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Carrier Employees, Soon to Be Laid Off, Feel Betrayed by Donald Trump

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by fastsix, Jan 11, 2018.

  1. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    Maybe they can get one of those 7-eleven jobs, or perhaps Walmart will hire them at $11/hour.

    Carrier Employees, Soon to Be Laid Off, Feel Betrayed by Trump

    Last night, at Sully’s Bar & Grill, which sits across the street from the Carrier Corporation’s furnace plant, on the west side of Indianapolis, and serves as the de-facto company bar, two of Carrier’s soon-to-be-laid-off longtime employees had a drink and talked about how they got there. Today, the profitable H.V.A.C. company, owned by United Technologies Corporation—a federal contractor whose climate, controls, and security division, of which Carrier is a part, reported three billion dollars in operating profit in 2016—is letting go of more than two hundred employees in its second and final wave of Indiana-based layoffs, which began last July. In total, the company will be laying off more than five hundred employees as it moves manufacturing jobs to Monterrey, Mexico. Many of those employees voted for Donald Trump, who made saving Carrier’s “big, beautiful plant” one of his most repeated campaign promises. It was part of his broader pre-election claim that “A Trump Administration will stop the jobs from leaving America.”

    That promise is the main reason that the soon-to-be ex-Carrier employees Renee Elliott and Duane Oreskovic voted for Trump, they told me yesterday. Elliott, a divorced mother of two who will turn forty-five next week, and Oreskovic, who is thirty-eight and single, both earned nearly eighteen dollars an hour making A90 furnaces at Carrier, where they worked their way up from entry-level jobs over the past five years. Neither possesses a college degree, and their jobs afforded them middle-class lives: Elliott is paying a mortgage on a house in Indianapolis, and Oreskovic said that he “could go out and enjoy myself when I wanted, play some pool.” When Carrier announced the planned layoffs, in February of 2016, on what many employees soon began calling “D Day,” their financial futures suddenly came into question. Then, in the run-up to the election, Trump seemed to offer a solution, with his tough talk about stopping the flow of American jobs to other countries, including Mexico.

    “We took him serious,” Elliott said, tearing up as she sat in a booth at Sully’s, “because he did seem to be an entrepreneur. He knew this offshoring shit was gonna go down, and ‘I’m not gonna stand for it’ is the way he made it sound. Hillary never said a word to us or about us. Obama never flew Air Force One to our facility, like he did to one in Elkhart, Indiana, when he was campaigning. I thought, This man is not gonna be anybody’s puppet.” Elliott went on, “It was an easy vote for me. Not just because of ‘The Apprentice.’ We believed in him here at Carrier. The vast majority of us. It was Trump deluxe in there. I told people, ‘He’s gonna find a cause somewhere. He’s gonna be a savior.’ Little did I know the cause was gonna be us.”

    Elliott, who plans to file for unemployment insurance, doesn’t think that anything can save her job now, at what she called “the eleventh hour.” Still, she said that she wouldn’t be silent about “the two hundred and sixty-one families affected this week.” And the area businesses, too. “The Chinese restaurant on the corner,” she said. “The Quick Stop. This place, Sully’s. After a shift, especially on the nights, it looks like a ‘Gin and Juice’ video, a Snoop Dogg video here: we’re all outside shooting dice, playing cards, drinking, visiting, commiserating. We were really a family. It’s not just that I’m a lost paycheck away from homeless now. I will never find a job like this one again.”
     
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  2. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    If I’m not mistaken this is the final layoff of those planned back in July 2017?

    Initially Carrier was going to transfer all the jobs to Mexico. Trump stepped in and saved 800, some say as much as a 1000. There are still 1100 workers left at the plant.

    Isn’t saving 800 jobs better than none? Hopefully the other 300 will be able to stay.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1022504001
     
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  3. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Absolutely not! Typically "saved" jobs cost tax payers 3 times what the worker gets paid. They of course hiked prices right after the "deal" was made. This. Is. Welfare.
     
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  4. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    I'm a heartless, capitalist pig that does not care about working people, they say.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  5. G. Gordon Gator

    G. Gordon Gator GC Hall of Fame

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    Renee Elliott and Duane Oreskovic. Those are the Carrier employees who feel betrayed by Donald Trump. Because try as he might, he hasn't been able to force Carrier not to relocate most of its manufacturing operations to Mexico. “Trump saved some jobs,” Elliott insisted. “He didn’t save mine, but he did save some.”

    I'd like to say that Carrier's U.S. sales are going to suffer for the dishonest way they pretended to be more receptive than they really were to President Trump's entreaties to keep jobs here. But that might be offset by the liberals who will be sure to choose Carrier for their HVAC needs if Trump calls the company out and criticizes it. Because...

    [​IMG]
     
  6. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    [​IMG]
     
  7. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    [​IMG]
     
  8. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    [​IMG]
     
  9. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Get your head outta your ass, I say.

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    Saved half the jobs for 10 years using incentives worth about 7 million. Article says Carrier has replayed some of the incentives. How much who knows?

    I see this as damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

    Spend money to save jobs = corporate welfare.

    Let people be laid off from moving manufacturing to Mexico = Trump doesn’t care about workers.

    Trumps base is workers.

    So guess what? Spend money trying to save the jobs of his supporters.
     
  11. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Losing your job sucks, but your life isn't over. Do what it takes to find a new job that pays well. Adapt and survive.
     
  12. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    The primary cost is via higher prices for air conditioners & that includes those other than Carrier.
     
  13. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    So you are saying what Trump did with Carrier has increased the cost of A/C products from all makers?

    Seriously????
     
  14. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    So the basic contention about trade and the effect upon jobs is simply wrong. But we can also run this the other way around. Economists say that trade is positive sum. Thus protection which reduces trade must be negative sum. That is, it makes people poorer. And that is indeed the case as this from Mark Parry shows:
    The way to read this is left to right (so unusual for our system of writing, eh?). Yes, protectionism has a cost to consumers. And it also has a benefit to producers--producers including those who don't have to go looking for another job. If protectionism were a positive sum game then the losses to consumers would be lower than the gains to producers. If protectionism is a negative sum game then the losses are of course larger than the gains. And if the losses are larger than the gains then the process as a whole makes us all in aggregate poorer.


    https://www.forbes.com/sites/timwor...ut-whats-the-cost-per-job-saved/#4588884b2ee9


    [​IMG]
     
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  15. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    That's exactly what I am saying.
     
  16. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    Lol ^^^^^^^
     
  17. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Sorry. But, it is about as basic as economics gets. Different brands of ACs are (usually imperfect) substitutes; hence, when the price of one good goes up demand for the other goes up. When demand for the other goes up, it increases its price. It's called the cross-price elasticity of demand.
     
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  18. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    What makes you think Carrier is the bomb with the others being substitutes?

    How about Trane, Lenox, Amana, Goodman?

    http://www.toptenreviews.com/home/hvac/best-central-air-conditioning-units/

    I’ve bought numerous ACs over the past 15 years and never paid close to list price. It’s called negotiation just like when you buy a vehicle.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  19. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    one does not have to be the bomb. If a Trane is a sub for a Carrier than a Carrier is a sub for a Trane. & no this does not need to be the case for every consumer.
     
  20. homer

    homer GC Legend

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    What Trump did with Carrier has no effect with the other brands. Cost of suppliers and labor does.

    Admit it. You just don’t like Trump.