Where do you stand on the political spectrum

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by kurt_borglum, Apr 11, 2014.

  1. chemgator
    Offline

    chemgator Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    8,721
    Likes Received:
    239
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,172
    Almost all conservatives (in addition to liberals) agree that the environment needs to be preserved. Liberals think the answer is more government. Conservatives think the answer is smarter (and smaller) gov't. If you've seen the EPA in action, you'd understand. Their primary focus when they audit a chemical company is paperwork, not what is going on in the plant. For them to audit what's going on in the plant, they would have to take the time to understand the process, and they don't have the time to do that. So they make sure your paperwork is filled out correctly. When the EPA takes an active role in banning chemicals, demanding BACT (best available control technology), they often get it wrong. Clinton's head of EPA (Carol Browner, who has no technical training and admitted she didn't know where salt goes when you put it in water) tried to ban the element chlorine, which would have set back modern medicine to the middle ages, among other things. Your chemical plant could be creating the next Superfund site, and the EPA wouldn't notice.

    The environmental legislation of the 1970's (RCRA, Clean Air Act, etc.) was the best thing that could have happened for the environment. That is what is driving the cleaning up of the nation's air and water. Companies (with few exceptions) comply willingly with those pieces of legislation, and it has helped the environment immensely. The EPA and additional regulations added since the 1970's haven't done a whole lot to improve the environment.

    And there are two aspects to protecting our financial stability. One is through regulation of banking and the stock markets, etc., and the other is through minimizing the federal debt. The same arguments that apply to the environment apply to financial regulation--federal regulators are inherently lazy and do not take the time to understand the process and the players that are involved. The Securities and Exchange Commission had all the information it needed to prosecute Enron for accounting fraud, but it chose not to look at it that closely. A high school teacher figured it out in an hour. That's embarrassing, but it happens all the time.

    As far as minimizing national debt, well, liberals are absolutely the worst people to trust on this issue. Democrat leaders have decided since 2008 that the U.S. gov't is responsible for driving the U.S. economy, which is disastrous thinking. The gov't should support the economy (education, infrastructure, trade agreements & tariffs, etc.), but never try to drive it. The gov't should try to regulate aspects of the economy without trying to control it. You don't want an economy that is dependent on federal spending, and you don't want the kind of debt accumulation that fiscal liberals GWB and BHO have been responsible for. It's not sustainable.
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2014
  2. Gatorrick22
    Offline

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    33,075
    Likes Received:
    2,519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +4,565
    8. We’re not trying to win elections

    Any libertarian who tells you he is trying to win an election is either lying to you about trying to win the election, lying to us about being a libertarian, or terribly misinformed. As far as we’re concerned, elections are a bad thing. We’re trying to end them, not win them.

    The nature of the State is to make false promises to bait support from the people it victimizes. They promise to protect you from boogeymen, they promise to solve your economic problems, they promise to carry out the will of your deity. We see this as completely ridiculous, we know it will fail, and we know that most people are stupid enough to swallow it hook line and sinker, so we can’t compete with it in a popular vote.

    Libertarians are anarchists, whether they realize it or not. Even the ones who are delusional enough to think that they are going to get elected and restore the bloody republic, are little more than useful idiots who are repeating anarchist propaganda for us through channels normally reserved for government. The goal is not to win your elections, the goal is to turn a large enough minority against the legitimacy of the State as to make its continued function impossible. So there’s absolutely no incentive to work with you in promoting candidates, which is the primary function of your political activity. You’re right when you say “No candidate is good enough” for us, no matter who runs for office we will tear him down because nobody has the right to be our ruler.
  3. Gatorrick22
    Offline

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    33,075
    Likes Received:
    2,519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +4,565
    This one below is old as the hills...already.


    7. We’ve already had this discussion a hundred times

    If you had ever bothered to study the works of any of the great libertarian theorists, you wouldn’t be asking us the questions you are asking. You ask “Who will build the roads?” or “What about defense?” you tell us “There is no such thing as utopia” and a lot of other really tired arguments. It shows us that you haven’t taken so much as 10 minutes out of your miserable life to even make the slightest effort to understand what we are proposing.

    In the meantime, we are always staying tuned to the propaganda you consume so that we can counter it. We write thoughtful articles, and make informative videos, and produce compelling audio content that explains in great detail what exactly it is your politicians and propagandists are saying, and why it is wrong.

    You don’t pay any attention to any of that content because it’s not coming from “your team”, and everyone on “your team” repeats the same propaganda. So every time we get into a political argument, we already know what you’re going to say as soon as we know which team you’re on. We already know what the proper response to your propaganda is, and we already know that you are going to act irrationally when we respond. This is extraordinarily frustrating, because we’ve actually put a great deal of effort into this, and these repetitive arguments are tiring, especially when they yield no results.
  4. Gatorrick22
    Offline

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    33,075
    Likes Received:
    2,519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +4,565
    And this one below is Obama's favorite BS line.


    3. Our moral superiority is justified

    We know that you have some pretty twisted ideas on morality that stem from religious doctrines and other ancient texts, but logically speaking, morality should be consistent. If your moral platform can’t be applied universally, then it really doesn’t make a great deal of sense.

    That’s why your politicians, religious leaders, and propagandists are always getting caught doing things that go against the words they speak. Priests get caught having gay sex, socialists acquire vast amounts of wealth, “family values” candidates get caught cheating on their wives, gun control advocates murder millions of people. Their moral platforms are inconsistent, this makes them rather meaningless, and so there is no reason for them to adhere thereto.

    Our moral platform is basically just the non initiation of force. As long as we don’t rob, assault, kidnap, and murder, we’re perfectly within our moral code. This is pretty easy for most people, since violence doesn’t appeal to us, and so we rarely end up looking like hypocrites.
  5. Gatorrick22
    Offline

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    33,075
    Likes Received:
    2,519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +4,565
    My favorite is - '"You lost the election." Which is translated to - You no longer have any right to freedom, Liberty, due process, nor the pursuit of happiness... You (losing party/Pubs) are our slaves, and the illegal immigrants flooding into our country have more say-so (rights) than you (Pubs) do... we own you, and we (Liberals) own the law.
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2014
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. vangator1
    Offline

    vangator1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    2,309
    Likes Received:
    76
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ratings Received:
    +163
    [​IMG]

    80 and 80.
  7. Dreamliner
    Online

    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    64,128
    Likes Received:
    235
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,024
    Good point. Only the non-voter has a right to complain.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. g8orbill
    Offline

    g8orbill Gators VIP Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    71,232
    Likes Received:
    4,612
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Clermont, Fl
    Ratings Received:
    +9,709
    no kiddin
    • Funny Funny x 2
  9. busigator96
    Offline

    busigator96 Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2007
    Messages:
    14,727
    Likes Received:
    218
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Gainesville, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +813
    i, like my cat, will think outside this box.
  10. Dreamliner
    Online

    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    64,128
    Likes Received:
    235
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,024
    You don't vote then ? You go, boy!
  11. orangeblueorangeblue
    Offline

    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    57,079
    Likes Received:
    596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +2,879
    Ah yes, not voting ... the "rebellious" stance.:D
  12. Dreamliner
    Online

    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    64,128
    Likes Received:
    235
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,024
    Or the principled stance. I'm good with either.
  13. orangeblueorangeblue
    Offline

    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    57,079
    Likes Received:
    596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +2,879
    Any stance is a principled stance if you can outline the principle. Paradoxically, voting and not voting are both "principled stances."
  14. Dreamliner
    Online

    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    64,128
    Likes Received:
    235
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,024
    Yes, I do hold that voting is a coercive act.
  15. orangeblueorangeblue
    Offline

    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    57,079
    Likes Received:
    596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +2,879
    Yes, we've heard you boast proudly of said fact once or twice (or 2,315 times) before. :)
  16. Dreamliner
    Online

    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    64,128
    Likes Received:
    235
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +1,024
    If I've told you ten-thousand times, stop exaggerating!
  17. tilly
    Offline

    tilly Superhero Moderator VIP Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2007
    Messages:
    20,733
    Likes Received:
    1,158
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Wilmington, NC via FLA
    Ratings Received:
    +3,913
    I was almost dead center with only 2 maybes. Thats where I felt I would be.
  18. ursidman
    Offline

    ursidman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2007
    Messages:
    2,889
    Likes Received:
    603
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +1,192
    [​IMG]
    Personal freedoms and a role for government I guess. Would have thought I would land in the large Centrist square.
  19. Spurffelbow833
    Offline

    Spurffelbow833 Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,516
    Likes Received:
    420
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +1,816
    The quiz isn't subtle enough. You have to tease the truth out of authoritarians without their being aware of it. Either that or authoritarianism is just an embarrassing character flaw when you can't act on it.
  20. wgbgator
    Offline

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,129
    Likes Received:
    404
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +1,693
    Nietzsche:

Share This Page