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A history lesson for those of you suddenly sour on Dan.

Discussion in 'RayGator's Swamp Gas' started by tilly, Jan 4, 2021.

  1. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Franks played against Miami (who finished 6-7), UT Martin, and Kentucky (8-5, 3-5 in SEC play). Trask played the harder part of the season, including three top-10 opponents (Auburn, LSU, and Georgia), and a top-25 (Virginia) in the bowl game. Even Tennessee (8-5) was 5-3 in SEC play. Statistically speaking, you would expect Franks to have better numbers against inferior competition if they were similar in abilities.
     
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  2. nolancarey

    nolancarey GC Hall of Fame

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    I think Trask is night and day better than Franks (everyone does now), but Franks did show his better numbers against said inferior competition. Franks was losing against Kentucky at the time, but he hadn't lost a game since he was benched during Mizzou the previous year. He was a moderately good starter on a winning streak and he was popular. It's hard to bench a person who has the locker room. As much as people were rightly saying that Franks threw to his first option all the time and had questionable decision-making, he was on track to be Florida's first 3,000 yard passer since 2007. I think it is likely that we would have lost that Kentucky game had he not been injured, and maybe more games than just LSU and UGA after, but I can't know it for a fact. But I also think it likely that we may have lost more games if Franks was benched after Miami or halfway through the Kentucky game--but I can't know that for a fact either. Teammates rallied around Trask when Franks went down, but I don't know if they would have done the same if Franks was sitting on the bench at the beginning or middle of the Kentucky game. If Trask hadn't been injured in practice after the Mizzou game in 2018 I don't think we'd be having this discussion about the detriment of Mullen's loyalty, but circumstance is what it is. Sometimes it's just hard to bench the guy who had the "Heave to Cleve", even when he goes with his first read too often.
     
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  3. SewaneeGator

    SewaneeGator GC Hall of Fame

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    I disagree, but that's ok. I was more clear earlier that it wasn't intended to be a perfect analog, just a push back from the hindsight critique of how a "Heisman finalist" could possibly be held back on the bench. With my memory not what I hoped it was, the 93 parallel is less clear than I remembered, but I do think it still works in the broad strokes. 94 too, considering Terry, despite his inconsistencies of the previous season, was the obvious choice to start that next year. But not only wouldn't he finish 94, backup Danny would come in 3rd for the Heisman (higher than Trask) the very next season.
     
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  4. thale410

    thale410 GC Hall of Fame

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    About as sane/accurate a read on the situation as there is.

    To add to the overall argument, the offense's output in 2018/2019 was basically identical with the ups and downs and two different QBs. Trask certainly wasn't an obvious H-man candidate after his 2019 performance.

    Seems we should be praising a coach for patching together an offense and winning a bunch of games with two decent QBs, and then adapting the offense and maximizing a guy's potential and getting him into the Heisman mix in his second year starting.

    Instead we are ascribing some asinine blame toward a coach with as impeccable a track record as offensive guru and QB developer par excellence as there is in CFB.

    If you want to rip CDM about not jettisoning TG at the end of this season, that's certainly arguable. But all this criticism of how he's handled the offense and QBs is just bib and a helmet kind of stupid.
     
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  5. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I don't disagree with the conclusion, but I was saying that you can't make a statistical argument that one QB was better than the other without factoring in the level of competition.
     
  6. nolancarey

    nolancarey GC Hall of Fame

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    Oh, of course. It's just impossible to put oneself in a place of retroactive prognostication. The numbers being what they were when Franks went down, it wasn't precisely a removable infraction. With the caveat that he wasn't passing the eye test for many.
     
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  7. malscott

    malscott Premium Member

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    Dan is the man. Few tweaks, he could be even better. More recruits, some better coaches-

    Go Gators.
     
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  8. wargunfan

    wargunfan GC Hall of Fame

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    Inside your head.
    Thank you for making my point. It is the unrealistic and entitled expectations of immature "fans" that play a large role in making top tier coaches think twice about coming to Florida. I don't give a rip for the fan bases of other schools except to say that these crybabies are a pox on the their schools as well.
    The surest way to go back to the coaching carousel of Muschamp and MacElwain and their types is to show the coaching community that one down season and the fan base at Florida will be after your job. That is why Florida is always hiring their third or fourth choice for head coach. The very best ones won't consider taking the job. They use the Florida job as leverage to get a better deal at another school.
    If CDM were to leave that would further convince the best coaching prospects that Florida is a career killer. Some folks just can't see the forest for the trees.
     
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  9. GameTime1

    GameTime1 GC Hall of Fame

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    I dont think UF is always hiring their 3rd or 4th choice. Career killer? Who were the best prospects that UF killed? Aside from possibly bobby stoops, who is leveraging UF?
     
  10. MaceoP

    MaceoP GC Hall of Fame

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    He didn't make your point. He said Florida's fanbase is no different than any other top tier school. High expectations, lots of resources, high salaries.
    I would offer 3 solutions. 1) Have the mods use much stricter guidelines to control what you would perceive as 'immature, negative comments' 2) Have all sports / football forums shut down 3) Don't participate in threads like these.
     
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  11. DieAGator

    DieAGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Right. Agree. Maybe there are some behind-the-scenes, never discussed in public policies or conduct expectations that make UF more difficult to recruit- nuances experienced coaches know matter but people like me are not aware of.

    Maybe five years ago facilities were a detriment, although our facilities amd environment would likely have been better than whomever we were discussing the position with were accustomed to.

    But other than that what worthy candidate wouldn’t have taken the job? “I would have accepted UF’s offer were it not for the overly critical Swamp Gas contingent.” .... “I love my job at Mehbraska though.”
     
  12. OB1

    OB1 GC Legend

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    Glad we finally got the Michigan monkey off our back! Those Outback bowl losses were painful.
     
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  13. g8orbill

    g8orbill Old Gator Moderator

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    based upon this thread, it is going to be a long off season
     
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  14. MaceoP

    MaceoP GC Hall of Fame

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    This forum is no different than everything else in life. Some want to put people in boxes. Either they are 'entitled fans' or 'sunshine pumpers' according to some. I guess it's hard for some to fathom that many here are just interested in all things Gators and they are interested in discussing the state of the program. (Not directed at you Bill ) :)
     
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  15. Bushmaster

    Bushmaster GC Hall of Fame

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    Some of you think you are more important than you are.

    Let's see, UF coach makes $6 million a year and he gives a shit what some anonymous internet poster on some irrelevant message board thinks about his decision to keep Todd Grantham. Yeah, that's believable.
     
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  16. robertgator

    robertgator GC Legend

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    Mullen may not have picked the perfect QB to start at some point or other -- but i don't know, man, one can usually look back in hindsight and seemingly make a better decision based on future knowledge. Anyone who's made decisions for a large group or team or org knows that no matter which way you go, you'll always have some complainers. Real easy to complain about someone else's decisions.

    If you're spending a lot of time complaining or second guessing Mullen's qb talent evaluations, you should probably review the resume.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2021
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  17. robertgator

    robertgator GC Legend

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    The Spurrier vs Mullen QB choices are interesting though!

    I sorta default to thinking, Spurrier is the better passing co-ordinator and better qb coach. But some interesting facts:

    Spurrier QB's have (I assume) better passing numbers generally speaking.

    Mullen's QB's have had more (Much more?) success in the NFL.

    Spurrier had a much quicker hook.

    Mullen a little bit more "loyal" to the starter. Maybe that's a fault. Maybe not?

    Spurrier had many more championships -- though Mullen is still youngish. We shall see. I hope Dan put's it together so he gets a lot closer there!

    Comparing their d-coaching styles would be interesting, also. Spurrier again quicker to pull the hook. Passing defense often a problem. Spurrier sent RB's to db's to help, said he was going to help coach. He certainly called out the D more than Mullen. I do think I wish Mullen was more active or more obviously active in getting the D coached up better.

    Oh well, Go Gators!
     
  18. hoyt233

    hoyt233 GC Hall of Fame

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    Prattvile, AL-Go Lions!
    You do know that SS reads all the sports forums on GC and gleans all the great ideas so he can do his job. LOL.
     
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  19. 4everaGator

    4everaGator GC Hall of Fame

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    That right there reminded me of how Tebow would fire up the D on the sidelines at crucial times.
     
  20. charlie

    charlie Freshman

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    The only true debacle was the LSU game, TAM game defense did not show up along with a late fumble, and BAMA was just better however we were competitive.
     
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