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"Why Millennials Long for Liturgy"

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by QGator2414, Jan 14, 2014.

  1. QGator2414
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    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    Interesting read that I think does have some vaild observations.

    Being raised Catholic by a Catholic mom and a Baptist dad I have seen e two extremes. My wife and I now attend a Baptist Church where I am a prospect member and my wife is a member (I was not baptized properly supposedly) and believe we are meant to be there.

    That said I do miss the celebrating the Lord's Supper each and every Sunday (daily for that matter if one chooses)...

    "“If you ask me why kids are going high church, I’d say it’s because the single greatest threat to our generation and to young people nowadays is the deprivation of meaning in our lives,” Cone says. “In the liturgical space, everything becomes meaningful. In the offering up of the bread and wine, we see the offering up of the wheat and grain and fruits of the earth, and God gives them back in a sanctified form. … We’re so thirsty for meaning that goes deeper, that can speak to our entire lives, hearts, and wallets, that we’re really thirsty to be attached to the earth and to each other and to God. The liturgy is a historical way in which that happens.”"

    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/why-millennials-long-for-liturgy/
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  2. Lawdog88
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    Totally understand your predicament.

    Was raised in the Baptist Church, went crazy pagan, met the Lord in the early '20's and became an Anglican (formerly called, Episcopal) about 40 years ago.

    There is not an Anglican house of worship in my town, and the wife and I have to commute either to Mobile or Tallahassee for worship. I miss communion and the liturgical worship tremendously; the wife has made temporary peace and attends a Baptist Church nearby, and is happy there. The minister is really good, and Baptists are not like the Baptists of my youth.

    But I can't do it.
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  3. Gatormb
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    I enjoy a more traditional church. What I don't like is the "polite" Christianity the article mentions. In the last 4.5 years of attending Presbyterian and Methodist churches I have yet to hear a sermon mentioning Hell or Judgement.

    Perhaps Lacuna would enjoy though.;) Sorry L, couldn't resist.:)

    Enjoy the Tradition of the RCC, but disagree with the doctrine that you lose your salvation as you sin and only the RCC can restore it through the keeping of the Sacraments. Related, I disagree with purgatory. There are many fine people in the RCC (many on this board).
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  4. harwil
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    Why don't you go back to the most conservative high Episcopal Church in your city
  5. Lawdog88
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    Because I left the ECUSA.
  6. CHFG8R
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    CHFG8R Premium Member

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    You seem disappointed. Why?

    Just more of a stick (as opposed to carrot) guy?

    My guess. You favor Tebow (Old Testament) to Wuerffel (New Testament) too.
  7. GT Gator
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    I've been teaching RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults -- the Catholic conversion class) for years. Although very anecdotal, I was watched the demographics in our classes really change over the last decade. There are now loads of catechumens in their 20s in the classes, many who come from agnostic or atheist homes (just like me). This article confirms my observations.

    I think the trend would be even larger had the abuse scandal never happened. That still keeps many away for the Church.
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  8. wgbgator
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    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

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    Worship style seems a bit faddish to me. When I was still somewhat active, "informal" / "praise" worship was really taking off with younger people and traditional liturgy was old news. These things seem cyclical in nature. That being said, the informal stuff seemed anti-intellectual or too emotionally-driven to me, so that may have hastened my exit from all things Jesus.
  9. LittleBlueLW
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    Grew up bouncing between Methodist and Presbyterian churches. Married a Lutheran ministers daughter and we attend an Episcopal church with our sons.

    I can completely see the point of the article.
  10. lacuna
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    lacuna Well-Known Member

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    Raised a Baptist here. Converted to Catholicism when I was 28. Have worshiped in a number of different denominations since, including Episcopal and Mennonite. Currently switch off between a small Presbyterian and St Augustine RCC here in G'ville.

    In recent years I have attended a few services at a Baptist affiliated church in Texas where my son and family are members. The people are loving and sincere, but the music is wretched, ear splitting rock. The musicians perform as if they are at a concert and it isn't at all worshipful in my way of thinking.

    When I took the RCIA class it was conducted by a deacon who himself was a convert from the Baptist denomination. And I have friends, man and wife, here in Gainesville who formerly attended Westside Baptist on Newberry Road before they converted to Catholicism. They are in their early 60's and for years before they converted had been dissatisfied with the Baptist style of worship. What finally nudged them into converting was the absence of any, none, nada mention at Westside of the death of Pope John Paul II some years back. They, as do I, prefer the dignity, the ritual and the formality of liturgical worship.
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  11. Gatormb
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    Gatormb Well-Known Member

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    SOS is an OT guy also. 2-1.:)

    Point is, if a Christian is saved what is he saved from? Answer the wrath of God. The bible says we are appointed to die once and then face Judgement. Those not covered by the blood of Christ face Hell.

    Hey, am I wrong (assuming you are a believer)? Unfortunately too many churches are more concerned with putting more butts in the pews to collect more bucks so they can pay the bills than they are about true conversion and don't want to offend potential givers.

    Now, I'm not for all hell fire and brimstone but the subject of Hell and judgment being ignored completely, I feel, is by design.
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  12. Gatormb
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    I assume ECUSA is the only EC? Presbyterian Church has PCA, PCUSA and EPC (Evangelical PC) which has rejected the liberalism of the other two.
  13. helix139
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    I guess I was lucky. I grew up in a reformed presbyterian (ARP) church that was always very liturgical and traditional in its method of worship, doctrines, and polity. I didn't grow to appreciate it until I got older, and I'm currently in my 3rd year of a 3 year term as a deacon there. Now I really appreciate the order, respect, and deliberateness that goes into the service every week. It allows me to focus on God, Christ, and the message and not the 'show of the week,' which may appeal to the emotions but is empty in substance. I've really come to prefer our scriptural sermons, where a single and complete scripture passage is presented and the message reveals itself through the context and background provided by the pastor rather than the topical sermons I've heard at other churches where gospel passages are cherry picked to fit a topic of the week.

    The one complaint I do have is these types of churches are very resistant to get away from traditional 'organ and choir' hymns and into more modern interpretations of worship music (something like indelible grace's arrangements of classic hymns for modern instrumentation). I feel that does tend to alienate a lot of the younger audience. This isn't to say, though, that traditional worship music isn't great (it is) but it doesn't speak to everyone and there is no reason a church needs to limit itself to one style of worship music as long as the music is scripturally and structurally sound.
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  14. Lawdog88
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    No MB, most of the break away ECUSA and Anglican Communion churches are now affiliated with the ACNA (Anglican Church in North America); for a while, some were affiliated with AMIA (Anglican Mission in America).

    If you haven't followed, the split has been especially acrimonious from the ECUSA side, and there have been several significant and quite nasty court cases - with mixed results, the last time I looked - over who actually owned the physical property of the church, i.e., the local parish or ECUSA. It has been reported that in some cases, where ECUSA has prevailed, they sold off, or donated, the former parish facilities to other religions, including Islam.

    But hey, that's what happens when you water down the Gospel and expect the parishioners to like it.
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  15. helix139
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    helix139 VIP Member

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    Presbyterians also have ARP (Associate Reformed Presbyterian). None of the liberalism of the others in our church either.
  16. QGator2414
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    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    I went to Westside for a short period before my wife and I ended up at Creekside Community Church (where we were married) an EFCA church (probably the denomination I can relate best to) on 39th Ave. Pastor Richard Parker is a rock star in expository preaching. he now is heading The Chapel in Gainesville last I heard. We were members at the local plant by Creekside here in Ocala (Christ Community Church) and I was leading Bible studies and as hard as it was we ended up deciding to change. There is no doubt we are suppose to be at FBCO right now...

    My issues with Westside were after they built their "family life center" and I heard they were going to require payment for use. Now I was not on the in and I may have bad info but if you can't afford it...don't build it!
  17. QGator2414
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    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    Agreed.

    Love old hymns but also love good new Christian Music (one is just not good). FBCO when we started had two services at the same time. Traditional in the sanctuary and contemporary in the fellowship hall. They would pipe in the sermon on a minute or two delay. The correct decision was made to combine the services and have everyone worship together. I was chatting with our Pastor (great guy except he is a Kentucky fan ;)) who joked we could go back to the original worship of chants if we want to go all the way way back...
  18. QGator2414
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    Has the PCA been infiltrated?
  19. 92gator
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    While I do appreciate the meaning of most every aspect of the liturgy (Catholic)--the thing that I like most about it, is the feeling of being 'home', or coming home, no matter where I am. The Catholic Mass is the same here, as it is there, as it is most anywhere--Europe, the States, the Caribbean, South America....only the language changes. Hence no matter how much the world around you changes, the Mass is like home-base--you can always go back to Mass, and recalibrate your bearings--and that is largely fruit of 'liturgy'. Same readings, many of the same hymns, same rituals, same sequence of rituals...

    Consistent. Predictable. Stable. Homey.

    (...as one should expect the House of the Lord to be). ;)
  20. oragator1
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    Not sure I follow the article. It starts off by saying mellenials are far less likely to go to church, but if they craved liturgy, wouldn't they go to church?

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