How do you distinguish between a Palestinian who just supports Hamas and one who does not? The one that does not, is the one pointing you to where the Hamas members are. We are now at the point where a lot of Palestinians are tired of Hamas and what their actions have brought on them. The way to win is to wipe Hamas off the map, which Israel has shown they have the intelligence to do but not been allowed to execute. And then allow the Palestinians clans that actually want a future, to ensure anyone trying to become the next generation of Hamas is dealt with quickly and decisively. We saw the Sunnis in Western Iraq do this during the Awakening with AQI once they were tired enough of putting up with them. Thinking that Israel just has to accept the idea of a neighbor is waiting and hoping to carry out another Oct 7th attack is extremely strange to me.
What Muslim country claims to represent all of Islam and act on behalf of all Muslims? Like they dont even agree on Islam - Sunni & Shia hate each other and are at odds. There is a difference between a country with a majority religion where citizens have legal & formal equality vs. one that takes on a nationalist character with a explicit religious identity that says only that identity has agency to determine national policy. Maybe if there were like 10 Jewish states and they followed different strains of Judaism maybe things would be better, they would probably not agree on stuff and no one could claim credibly to represent Jews everywhere. I cant think of many countries I'd want to sell weapons to, but Turkey would not be on my list of countries to sell to. They've abandoned their secular origins in favor of a religious & nationalist outlook. Another religious ethno-state in the region isnt going to be great for things.
what sort of ethnic cleaning are you talking about? The population is Gaza has increased quite a bit since they became a self governing territory in 2007?
You think there are Palestinians who want to help out Israel by ratting out Hamas members? There are Palestinians tired of Hamas rule, but until they rise up internally, overthrow Hamas one way or another, and declare a desire for peace, we're dealing with a terrorist organization that has support and can hide within the civilian population. Maybe one day, the Palestinian population will actually want peace. They had their chance 25 years ago with Arafat negotiating with Clinton. The result was the end of the PLO but rise of Hamas. The Palestinians weren't tired enough of the fighting then. What indications are there that they are tired of the fighting today?
A lot of them? Many believe that those other Muslims that don’t have the same belief are apostates. So which is which of your two examples? Because the number of Jews is in the millions and number of Muslims is in the billions?
Estimates are between 40,000 and 50,000 Palestinian civilians killed the last 18 months. How many more will there be if Bibi gets his way?
Or we let the Israelis go in and wipe Hamas out and let Palestinians clans that are currently retaliating against Hamas killing their people take over. Not sure the result could be any worse.
I wouldn’t like it and it would be unconstitutional. But there is a difference in doing that and demanding the extermination of your neighbors and slaughtering innocent civilians on purpose. You can certainly criticize Israel and Bibi. But the alleged offenses are nowhere in the same ballpark of what Hamas professes and acts upon. Why do you think Israel was formed as a Jewish state?
Like can you name one? And Israel supporters say people who criticize Israel (or even just dont do enough to back them) arent real Jews. I mean Trump has called Shumer a Palestinian! Despite being Schumer being a solid Zionist.
Are you saying Israel is deliberately killing those people, or are they collateral damage in pursuit of Hamas? (notwithstanding those numbers are likely not reliable)
You left out the full quote: In the fighting since, more than 50,000 Palestinians have died, according to the Gaza health ministry, which does not distinguish between civilian and military deaths. Netanyahu Warns of ‘Intensive’ Escalation From Israel in Gaza Campaign The Gaza health ministry is run by Hamas.
Because some European nationalists (Zionists) got some ideas there should be a Jewish state based on mythology and sold the idea to the British imperialists who didn't mind seeing Jews leave Europe and colonize some place in the ME. Not unlike how they didnt mind religious dissenters leaving for America.
Ergoden for one has made such utterances and wants to rebuild a Muslim caliphate. The Iranian ayatollahs also believe they speak for “true” Muslims. As to “people say” I’m not sure how that is relevant to my question. You are demanding Israel relinquish any ties to the Jewish religion or culture even though I haven’t seen any evidence that non Jews in Israel have less rights.
Not denying the influence of Zionists - but do you think the fact that 6 million were exterminated in Europe, and that much of the Muslim world demands their extermination, that in such case they may want their own homeland for self preservation?
Like you are aware there are places in Israel only Jewish people can go right? Jimmy Carter wasn't some crazed leftist, and he called Israel an apartheid state. Its pretty obvious to anyone who does the slightest investigation. I myself went from thinking like you to where I'm at now. I'm not demanding people abandon their religion, just their claim to an explicitly Jewish state that says only Jews can make the important decisions.
You think it's possible Israel can go and wipe out Hamas? That the Palestinian resistance will assist Israel, and there won't be plenty of Palestinians hiding Hamas? Or that there won't be blowback among the Palestinian Hamas supporters and the result of Israel's actions will be to push more Hamas supporters into Hamas members? Israel has been trying to root out terrorists for four generations. Highly doubtful the Palestinians are going to cooperate with Israelis on anything. Which is why any Palestinian peace movement has to grow out of Palestinian only activities. If Israel is involved, it will only continue business as usual, which means creation of more Hamas/terrorists to defeat in the future. Wash, rinse, repeat. And yes, getting accurate Palestinian civilian totals are impossible. That's why I used the estimated between 40k and 50k number.
So why hasn't Iran exterminated its Jewish population? Its not very big (less than 10k), it woudlnt take much doing. Dont you think a lot of this type of talk serves to justify Israeli intransigence and hostility? Like are they above creating their own propaganda? If your neighbors all want to kill you or undermine you, it can justify a lot of stuff in the name of security, like Putin's Russia.
have you read Carters later expansion on this? https://jweekly.com/2025/01/03/when-i-met-with-president-carter-about-israels-apartheid/ He was referring to occupied territories, not Israel.
The Israelis have never gone in like they are reportedly about to. I think it is possible. The $1M question is have the Palestinians had enough and finally decided not to miss an opportunity. You are using propaganda numbers for Hamas.
