liberals are infighting over migrants

Instead of spending billions on a boondoggle wall, and hundred of millions patrolling the open desert, build a system where there are immigrant half-way houses at the border. Interpol and home country background checks shouldn't take more than 72 hours. If they pass, let them in. If not, deport them. For those that are allowed in, simple rule. Any felony conviction or combination of misdemeanor convictions earns them a trip back home after serving punishment here.

We're home to amazing companies like Amazon, Apple, and Oracle. Creating a computer, immigrant tracking system that ties into country police and Interpol, and tracks Visa payments is something I think at least one of these companies can do. And all that wall construction can go into building humane holding facilities both on and near the border. It can be done. It should have been done in 2007 and again in 2013 when bi-partisan committees suggested it was the best, and most logical answer.

 

200,000 a month is a lot. But that works out to about 6,650 a day. If we could open up 20 processing centers, that's about 300 per center, per day. You could run each center with 2, 8-hour shifts, running 7 days a week, and that works out to about 20 per hour for each center. And again, you can have centers in border towns like San Diego, Yuma, Nogales, and El Paso, as well as centers not too far from the border, like in L.A. and Tucson.

Sure, there would be a ton of backend coding to have all the systems speak to one another, but I would think there would be less than what is on the current Amazon.com website, which hosts a ton of content, talks to a ton of systems, and works quite well.

It can be done. This country put a man on the moon decades ago. If we quit making excuses and put the proper resources to solving the issue, I'm sure we could have a decent system to do background checks and track newly entered immigrants here seeking asylum. And it probably wouldn't take too long to get it up and running.

 

As… I don’t disagree with you. In fact most conservatives I know (small sample) agree with you. It’s the lackluster refusal to do anything that would remotely make things better that is an issue.
We can only guess at how many actual illegal “got aways” have crossed over. We can only guess at how many human traffickers have crossed and recrossed our southern border. How much fentanyl has come across.
Fix the border… don’t end all immigration. No one I know is calling for that.. but regulate it. Monitor it.
How many years has this been an issue? Has Biden even tried to find a solution? Kamala… who was placed in charge of the border crisis? Have we heard anything except for calling Border Patrol agents racists? I don’t care who fixes the border. Close it off, regulate who comes in, offer more work visas , and everyone uses E verify. It seems this could be fixed. But the left refuses to do anything to slow the physical flow of immigrants and the right refuses to do anything to fix the visa issues and provide funding for a more robust immigration policy. BOTH sides rather use it to point fingers.

 

I agree. The right seems to think it's possible to have a secure border. But the truth is, we've never had a secure Southern border in our history. It would take massive, military man-power to patrol the 2000 miles 24/7. But those on the right often say we need to secure the border first before we address any guest worker program. Oh, and no amnesty at all for those already here too is another right-wing sticking point. Like people who have lived here for years are going to return to the border, cross it, and get in line to cross again?

There used to be those on the far left too who were worried about immigrants taking citizen jobs. In 2007, Bernie Sanders opposed the guest worker plan. But by 2013, Bernie was on board with the Gang of 8 plan.

I was hopeful that with control of both houses and with Biden as POTUS, a Gang of 8 style plan could be passed. But I guess Manchin was never on board, and some other moderate Ds had reservations. And good luck getting a single R to back something that Biden backs, even though the Gang of 8 plan was bi-partisan to begin with.

The reality is, fixing the work visa situation with an expanded guest worker program is the best way to control the flow of immigrants coming over. Unless you want full militarization of the border, which is the only other thing that would work. But the expanded guest worker program would allow the majority of crossers to come in and be processed and tracked, meaning anyone left to cross the open desert would be those coming in who couldn't pass the background check. And removing the large flow of people now coming in unchecked, and moving them into processing centers would make it easier to catch those still coming in illegally. A lot less noise on the border.

As for drugs, 90%+ come in through our ports. Individual mules just don't carry enough to make a dent. But if we charged for a guest worker visa, even $5/week, if we got 8 million immigrants to pay, that's $2 billion a year. Would help pay for the processing centers, as well as improvements to technology to pay to try and find more drugs at border ports.

It can be done, once we all realize it's the most logical, and best solution. And stop making excuses why it can't be done, or shouldn't be done.

 

One day, you'll get there buckeye

 

There is a simple fix: basic security checks and then let the markets fill needs. Stop pretending that we can use giant government to stop people from trying to meet the demand for labor. No more quotas. If you want in, subject yourself to a background check, and, if passed, you get into the country. Then, let markets handle the need for extra services. Basically, go back to how we did immigration prior to 1924 (minus things like the Chinese Exclusion Act).

 

Using the argument that we have never had a secure border is a cop out and nothing more than a talking point. The border is sieve period. To let it remain a sieve because of that silly talking point is perfidy against all American citizens. You're right we will not stop them all but letting them all in is not the answer either.

On the issue of processing centers what is it they actually do? Background checks isn't even in the job description, the training takes 36 days, 50 students per class, 1200 students per year.
UNITED STATES BORDER PATROL ACADEMY PROCESSING COORDINATOR TRAINING PROGRAM DUTIES ( * NOT ALL ENCOMPASSING)

• Receiving and processing custody of detainees.
• Maintaining well-being of detainees outside of a secure complex, inventorying, tagging, and storing detainees’ personal property for tracking purposes.
• Transporting detainees to proceedings and medical facilities.
• Communicating in the Spanish language.
• Maintaining contact with other sectors, stations, agencies, and foreign consulates and making arrangements for removal procedures, travel, and escorts.
• Logging the status of welfare checks of occupants, visual inspections of temporary holding areas, and in entering information into the appropriate processing system.
• Drafting and maintaining administrative paperwork and reports related to property, transportation, and deportation documentation.
​

Then you have training programs required for those seeking asylum which the bulk of these people are claiming at the moment. The AOBTC is five week course that has prerequisites which must be completed. This is the bottle neck as people are released into the general population without the process being completed. Keep in mind there are cap on the number of asylum entries per fiscal year and we certainly have more crossing the border than slots available for asylum seekers.

Asylum Division Training Programs

All Asylum Officers are required to attend and complete the Asylum Officer Basic Training Course (AOBTC), which is a national training course that is specific to asylum adjudications. Instructors for this course are from HQ Asylum Division and field Asylum offices, as well as non-governmental organizations, law schools, and the UNHCR.​

Most illegal immigrants do not qualify for US asylum

DHS statistics reveal that the Biden administration has rarely used this “expedited removal” authority. Between July 2021 and July 2022, the department processed 1.079 million migrants stopped at the southwest border for removal. Of that 1.079 million, it cleared just 41,206 to apply for asylum or other humanitarian protection in the US.


During that same period, however, DHS released approximately 853,000 migrants stopped at the southwest border into the United States. Although those migrants are commonly called “asylum-seekers,” these statistics show fewer than 5% are.


That’s not to say that others won’t seek asylum eventually. Most who appear in immigration court will file asylum applications, regardless of whether they fear persecution or torture, because that will allow them to seek work permits and remain here indefinitely.
......
The administration complains it can’t detain illegal migrants because it lacks space and must instead release most into the US pending removal proceedings. Consequently, seven times as many of those illegal migrants were released between July 2021 and July 2022 than were removed or returned.​

Immigration Benefits in EOIR Removal Proceedings

If you are filing for relief or protection in immigration court, the government’s attorney will provide you with the pre-order Instructions for Submitting Certain Applications in Immigration Court and For Providing Biometric and Biographic Information to U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (PDF, 178.54 KB). You must follow these instructions carefully in order to have your application adjudicated during removal proceedings. As described in the joint Fact Sheet on immigration benefits in EOIR proceedings (PDF, 45.22 KB), the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) and the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) implemented these procedures to ensure that the background and security checks required by the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) are completed before EOIR Immigration Judges or the BIA grant an individual relief from removal or protection benefits. EOIR regulations effective on April 1, 2005 prohibit Immigration Judges and the BIA from granting such benefits to an alien before DHS reports that the identity, background and security checks are complete. (See 70 Federal Register 4743 (January 31, 2005)(codified at 8 C.F.R. Parts 1003 and 1208).
​

As you can tell there are a number of agencies and processes involved and each takes time to complete. Simply opening up more processing centers is not the answer.

 

The fact we've never had a secure Southern border is an argument against not changing anything until the border is secure. Which is often a right wing talking point on immigration reform. If we wait until the border is secure to change the law, we wait forever. Unless you wish to militarize the border and commit thousands of troops.

And all this is under current law. I say change it. Allow all entering to apply for a guest worker visa. If they also want to claim asylum too, fine. They can still stay and work on the guest visa while they wait their asylum hearing.

But the reality is, the situation at the border hasn't changed much since the end of WW II. The difference was at least then, we had a Bracero Program. Time to reenact something similar. Let the market decide how many immigrants we need. And let them pay a visa to stay.

 

To qualify for asylum, immigrants must show persecution. Are you saying that these people are all persecuted in their leftist government run utopian homelands?

 

You will get no argument from me here. Both sides had their own vested interests in status quo.

 

Don't know. Some probably are, some probably aren't. That is the point of the process.

 

Come on now md, you know that there are damn few that are. After all, those good socialist governments down there would never persecute people. They care too much about the people’s rights to do that.

 

You think that asylum seekers only come from "socialist governments down there?" They are from a wide variety of places.

 

I didn’t say all now, did I?

Getting a little sensitive here? I see you’re resorting to quibbling and “all or nothing”. Are you really trying to debate that the majority of Central and South American countries are not socialist or at least left leaning?

 

Security at the border includes implementing legislation that has stricter controls on immigration. So yes fixing our immigration problems starts with security at the border.

Agreed the laws need to be changed. Or at a minimum enforce the current laws on the books. Let ICE do their jobs and stop the nonsense of sanctuary cities where law enforcement refuses interact with federal agencies.

Unless I missed something here at this point I would say the market has already decided as not all immigrants are employed.

Try telling the American populace nothing has changed since WWII and see what reaction you're going to get. If that's true it was a problem then as it is now and it needs to be fixed.

 

Yes, you did. Here is the quote:

"Are you saying that these people are all persecuted in their leftist government run utopian homelands?"

So yes, you used the word all to describe them.

Some are some aren't. I don't really count them up, but you can go ahead and prove it. Which South American and Central American countries are socialist and which ones aren't?

 

Um, excuse me, I wasn’t saying that. I was asking you the question if that was what you believed.