Welcome home, fellow Gator.

The Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

Harbaugh Formula = Investigation/Suspension?

Discussion in 'RayGator's Swamp Gas' started by gainesvillegreen44, Nov 27, 2022.

  1. gainesvillegreen44

    gainesvillegreen44 All American

    462
    354
    1,868
    Nov 5, 2015
    Omnipresent
    Watching the Ohio state fan gave me a little hope. It took Harbaugh 6 years to reach this level. At times they looked confused about their identity, couldn’t generate a consistent pass game, great recruiting but lost a few every year…. After they went 8-5 you heard some grumbling about whether he could get it done but it looks like he’s gotten there.
    Strong zone run game, use of TE’s and then deep shots to wide open receivers when the defense sells out to stop the run… looks like a formula to win - even against pass happy offenses.
    It took him 6 years- if Billy goes 8-5 - 10-3 over the next 4-5 years will we be ok with that to wait and see a breakthrough? Idk. I’m of the opinion that it’s both talent/execution AND in-game coaching that have to improve. But I think it has at Michigan. Gonna be a long 6 years.
     
    • Like Like x 9
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Winner Winner x 1
  2. bposs

    bposs GC Hall of Fame

    2,042
    455
    1,923
    Sep 3, 2010
    Woodstock, GA
    But, can Gator fans wait that long? There are some that are already questioning BN abilities as a coach. Not me, I will give him time to build the program he wants to build.
     
    • Agree Agree x 23
    • Like Like x 3
  3. tegator80

    tegator80 GC Hall of Fame

    12,618
    20,884
    3,363
    May 29, 2007
    Richmond, VA
    To me, the winning formula is...patience. And I don't see it in this fan base. The Year 1 posts were telling. I get the fatigue but still, Napier isn't Bell, a legacy, and so he has a leash. Chip Kelly looks like he is the next long-term outlook coach to finally turn the corner, but even if he was the buzz hire when we went after him, he would not have lasted here.
     
    • Agree Agree x 11
    • Like Like x 2
    • Winner Winner x 2
  4. tommyvee

    tommyvee GC Hall of Fame

    14,920
    8,497
    3,293
    May 16, 2007
    We have a much tougher schedule. Just look at recruiting rankings and with OU and Texas coming into the league, it’s not getting any easier. Michigan has one team that out recruits them to beat each year. We have 3-4 teams ahead of us, even if we are consistently Top 5 every year.

    Of course we need to get into that #1 spot and the rest will take care of itself. IIRC McElwain had the #1 class going into the season where he got canned. So it can be done.
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 2
    • Winner Winner x 2
  5. gator_annarbor

    gator_annarbor Senior

    243
    74
    1,653
    Nov 9, 2019
    He proved it works at Stanford and NFL. That demands some patience
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  6. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

    29,523
    54,266
    3,503
    Apr 8, 2007
    northern MN
    Ha . . . how many people on this board panned Harbaugh? Claiming that he couldn't coach. His style wouldn't work. He was a loser, etc. The best was the notion that we were lucky to have McElwain. This isn't aimed at the OP; I'm just pointing out the fickle nature of cfb fans. Harbaugh is and has always been one heck of a football coach.
     
    • Agree x 9
    • Winner x 2
    • Like x 1
    • Optimistic x 1
    • Wish I would have said that x 1
  7. 96Gatorcise

    96Gatorcise GC Hall of Fame

    14,592
    25,736
    3,363
    Aug 6, 2008
    Tampa
    They were talking during the broadcast that he completely reinvented himself and the team the past 2 yrs. In the middle years he tried to turn UM into a OSU and it didn't work.
    He went back to what he knew when he was hired. Talked to his brother and brought in the Baltimore Ravens defensive philosophy. And now you see the results on the field.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Off-topic Off-topic x 1
  8. GatorLuke

    GatorLuke GC Legend

    944
    1,088
    2,048
    Apr 3, 2007
    Florida
    It’s really only a handful of fans who just don’t have patience and have irrational outbursts after a loss. When I look back at this season I see a very difficult SEC schedule against QB’s who had lots of experience and 7 of our 12 games were against a team ranked at the time of the game or are ranked now. We beat 2 of them. Vandy really is the eye sore this year but like I’ve said, that game was cursed and we don’t have the talent to overcome cursed games yet. Yes there were some head scratching calls and yes it seems like Napes struggled with clock management and adjustments. He took over a bad roster, lost 3 possible starters from the defense to the portal (Bogle, Diabate, Hopper) and brought in 3 of our most talented players with Pearsall, Torrence and Johnson. Defense notably struggled this year and at times we had 3-5 true freshman on the field getting experience (Wilson, Mitchell, McCllelan, James all look legit). Win the bowl game, finish with a top 5 recruiting class and go find 3-4 more starters from the portal. We are on our way. Go Gators.
     
    • Like Like x 7
    • Winner Winner x 2
  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    Jan 5, 2022
    For it shouldn’t have to take 6 years, see Nick, Urban, Kirby and now Brian Kelly, notwithstanding LSU’s embarrassing loss to A&M last night.
     
  10. gainesvillegreen44

    gainesvillegreen44 All American

    462
    354
    1,868
    Nov 5, 2015
    Omnipresent


    this. This is the tell. Will Napier pull a harbaugh/saban and be self critical, bring in coordinators that can make key improvements…Napier has said openly he takes a red pen during the off-season to things that don’t work. The PA naked rollout and WR screen have got to go. A quick pass game has to be installed to give QB easy throws and take pressure off the run game, the middle 8 and clock management have got to improve, route tree has to get better… that is all WITH improved accuracy of QB, improved talent, emergence of TE so we aren’t playing 9 dudes in 12 personnel…. If Billy has some self awareness ala Harbaugh- we can get there.
    As far as the fan base- every fan base is critical. Gator fans have PTSD because they have been told during 3 straight regimes by half the fan base and most of the media “it’s working, be patient, you don’t know what you’re talking about, you’re too critical” only to find out it was not working. When that happens for 12 years - it’s hard to believe “oh this is the time it’s gonna work”. It seems we have 3 groups of Gators and they are tearing at one another. I’m not sure how to parse out - the fans that are too critical vs the fans that are reasonably critical vs the fans that are saying everything is fine all the time.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2022
    • Like Like x 2
    • Best Post Ever Best Post Ever x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  11. 96Gatorcise

    96Gatorcise GC Hall of Fame

    14,592
    25,736
    3,363
    Aug 6, 2008
    Tampa
    It took Kirby 6 yrs to win a NC. Urban burned out twice and Kelly didn't win anything at ND and too early to tell at LSU.
    Saban was already an NC coach when he got to Bama.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Disagree Bacon! Disagree Bacon! x 1
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
    • Creative Creative x 1
  12. 96Gatorcise

    96Gatorcise GC Hall of Fame

    14,592
    25,736
    3,363
    Aug 6, 2008
    Tampa
    I doubt any coaching changes will happen going into next year. BN is still building a culture and foundation. If things don't improve, yr 3 will see coaching changes.
     
  13. rmonteag

    rmonteag GC Hall of Fame

    1,450
    1,250
    1,983
    Jul 24, 2010
    So...what your saying is that CBN needs to take a pay cut after year 1? Thats how CJH stayed at UM...took a pay cut and cleaned the coaching house.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. Agator88

    Agator88 GC Legend

    998
    350
    1,858
    Oct 7, 2014
    Hes always been a great coach, but his personality is what started to wear on people. There's no doubt he's wanted to win at Michigan more than anyone, he's a Michigan man. So he was always going to get a little extra time than the guy that's an outsider.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. g8wayg8r

    g8wayg8r GC Hall of Fame

    1,227
    251
    1,848
    Apr 8, 2007
    St Charles, MO
    Three years is far too patient for entitled fans.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  16. tommyuf21

    tommyuf21 GC Hall of Fame

    7,485
    205
    258
    Apr 8, 2007
    The rule of thumb is that new coaches have 3 years to win a championship or not win one at all.

    I don't think its a hard and fast rule though, as Dabo was able to pull it off and it took longer. Harbaugh could also break that rule as well.

    I think that timetable is very unrealistic with the current state of the SEC and our
    talent deficit. It will take 2-3 consecutive top 5 classes to do this. This class looks to fall between 6-8, which is better, but not good enough to beat Georgia or Alabama.

    The portal does allow you to fill some holes, but I don't think Napier will use it like Mullen did. You can't build a program off the portal. It has to be done the old fashioned way, recruiting 4 and 5* players.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  17. tommyuf21

    tommyuf21 GC Hall of Fame

    7,485
    205
    258
    Apr 8, 2007
    These fans seem to be oblivious to the last 10+ seasons of Gator football. They think its still 2008.

    But they can always enjoy another 10 years of futility if they want.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 2
  18. antny1

    antny1 GC Hall of Fame

    3,948
    2,016
    2,498
    Dec 3, 2019
    So it took adapting to a different method for it to finally work. Something Champ, Mac and Mullen didn't indicate they would even attempt short of Champ bringing in different OCs each year. Time will tell if Napier exhibits this ability to adapt. I'm on board with him but certainly have concerns.

    For what it's worth I never understood questioning Harbaugh at the onset. He won everywhere he has been and I thought it was a slam dunk hire. His results didn't reflect that until recently however.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. avogator

    avogator VIP Member

    556
    416
    1,958
    Apr 3, 2007
    Ohio State fans want Ryan Day fired for losing 2 in a row to Michigan. His head coach record is 45-5 best in Football
     
    • Funny Funny x 4
    • Like Like x 2
  20. 06GATORS08

    06GATORS08 GC Hall of Fame

    1,308
    358
    1,938
    Dec 12, 2009
    I think the majority of the fanbase can and will be patient for a coach with the right demeanor. Mcelwain was talking death threats. Mullen was getting snarky with the pressers and dismissing the significance of recruiting as he was being badly out-recruited by rivals. I think we were plenty patient with Muschamp and the results just weren't there.

    Napier doesn't need to win a natty in yr2 or 3 to placate the fans. But, going forward, we can't have inexplicable struggles against a bad usf team or a bad loss to a Vandy team that gets worked silly by Tennessee one week later without significant adjustments to personnel or supporting staff. Show that you can learn from failure, and you'll get patience.
     
    • Agree x 10
    • Winner x 2
    • Like x 1
    • Disagree Bacon! x 1
    • Informative x 1