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College Board to create socioeconomic score for SAT takers

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by GatorNorth, May 16, 2019.

  1. GatorNorth

    GatorNorth Premium Member Premium Member

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    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. rivergator

    rivergator Too Hot Mod Moderator VIP Member

    Apr 8, 2007
    That's probably valid. If a high school student from a lousy background had the same test scores and grades as my kids, for example, they've accomplished more.
     
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  3. channingcrowderhungry

    channingcrowderhungry Premium Member

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    While I like what they are attempting this isn't the solution.

    I can already point out a major major flaw in their design.

    The high school I went to was rated the #1 public high school in the country while I was there (it is now #8, slackers). It was a gifted magnet school that took the brightest students from around Jacksonville and bused them all into the poorest neighborhood in Jacksonville. So by their metrics it sounds like I would have received quite the adversity score even though I did not live in the worst neighborhood in Jax.
     
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  4. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist Premium Member

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    Interesting idea.

    Hard to tell exactly what they are doing from that description, but obviously your school's zipcode wouldn't be informative on its own. It does say "and neighborhood", so that might help mitigate this issue, depending on what that means.
     
  5. rivergator

    rivergator Too Hot Mod Moderator VIP Member

    Apr 8, 2007
    it's not clear if they're talking about the neighborhood where the school is or the neighborhood where the student lives.
     
  6. channingcrowderhungry

    channingcrowderhungry Premium Member

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    Maybe they will mitigate the issue somehow, but my school was literally between the two worst streets in Jacksonville, in the highest poverty/worst crime rate neighborhood in Jacksonville. But the #1 public High School in the country.
     
  7. channingcrowderhungry

    channingcrowderhungry Premium Member

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    reading that quote again it looks like they may be talking about both.
     
  8. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    I was going to make a similar point as we have two of the best elementary schools in the state of Florida. Magnet schools that do the same thing.

    Now being elementary the example does not hold like yours.

    The sad part is we may actually destroy what they have built. The new superintendent has been a disaster and now they no longer test to get in. I can tell you there is a distinct difference in my second graders class and the new kindergarten class.

    Right now my 5th grader is finishing up a three day two night trip to Tallahassee with her class. No parents allowed. The itinerary was crazy. They were at the school before 6am on Tuesday and I got a text with them still at the planetarium after 8:30 from a day that included stops all over the place. Full day yesterday and back later this afternoon. Can’t say enough good things about the teachers and staff who were willing to spend the middle of a school week away from their families to give these kids an experience most will not get.
     
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  9. wrpgator

    wrpgator GC Hall of Fame

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    From the link:

    “An adversity score of 50 is average. Anything above it designates hardship, below it privilege.”

    [The adversity score was conceived in response to state laws and court rulings against race-based affirmative action in education.]
    “The purpose is to get to race without using race,” said Anthony Carnevale, director of Georgetown University’s Center on Education and the Workforce. Mr. Carnevale formerly worked for the College Board and oversaw the 'Strivers' program.

    At Florida State University, the adversity scores helped the school boost nonwhite enrollment to 42% from 37% in the incoming freshman class, said John Barnhill, assistant vice president for academic affairs at Florida State University. He said he expects pushback from parents whose children go to well-to-do high schools as well as guidance counselors there.

    “If I am going to make room for more of the [poor and minority] students we want to admit and I have a finite number of spaces, then someone has to suffer and that will be privileged kids on the bubble,” he said.
     
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  10. swampbabe

    swampbabe GC Hall of Fame

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    They already include a school profile along with the transcript for college applications. This includes demographic data, free and reduced price lunch info among other pieces of information. Not sure that this does anything that adds to the picture.
     
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  11. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 Premium Member

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    My high school was the same. International Baccalaureate program at Pensacola High School. I was definitely a minority in the hallways but most of the students in my classes were white and from my socioeconomic background.
     
  12. Gotitsussed

    Gotitsussed Sophomore

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    Everybody knew this is taking place at UF and elsewhere. We’ve all heard stories about incredible kids not getting accepted. Schools have kept this behind the curtain to avoid pressure including legal @ction. It seems the schools had to come up with something to defend their affirmative action type of admissions process. Now the SAT will unlevel the playing field in order to level the playing field. FSU admissions director takes it too far in his commentary and ends up looking bad IMO.

    SAT to Give Students ‘Adversity Score’ to Capture Social and Economic Background
     
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  13. The_RH_Factor

    The_RH_Factor GC Legend

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    Schools will let in minorities who really don’t qualify to get federal funding, but that doesn’t mean they’ll graduate down the road.

    That is, until they start being required to give them a degree to “make it fair.”
     
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  14. citygator

    citygator Premium Member

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    Your fears don’t describe the article

    1. There was no race used in their ‘adversity score’ from what I see.
    2. SAT score isn’t affected it’s just providing a measure of the adversity a student’s background entailed.
    3. Good kids get excluded from schools all the time for various reasons with one being simply luck.
    4. You provide no proof/link of what is happening at UF
    5. FSU quote accurately said that if you give credit for people facing the hardships of poor families and poor schools then minorities are helped and “on the bubble” affluent kids are hurt.

    Tough to be fair and admit the best when the playing field isn’t level. How do you break the cycle?
     
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  15. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Good.
     
  16. Balbanes

    Balbanes Premium Member

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    Here, this video will help. Watch it to the end.



    What that score does is let the kids who haven't taken any steps forward take a few. At least in the metaphor that the video puts forward.

    I'm also a big fan of the adversity score, and a career professional in higher education.
     
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  17. Balbanes

    Balbanes Premium Member

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    Hardly anyone admits minorities to "get federal funding." This is a myth.

    It's true that black students graduate at the lowest rates, followed by hispanic students. Part of this is underrepresentation among faculty/administration, part is economics, part is lack of support that is relevant/applicable to them and their life... Among other issues.

    The best schools have invested tons of money into support mechanisms specifically for minority students. Typically, when minority students have support mechanisms tailored specifically to their needs, paired with intrusive-advising style services, the gap closes quite a bit. "Manufacturing" degrees for minorities is not necessary and absolutely risks accreditation.
     
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  18. gatorpika

    gatorpika Premium Member

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    I didn't even know you needed some kind of score to get into FSU.
     
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  19. rivergator

    rivergator Too Hot Mod Moderator VIP Member

    Apr 8, 2007
    any evidence that is true? sounds doubtful.
     
  20. Balbanes

    Balbanes Premium Member

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    State and federal funding is based on total enrollment typically. FTE = full-time enrolled equivalent. For undergrads, 12 credits per semester is considered full-time. If you have 10k students and half are enrolled half-time then your funding is based on 7500 FTE.

    Less and less of the funding sources are coming from the federal and state level, and more is coming from tuition (which is why tuition rates have been going up, as the govt hasn't invested more in the higher Ed. Sector).

    Colleges/universities can apply for grants, but these are typically either to fund specific programs and they have strict criteria, or they fund student "scholarships."

    At least in Florida, and to my knowledge, state and federal funds are not tied to ethnicity in any way. Grants can be, but are almost always strictly supervised/managed.