UPDATE -- Dunn guilty of attempted 2nd degree murder, mistried on murder

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by rivergator, Feb 3, 2014.

  1. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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  2. Lawdog88
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    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

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    Jag, my old Friend. That is kind of strong, and IMO, over-the-top, doncha' think ?

    Maybe that's what most folks think defense attorneys actually do, however. If so, that's sad, and I would say, misinformed.

    But then again, I don't know, and can't speak, for how other attorneys do things.
  3. Lawdog88
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    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

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  4. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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    Nana, the details will soon come out in trial but I read and heard that the car did leave the parking space that Gate provides for customers to park in. It was only for a brief period though and it returned in less than 1 minute. I heard they put the car in reverse and came back to the scene of the crime. Witnesses that will be called to testify indicate the they thought one of them was hiding something which throws doubt and that's what the defense attorney will bring out in trial.

    Watch & listen to Dunn's original defense attorney with Jane. Dunn currently has a man, Cory Strolla, representing him.

    http://www.hlntv.com/video/2012/11/28/another-stand-your-ground-shooting

    I think Dunn's case is weak as it stands now and Strolla is not as good as Mark O'Mara. I personally think Dunn is in the wrong and I would be shocked if he gets an acquittal. Dunn's case could have been stronger if he hadn't been so stupid about leaving. The jury would be more willing to believe that Dunn was protecting himself.
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  5. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    There's a reason most self-defense classes tell you that after a justifiable deadly force encounter you should call the police, don't move things or try to clean anything up, and stay at the scene. When the police get there state to them that you were required to use deadly force in self-defense, then politely inform them that you need to speak with your attorney before you have any further discussions with them.
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  6. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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    I agree...maybe a little strong to the overall profession so maybe it should have been worded that in my opinion the defendant (Dunn) based on what information I have before trial begins, concocts the story and must communicate this to his attorney so his attorney can use skill, experience, and intelligence to get him off the hook.

    Was that a little bit more eloquently said my friend? ;)

    In reference to defense attorneys, what is true of parts of the whole is not necessarily true of the whole itself.
  7. Lawdog88
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    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

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    Well said, and it is indeed a problem where the client wishes to present a version of events that the attorney cannot know for certain is "true" or not, but the attorney is obligated to represent the client with utmost vigour and zeal.

    I have only had two cases / clients out of the thousands represented and hundred tried to jury verdict, where I have had to advise the Court that the client wanted to testify, and I needed to withdraw (the signal to the court that the attorney is not going to be a participant in perpetuating a fraud on the court, i.e., the client's testimony).

    A client's tendency to prevaricate can be handled, however, without compromising his defense or the "truth," or risking committing a fraud upon the court.
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  8. channingcrowderhungry
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    channingcrowderhungry Well-Known Member

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    Just talked to my uncle who was at the trial today. He informed me that the New Black Panthers are in town to do what they do. Fun stuff.
  9. wgbgator
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    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

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    All 3 of them showed up?
  10. channingcrowderhungry
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    channingcrowderhungry Well-Known Member

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    I'll take your word on their membership numbers! Zingo_O
  11. asuragator
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    asuragator Well-Known Member

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    Question LD, what would you do if you don't believe your own client's version of events?
  12. Lawdog88
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    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

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    In the first consultation, I always ask my clients to tell me the complete truth and nothing but, because the "truth" (or the lack of being truthful) always comes out at trial, either in a credibility determination, or in an absurdity determination, by the jury. That usually clears up most problems up front, and we are off to a good, solid start.

    If they do change their story later, that doesn't necessarily mean that I do not believe the new story, because they could have simply realized that lying was not going to cut it. If the new story is suddenly more favorable because of the facts I have uncovered, the flags go up. If they persist and want to testify at trial, and I do not have a good faith belief that they are telling the truth, then I have to move to withdraw. Like I said earlier, that has only happened twice in a hundred jury trials, distilled from a couple thousand felony cases I have handled.

    Believing is not the same as knowing (as I often say in the religious threads), so technically, I cannot "know" whether any particular client is lying or not at any time, so I do have to give them great deference to the bounds of rational and common sense credibility, and that's what I tell them. In other words, if I have a hard time believing what they are saying, so will a jury.
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  13. asuragator
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    asuragator Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. Very admirable way of handling things, fwiw.
  14. Gatormb
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    Gatormb Well-Known Member

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    What do you call 100 attorneys at the.......never mind.o_O Too Hot exceptional's excepted!
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  15. 96Gatorcise
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    96Gatorcise Well-Known Member

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    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/18/jordan-davis-shooter-michael-dunn_n_4123805.html

    Dunn wrote some letters while in jail...

    In a letter to his grandmother, Dunn writes:

    so you think this will help his case? :rolleyes:
  16. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Not to say it's not admirable, LD strikes me as scrupulously ethical when he discusses his approach to the law, but it's worth noting in defense of the "overall profession", that some of that is just... his and any other attorney's duty as officers of the court (particularly, moving to withdraw in lieu of knowingly allowing someone to give testimony with that good faith belief that it's false -- even your own client).
  17. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    I think if the SAO for the 4th Judicial Circuit wants to lose another case, they should try to make race a major factor in this case. What do they say in football? Don't let a team beat you twice? Don't lose the Zimmerman trial twice here. Guy's opening -- at least the soundbite coverage -- seemed to be much more focused. Aim small, miss small; Dunn shot because he was being disrespected by a punk kid not respecting his elders.
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  18. 96Gatorcise
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    96Gatorcise Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you, keep it simple. It seems pretty simple the guy fired his gun out of anger not fear. But writing his thoughts down about how he views "certain cultures" as he puts it, does not shine a good light on his character.
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  19. WESGATORS
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    WESGATORS Well-Known Member

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    One of the things I enjoy about this board is the unique perspectives that people have to offer. LD's perspective as a defense attorney has always been among my favorite reads.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
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  20. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Agree. Going to add GatorBen to that compliment, as well.
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