Your Banality of Evil for the Week -- forced sterilization in America

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by MichiGator2002, Jul 15, 2013.

  1. MichiGator2002
    Online

    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    16,974
    Likes Received:
    841
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +3,731
    Wow, just wow.

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...nd-answers-on-148-unauthorized-female-inmate/

    Anybody that carried this out, endorsed this, or encouraged this, is an evil, evil SOB.
  2. G8trGr8t
    Online

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2008
    Messages:
    15,238
    Likes Received:
    1,227
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    SW Florida
    Ratings Received:
    +2,908
    Contract doctors probably paid by procedure. More procedures more money so they either convinced them, paid them, or gave them pain Med scripts to get them to consent
  3. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    That's insane. And there's a "formal" sterilization program?
  4. HudsonGator
    Offline

    HudsonGator New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
    Messages:
    2,328
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings Received:
    +7
    I disagree, I think we should incentivize criminals not to reproduce.

    Maybe give them a 35% reduction off their sentences if they agree to the procedure.

    Fewer criminals making babies means fewer future criminals.
  5. Lawdog88
    Offline

    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2007
    Messages:
    30,939
    Likes Received:
    654
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Inside the War Room, No Name City, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,370

    Gene pool reduction argument, eh ?
  6. gatornana
    Offline

    gatornana Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    23,368
    Likes Received:
    346
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +1,085
    Interesting female prisoners were the targets, not males.
  7. Gatorrick22
    Offline

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    34,998
    Likes Received:
    2,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +5,998
    This should be considered, if by consent only, for both genders.
  8. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    Unless criminality is a purely biologically determined trait, I'm not sure what good that would do.
  9. MichiGator2002
    Online

    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    16,974
    Likes Received:
    841
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +3,731
    It's early 20th century eugenics obscenity popping up all over again, is what it is. That evil has never truly left us.
  10. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    I doubt it will as long as people continue to think poverty and criminality are biologically inhereted traits or purely "mental illnesses" (as one notorious poster puts it in the case of poverty), and people search for "rational" responses.
  11. tim85
    Offline

    tim85 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    Messages:
    4,173
    Likes Received:
    312
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +1,173
    There's actually some studies that have come out recently that allude to tendencies from criminality are possible to passed down through genetic traits. I wish I could remember the exact study, but it was on an episode of RadioLab(really fantastic NPR show, btw) where they were discussing some stories and I believe a couple of studies that have come out recently suggesting that how we're acting and feeling in the general time of sex could be passed onto our children. I'm not suggesting we should sterilize or arrest anyone based on that, just that there could be scientific evidence to suggest a correlation.
  12. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    I think people are predisposed genetically to all sorts of behavior, including violence. The key distinction is between "predisposed" vs. "inevitability." (i.e. there is no accounting for social conditioning, choice, or free will in the latter).
  13. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    Rationally speaking, if someone's genes meant they would be certain criminals, shouldnt the punishment be less severe than someone who isnt and made a choice entirely by free will?
  14. WESGATORS
    Offline

    WESGATORS Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    21,561
    Likes Received:
    306
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +1,099
    There's also the aspect of considering whether or not criminals (particularly ones behind bars) can act as a responsible parent and serve as a proper role model.

    As long as the procedure is not forced (in even the slightest capacity), incentivizing those who do not have a passion for becoming a parent is probably going to benefit society in the long run.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
  15. tim85
    Offline

    tim85 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    Messages:
    4,173
    Likes Received:
    312
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +1,173
    No, because as humans we can exercise portions of our brain to become proficient at saying no to other portions of our brain. Er...self-control.
  16. WESGATORS
    Offline

    WESGATORS Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    21,561
    Likes Received:
    306
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +1,099
    The same concept applies whether you are born with a propensity to commit crime (I don't subscribe to this theory) or whether you are conditioned towards a propensity to commit crime. When does a 5-year old with poor parenting drop off the cliff to all of a sudden become an 18-year old who should be expected to act reasonably in society?

    Punishment doesn't need to be "more" or "less" it needs to be effective based on the goals. If, for instance, the individual is a danger to society, then it is effective to remove that person from society until that person can no longer be considered a danger from society (how they became that way is irrelevant to this function). That we fail in this task is another matter altogether.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
  17. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,885
    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +2,180
    This was a rhetorical quesiton of sorts (because the underlying premise is speculative). Propensity is different from certainty. I asked if we established with certainty that a certain genetic trait would absolutely cause them to commit crimes or engage in criminal behavior. Shouldnt they be punished less severley?
  18. WESGATORS
    Offline

    WESGATORS Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    21,561
    Likes Received:
    306
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +1,099
    What you are proposing requires a very high level of suspension of disbelief. Fortunately, I have seen the movie Minority Report. :D Still "less severely" shouldn't be determined by how they got there, it should be determined by where they go from that point forward. If anything, the hypothetical you propose may warrant stiffer punishment on account of the possibility of being harder to remove the criminal inclination from the individual.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
  19. Wormwood56
    Online

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2011
    Messages:
    7,504
    Likes Received:
    768
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Ratings Received:
    +3,085
  20. MichiGator2002
    Online

    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    16,974
    Likes Received:
    841
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +3,731
    Yeah, one of my first thoughts as well.

Share This Page