR stuff
     
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  11. WESGATORS

    WESGATORS Moderator VIP Member

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    From the CDC: You do not need to get the chickenpox vaccine if you have evidence of immunity against the disease.

    Chickenpox Vaccination: What Everyone Should Know | CDC

    Also from the CDC: Laboratory evidence of immunity or laboratory confirmation of disease

    Chickenpox for HCPs

    CDC says the same thing about Measles, Mumps, and Rubella.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
     
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  12. tilly

    tilly Superhero Mod. Fast witted. Bulletproof posts. Moderator VIP Member

    I feel sorry for people who think they have broad minds but actually have very narrow ones. What a sad life.
    95 hates trump and is pro vax for all adults. That's pretty much where I fit in. Others here too. How does that make us "uneducated twits" that want "Trump reinstated". (Hint: we didnt vote for him to start with.)

    What an ignorant view of the world. I imagine you fancy yourself as tolerant and progressive too. :rolleyes:
     
  13. tilly

    tilly Superhero Mod. Fast witted. Bulletproof posts. Moderator VIP Member

    Link?
     
  14. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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  15. WESGATORS

    WESGATORS Moderator VIP Member

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    I'm not even trying to make the point that they are equal. But it has come up about why are people responding differently to this vaccine than to other vaccine requirements. In my observations, this is a factor. There's a lot of newness here; and some people prefer a more conservative approach while others do not. And some people's idea of a "conservative approach" is radically different than another's. In 10 years from now, we'll be able to look back and say either "yeah, that wasn't necessary" or "glad we got started with the vaccine efforts early" - whatever; the sad reality is that politics will continue to lead the way. A dissenting view will lead to name-calling and someone either being called a freedom-hater or anti-science (and that's just when people are being nice!). I just wish we could all step back and recognize that we're still learning a lot as we go. People are going to have different views.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
     
  16. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    Given all this saying that natural immunity is better than the vaccine is purely speculative and not consistently supported by the evidence.
     
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  17. RIP

    RIP Election Prediction Savant Premium Member

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    I've never had chicken pox either (39). I should probably look into the vaccines.
     
  18. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    lol..union, let's release a statement confirming that we sent laid off firefighters out to feed homeless and alerted press so that public will put pressure on City/county commission to rehire them in spite of vaccine policy..sorry, google came up empty on that one
     
  19. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    thank you

    chickenpox an d measles immunity from reinfection is long lasting. Sars-covid viruses do not produce long lasting immunological responses based on previously known sars-covid outbreaks. see study linked above from Yale
     
  20. WESGATORS

    WESGATORS Moderator VIP Member

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    (shortened just for brevity)

    I'll be the first to admit that much of this stuff is WAY over my head. I have heard that there's more to immunity than "antibodies." I can say with confidence that I have put my immunity to the test AFTER no longer testing positive for antibodies and BEFORE I was vaccinated. Now I can't speak to whether or not I was lucky or what have you, but I was in multiple environments that counted as "exposure."

    Here's the thing, though, we are approaching 50,000,000 cases in the US. We should have an incredible amount of LIVE data points that we can follow and determine a 2nd confirmed reinfection from unvaccinated individuals. I can't think of a good reason why this data shouldn't be produced.

    Would like to see an expansion on this type of tracking (or even more localized just for the US):

    COVID-19 reinfection tracker

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS