Air India had a 787 flight in 2023 that had to return to its airport after an engine failure. The failure was determined to be because of poor maintenance. The flight was between Mumbai and London. Also of note: India's aviation regulator only has half the staff it is supposed to have. It's a sad day when India runs out of people . . . Air India Dreamliner made emergency landing after 2023 engine failure
Folks in the west don’t understand how almost comically corrupt India is, in everything. Literally everything. I spent some time there, I have all kinds of stories. Nothing that happens there surprises me, and if it’s AI’s fault here, it would be the least shocking news ever. And if it is, they are going to get destroyed.
I was very impressed with the flooding on the streets of New Dehli when I visited a couple years ago.
An update about the crash is supposed to be released by the end of the week. Speculation is leaning towards deliberate shutting of fuel to the engine during take off. Sadly pilot suicide is occurring way to often. https://www.reuters.com/world/india...ia-crash-indias-aviation-ministry-2025-07-08/
When I talk about corruption, I will guarantee if that’s the verdict on Friday, many in India and elsewhere will question whether simply blaming the crew was the easiest way to protect the airline from charges of maintenance issues. They better have really solid evidence that stands up to independent scrutiny.
If this is the case, the data recorder records every button push and switch. If one of them simply reached down and turned off the engine/fuel, the data recorder will absolutely have that. I’m not technically knowledgeable enough to know how easy that would be to falsify after the fact, but if that’s what happened, they already know. Awful if true.
Is it possible they could have bumped a switch and turned it off by accident? Then not realizing they were the source of the problem, not consider that possibility when troubleshooting?
No. the fuel/engine switch needs to be lifted then switched to prevent just that. Also they are about 4-5 inches apart so even if they did one the other engine would function. It does make sense as to why the RAT was deployed. When power is lost to certain Buses the RAT is deployed and shutting down both engines and not having the APU running would produce the result that exact result. So Fing selfish. You wanna off yourself, go fight a tiger or something
The cockpit voice recorder will be key helping to determine if cutting the fuel was a deliberate sabotage act, or part of some restart sequence. It will be interesting if they release a transcript of it.
"The aircraft achieved the maximum recorded airspeed of 180 Knots IAS at about 08:08:42 UTC and immediately thereafter, the Engine 1 and Engine 2 fuel cutoff switches transitioned from RUN to CUTOFF position one after another with a time gap of 01 sec. The Engine N1 and N2 began to decrease from their take-off values as the fuel supply to the engines was cut off. In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so." https://aaib.gov.in/What's New Assets/Preliminary Report VT-ANB.pdf So sad.
I’ve turned off those engines hundreds and hundreds of times and that’s about how long it takes…..One then the other. So if what you said it accurate that’s suicide/homicide.
What about this nugget from the report. Do you think the switches could have both flipped by accident? The FAA issued Special Airworthiness Information Bulletin (SAIB) No. NM-18-33 on December 17, 2018, regarding the potential disengagement of the fuel control switch locking feature. This SAIB was issued based on reports from operators of Model 737 airplanes that the fuel control switches were installed with the locking feature disengaged. The airworthiness concern was not considered an unsafe condition that would warrant airworthiness directive (AD) by the FAA. The fuel control switch design, including the locking feature, is similar on various Boeing airplane models including part number 4TL837-3D which is fitted in B787-8 aircraft VT-ANB. As per the information from Air India, the suggested inspections were not carried out as the SAIB was advisory and not mandatory. The scrutiny of maintenance records revealed that the throttle control module was replaced on VT-ANB in 2019 and 2023. However, the reason for the replacement was not linked to the fuel control switch. There has been no defect reported pertaining to the fuel control switch since 2023 on VT-ANB."
as they mentioned they are both spring loaded, and they have a small metal gate that you have to lift the switch up and over from the run to cutoff position and vice versa. It’s not like a toggle light switch. If you google 787 fuel switch pictures you can zoom in at the base as see it. And the fact they were done sequentially one then the other a second apart makes me think it was purposeful as that is how we do it every day when we park at the gate and shut them down. Didn’t even occur to me at the onset that this was suicide/homicide. Guess I have to start thinking differently.
Assuming it was a purposeful act…I think almost anyone can understand someone being really unhappy and having thoughts of suicide, even if it’s morally repugnant to them or just plain wrong. It’s the idea of taking hundreds of innocent people with you that will never make sense. How angry or just completely gone mentally do you have to be to ruin countless other lives to serve your own ends?
If it was suicide, it would be the "other pilot" in the conversation quoted who is responsible in my opinion.
Not sure that is enough. The person pulling the cutoff switch could have pulled it and then made the comment to throw off the voice recorder. It is also noted that both switches where placed back to run about 10 seconds later. One of the engines did re-ingite but they where two low. The captain was the monitor pilot while the 1st officer was flying the plane. Right now it appears two be to probable causes. 1. One of them, probably the captain set to cutoff. 2. One of them did it subconsciously and then they tried to recover but it was to late.
I've read the actual AAIB report that came out at midnight that is in more depth than what the MSM ran with last night. It appears it was human-caused. The data recorder recorded that the left fuel switch was turned to the off position and a second later the right switch was turned off. One of pilots is then heard moments later telling the other pilot, "What did you just do?" That pilot said he didn't do anything. So about 10 seconds later, the fuel switches are turned back to run 2 seconds apart. Engine 1 restarted and resumed V-1 while Engine 2 restarted but never could get back to lift thrust. It was too little too late. The question now is why? Some will point to mental health issues but I wouldn't rule out a deliberate act. The other pilot never said another word after that which is rare when a terrorist act occurs like this; most say "Allahu Akbar" since they know there is a voice recorder and also it's their battle cry. Yet, here, the only words spoken after the one pilot asked the other what did they do was "May Day, May Day, May Day". For those that said it was an accident, pilots don't do that. There is no accident in aviation. Pilots train all of time, have thousands of hours in simulators and hundreds to thousands of hours in actual flight time. Every function on the plane is carried out by each individual. So the act of switching off the fuel control switch on the ground is the 1st Officer, the Captain verbally tells the 1st Officer when to shut them down as part of the post landing check. Keep in mind the pilot, the Captain, is focused on the take-off. He can't see the ground in front of him during take-off once the cone of the plane lifts up. He uses instrumentation from that point until they level off. When the 1st Officer switch them off one after another, the turbines start to spin down and all pilots know that sound. That's why the Captain asked the 1st Officer, "what did you do?" Think about that. He didn't say, "What just happened" or "Did you feel that?" He said, "What did you do?" Of course many of us have kids and when they do something bad, and then confronted by you, they always say I didn't do anything. What the copilot said doesn't matter, he was caught but he didn't react after that. The Captain flipped back on the fuel cutoff switches and co-pilot knew it was too late. He has already prepared himself. So was it murder-suicide or terrorism? The next year or 2 will be to address that question. They have the voices to know who said what so it won't be any surprise. My guess is what will come from this is the question, "For what reason can anyone think of that the fuel cutoff switches should ever be physically shutoff during takeoff?" Most likely a change to the planes will be to disable the switches during take-off, at least until a certain speed and altitude is reached. The RAT will never deploy while the wheels are touching the ground, any wheel. I'm surprised they never did this any way but it's never happened before in aviation history. Pilots are trained never to touch them during a flight.
few items. Doubtful they disable the run/cutoff switches. Fire is a greater threat than suicide, and I need to be able to shut it down. Also, we train to touch these in flight at every Checkride. V1 cuts, engine shut down with and without damage etc. the bigger concern is confirming with the other pilot so as to not inadvertently shut down the good engine during an emergency/ high stress environment.
