Uh oh....standing his ground...

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by outbackjack, Jul 27, 2013.

  1. Tasselhoff
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    Tasselhoff Well-Known Member

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    Not worked up. I just fully understand why the man did what he did.
    Some are acting like he was cold blooded murder.
    I also lived in N O. It isn't a nice town.

    Kid cutting through to get home before curfew? Neighborlooking for lost dog? Both would have called out and said something as soon as the guy was seen. And I was not threatening any of you parriculary. I was just saying I would not be in a generous mood and might much as this man did. But all things being equal...lets all just wait till more facts come out and see where this leads.
  2. OB1
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    OB1 Active Member

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    Sorry, not locking myself inside and hoping my stuff isn't stolen or vandalized.

    I will call 911, but will not wait for them to come. People have the right to protect their property, not necessarily with deadly force.

    Sent by ANDROID peanut butter fudge using Gator Country
  3. AndyGator
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    AndyGator Well-Known Member

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    There are going to be dozens, if not hundreds, of non-friendly interfaces every day in the state of Florida. Many of them will involve teenage boys since they have - surprise, surprise - attitude issues.

    So where do you draw the line. SYG is too vague, IMO. There are too many special cases to consider to print them into law. So are we going to have teenagers shot because they went to the store for skittles and Iced tea, or shot their mouths off in a gas station, or out after curfew in delinquent activities?

    As I stated before, SYG is a schizophrenics dream state. Ever been around a paranoid personality? They see evil intent in every move and every sentence.

    So where do you draw the line?
  4. rounds
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    rounds New Member

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    Behind a locked iron gate and fence in a high crime neighborhood??
    C'mon Nana, you are better than this.
  5. rounds
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    rounds New Member

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    Some facts:
    3 blocks from the French Quarter
    Close to the projects
    Kid was awaiting armed-robbery trial
    Multiple arrests for stealing
    Father died cancer 3 yrs. ago
    Mother made him transfer schools to keep him away from younger brother
    23 y.o. brother trying to direct him, but called him a professional thief
    Earlier home invasion robbery in area that evening
    Area had history of burgularies
    Girl bartender murdered for tips walking home from work by 2 bicycling teens from projects
    Pregnant wife & 2 y.o. baby in home.
    Compound was all house & driveway, no yard, 1 tree.
  6. HallGator
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    HallGator Administrator VIP Member

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    Not saying any of these things are not factual but it would be nice if you gave a link to your source.
  7. Tasselhoff
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    Tasselhoff Well-Known Member

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    How sad. All of that and only 14. This kid had no chance in life.

    Andy syg has nothing to do with most of what you just posted.
    It had nothing to do with zimmerman, I think it will be proven to have nothing to with the gas station shooting and it has nothing to do with the NO shooting. None of this has nothing to do with syg. NOTHING. Please stop trying to argue against a law that you cannot find one example of abuse of.
  8. rounds
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    rounds New Member

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    Most are upthread at 7:02 nana post. Some are from living in NO.
  9. GatorNorth
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    GatorNorth Premium Member Premium Member

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    Lets be honest, the shooting was probably a little anticipatory but anyone who hops a fence onto private property at almost 2 in the morning isn't there to sell Sally Foster.
  10. outbackjack
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    outbackjack Premium Member

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    Two situations.....love an answer by thise smarter than me....


    1. So if the kid broke into his car, stole whatever was in there....Does the dad call 911 silently and allow the burglary to happen? Does he "confront" the criminal? If so, what do you say? "I have a gun. Please stop." ? What if he calls your bluff and just walks away with your stuff? Clearly it would take cops 10-15 minutes to get there.....he's be long gone.

    2. What if you don't shoot until he comes to your door, as
    some have suggested. But, as he walks around/behind yourhouse
    you lose sight of him. It is 1:40 a.m., and he's trying to be sneaky
    after all.....talk about a scary situation. Now you know he's out
    there, up to no good, and you don't know exactly where he is.

    I would be terrified he'd wave to a friend and now 2 or 3
    Could conceivably come into your home.

    The more I put myself in the actual situation,
    The more I think is do the same.
  11. outbackjack
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    outbackjack Premium Member

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    And while he hit him in his head, I highly doubt this was a trained
    Assassin.....you just shoot and hope you hit something. 30 feet away
    that's near half court on a basketball court. I bet he was as
    Shocked as anyone he even hit the guy, much less in the head.
    And he only fired one shot.
    Not to mention its nearly pitch dark.
  12. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    But this is also, in and of itself, not something people get executed for. This is why the castle doctrine's presumption is a rebuttable one -- not every shooting of an intruder on one's property is conclusively reasonable.
  13. Tasselhoff
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    Tasselhoff Well-Known Member

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    Look I understand this.... my only point is that I can fully understand why the man acted as he did. To me it is understandable. Frightened, half awake, adrenaline. I understand his position and why he shot. It is understandable.

    Again before claiming guilt or innocence I will wait for more facts to come out.
  14. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Oh, I could certainly be convinced that it is a valid shooting, but it isn't exactly the Zimmerman case's facts at the end of the state's case right now. Nor, though, is it the incredibly dubious facts in the Rodriguez case in Texas, who with such seeming calm, recorded all the fear he felt for his life before shooting one of his neighbors. This case seems to occupy that murky middle ground.
  15. HallGator
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    The one I was most interested in was the one you cited about awaiting armed robbery trial. According to the link it was robbery charges with no mention of the "armed" part. Doesn't make him any less guilty of the things he did but it does show whether he was more of a threat in my opinion.
  16. rounds
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    rounds New Member

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    You are correct. I went back and it is not in that 702 link. I read it in a google search somewhere, but can't relocate it now about armed robbery vs just burglary.
  17. outbackjack
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    outbackjack Premium Member

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    Where do I draw the line? Good question, but I can assure you....jumping a locked fence and "messing" around someone's yard at 1:40 a.m.....would be on the criminal intent side of the line.
  18. outbackjack
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    outbackjack Premium Member

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    What seems to be lost in this is what is his "place of residence"?

    To me, his place of residence would be his lot that he owns, that he has clearly fenced off. It is clearly defined where to stay out of or else you'll be on/in his residence.

    Once you cleared the 6 foot, you are now on/in his place of residence.

    Semantics are just that...if you don't consider his fenced yard his POR, would you consider his porch? What about his foyer?
  19. WESGATORS
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    I don't have a problem with someone shooting someone who is potentially stealing from them on their own property, BUT, if you're going to be that person, you need to have proper warnings posted up on your property. As long as you give full disclosure, I don't have a problem with your right to protect your property with lethal force. I just don't want to move into a neighborhood where my son is going to go into your yard to retrieve a ball (at whatever time of the day) and you are going to presume him to be a thief and shoot at him. I respect the legal right to do so (whether or not it currently exists), but I believe I have a right to know about your intentions and allow for me to plan accordingly.

    Go GATORS!
    ,WESGATORS
  20. outbackjack
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    outbackjack Premium Member

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    Would your son scale a 6 foot fence to get his ball?

    Wes, the "posted warnings" are the large fence he built around his property.

    And I'm not sure I fully understand your point of ......regardless of the time.

    2:00 in the morning?

    Absolutely comes into play here.

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