Theoretical - Sammy Watkins (or who) @ UF

Discussion in 'Swamp Gas' started by severnt, Jan 4, 2014.

  1. severnt
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    severnt Member

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    I've asked myself this question each year watching Clemson. I'm not sure there was any other single player from that class that could have changed our win/loss more than him. Watching the bowl games, what one player do you believe, had we gotten his LOI, would have most changed our win/loss ratio? Assume all things same: injuries, coaches, other players, etc...
  2. antny
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    antny Well-Known Member

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    A QB, although if all things are the same we would still struggle with the injuries , Oline, linebacker depth etc etc

    Percy was a Force on the field and even he could only do so much. I have watkins on par with harvin if not a minimal notch behind
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  3. severnt
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    severnt Member

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    We lost our top two quarterbacks this year, we didn't lose our top two receivers.. that's what I'm kind of saying.
  4. severnt
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    severnt Member

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    I suppose another way to look at it, replace Patton with Sammy Watkins (same amount of play this year). I don't want to say it that way, because Patton really was impressive this year and seemed to work his tail off. Just saying, what if instead of Patton it was Watkins as our top "go to" receiver and returner this year. I've actually thought this even more in previous years (because we seemed to JUST need a capable top receiver).
  5. antny
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    antny Well-Known Member

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    I see your point but with morningwheg throwing and our Oline blocking....? I guess its possible having him would have meant a better red zone option so miami and lsu and a couple others may have been wins
  6. severnt
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    severnt Member

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    I just think out of any one player, over and over I return to him being a huge miss (and sorry if this sounds recruiting, but since I'm talking about current players in college). This is a retrospect question. Watkins would have come in with CM (2011) and still be playing.
  7. OaktownGator
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    OaktownGator Well-Known Member

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    Watkins is a great player, and would have helped us for sure. It is tough to tell how much he would have helped given the state of our pass game all the way around... protection, QB play and play calling.
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  8. severnt
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    severnt Member

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    I think Morningwheg to Watkins could have been a phrase often heard at the end of the year (even if he's always locking in on Watkins, throw it up!) or hand-off to Watkins or "fantastic return by Watkins".
  9. LimeyGator
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    LimeyGator Well-Known Member

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    Clowney.

    Why? 2 reasons.

    1) He is a dominant football player at college level. If we had Clowney with Easley, Floyd and RoPo, we'd have won a National Championship the year before last, I'm certain and we'd have been a lot better this year (and in Muschamp's first year too), which would have helped the win-loss record.

    Floyd led the team in 2012 year with 13 TFLs (Clowney had 23.5) and the leading Gator had 4 sacks (Easley) across the whole season. Clowney had 13 alone. Now, I appreciate that Clowney is a defensive player and people remember all of our offensive turnovers against Georgia, but I believe the lack of pass rush really hurt us too in that game. No sacks. Georgia moved the ball when it had to. Add in Clowney, I honestly think you've one of the best College Defenses of the era when you look at our linebackers and DBs - a bunch of them will start in the NFL.

    2) Momentum. We had the top class in 2010 and if we'd landed Clowney too in 2011, can you imagine what it would have done for our recruiting class? People might have been talking about us as the dominant force in college football rather than Bama. A few of the guys we 'missed' that year might well have come our way and that would have changed a lot. Clowney could have done that, I'm not sure that Watkins would on his recruitment alone.

    The only other guy I can put into the conversation here is Teddy Bridgewater. A potential No.1 draft pick QB (in theory, at least) could have been special in Orange and Blue.
  10. phideltgator
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    phideltgator Active Member

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    Someday we are going to realize that without a top stud qb, you are going nowhere. I would take any of the winning qb's in the past 5 bowl games.
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  11. DMann
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    DMann Well-Known Member

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    The nation's top teams seem to have a freak or two. Spur's, Dabo, Urban, Fisher, Strong, O'Leary, etc. all have at least one very special talent they can ride. Some of these freaks are/were freshmen when they took their teams to the top. How have we struck out the past 5 years - with coaches or talent? Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
  12. LimeyGator
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    LimeyGator Well-Known Member

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    Oh, now this is going to get me going...

    I'm sure everyone watching college football realises that you need a good QB to "take", but I must confess I'm interested to know how you propose we identify them? You didn't mention so it got me pondering.

    I did a bit of research using Rivals (and kept the same provider as I wanted to ensure consistency of grading) and this is what they thought of our QB recruiting for the past 12 years and 1 ahead of us...

    2002 - Gavin Dickey (DT-QB #4, 4 stars) & Patrick Dosh (DT-QB #NR, 3 stars)
    2003 - Chris Leak (Pro-QB #3, 4 stars) & Justin Midgett (Pro-QB #8, 4 stars)
    2004 - no QB
    2005 - Josh Portis (DT-QB #4, 4 stars)
    2006 - Tim Tebow (DT-QB #1, 5 stars)
    2007 - Cam Newton (DT-QB #2, 5 stars) & John Brantley (Pro-QB #3 QB, 4 stars)
    2008 - no QB
    2009 - Jordan Reed (DT-QB #10, 4 stars)
    2010 - Trey Burton (DT-QB #17, 3 stars) & Tyler Murphy (QB-?, #NR, NR)
    2011 - Jeff Driskel (Pro-QB #1, 4 stars) & Jacoby Brissett (DT-QB #3, 4 stars)
    2012 - Skyler Morningweg (DT-QB, #NR, 3 stars)
    2013 - Max Staver (Pro-QB, #NR, 3 stars)
    2014 - Will Grier (DT-QB, #2, 4 stars)

    As far as I can see to my non-expert eye, Rivals certainly thought we'd been adding some good players at QB.

    By my count, over that 13 year span, Rivals seemed to think we have a 'top 10 QB' on no fewer than 11 occasions, all listed as 4-star recruits or better. That sounds like we've been doing a decent job according to the numbers, right?

    But then I wondered what you meant by 'Top Stud QB' - maybe if you meant 5-stars alone. By that bill, yes, Tebow and Newton went on to win National Championships and a Heisman each, so I could see some merit in pursuing it. But then so did Chris Leak (a meagre 4-Star...), so I thought I'd best check that line of enquiry out too.
    Rivals '5 star' QBs by year

    2002 - Vince Young (1 National Championship in 2005 with Texas), Ben Olsen, Marcus (not Mike!) Vick, Trent Edwards, James Banks,
    2003 - Kyle Wright,
    2004 - Rhett Bomar, Xavier Lee, Chad Henne, Matthew Tuiasosopo,
    2005 - Mark Sanchez, Ryan Perrilloux,
    2006 - Matthew Stafford , Mitch Mustain, Tim Tebow (2* National Championships in 2006, 2008),
    2007 - Jimmy Clausen, Ryan Mallett, Tyrod Taylor, Cam Newton (1 National Championship in 2010),
    2008 - Terrelle Pryor, Blaine Gabbert, Dayne Crist,
    2009 - Matt Barkley, Russell Shepard, Garrett Gilbert,
    2010 - no 5 stars
    2011 - no 5 stars
    2012 - Jameis Winston (----????), Gunner Kiel,
    2013 - Max Browne, Christian Hackenberg,
    2014 - Kyle Allen, DeShaun Watson

    So out of 31 QBs listed as 5-stars by Rivals, just 3 of them have won National Championships, two of which signed LOI's to play at Florida! Hmm. That's a lot of stud-flunks, it seems.

    So I wanted to know who actually were the Championship winning QBs and find out why they weren't 'top Stud' recruits... what were they considered? I checked, of course:

    2005 - Vince Young (5 Stars, #1 DT-QB 2002)
    2006 - Chris Leak (4 Stars, #3 Pro-QB 2003)
    2007 - Matt Flynn ( 4 Stars, #16 Pro-QB 2003)
    2008 - Tim Tebow (5 Stars, #1 DT-QB 2006)
    2009 - Greg McElroy (3 Stars, #11 Pro-QB 2006)
    2010 - Cam Newton (5 Stars, #2 DT-QB 2007)
    2011 - AJ McCarron (4 Stars, #7 Pro-QB 2008)
    2012 - AJ McCarron (4 Stars, #7 Pro-QB 2008)
    2013 either Jameis Winston (5 Stars, #1 DT-QB 2012) or Nick Marshall (4 stars, #15 ATH 2011)

    All in all, a seriously mixed bag, where the No.1 guy has only won it 2 times in the past 8 years, and if Winston wins this year then it will be 3 in 9. Defining what 'top stud' is, certainly has its difficulties. It shows that a 'Top 10 QB', kind of like Florida has signed 11 times in the past 13 years, is going to give you a shot to win it all.

    Unless I'm missing something else, I don't know what else can be expected. It's easy to say we'd "take" someone else's QB that won in a recent bowl game but that's hindsight and it sort of doesn't work in the real world.

    All in all, I think there are two important things to note here about UF QB recruiting that explain why people are so up in arms about Driskel.

    In the period from 2008-2010 classes,UF really didn't sign or develop a QB for life 'After Tebow' that turned into anything that lived up to the billing. Following one of the most successful college QBs of all time is tough, especially as you can see from the research that he was one of the few guys that came out of HS living up to their billing as the top QB over the past decade anyway. Driskel was the first 'big time' recruit we landed and he's instinctively going to get put in the same basket as Tim. Kind of a hiding to nothing really. Tebow was special.

    The second thing to consider here is, according these stats, no 'big time' QB recruited nationally since Tebow or Newton has amounted to any National Championship success anyway! No QB drafted from 2009 onwards has actually won a National Championship, until maybe this Monday!. It's not like anyone has had a smash hit on QB recruiting in that period when it comes with a reputation, it seems.

    For the record, a few names of highly-thought of QBs over the past 5 or so years:

    Bryce Petty (#25 Pro-QB, 2009)
    Tajh Boyd (#4 Pro-QB, 2009)
    Connor Shaw (#19 DT-QB, 2010) [1 place behind Trey Burton]
    Johnny Manziel (#14 DT-QB, 2011)
    Marcus Mariota (#12, DT-QB 2011)
    Teddy Bridgewater (#6 DT-QB, 2011)

    There are more, but they just add to the conclusion that 'taking' a QB is easy. Actually identifying one that will bring you a National Championship is near enough impossible!
  13. NorthCaptivaGator
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    NorthCaptivaGator Well-Known Member

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    Sammy Watkins would be in line for a big spring game if he had come here, having just learned the playbook and finally demonstrating enough blocking ability to start at WR as a redshirt junior
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  14. xenythx
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    xenythx Well-Known Member

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    I've heard Watkins has some character/attitude issues. He probably would have hardly seen the field under Muschamp.
  15. GCNumber7
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    GCNumber7 Well-Known Member

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    Whoever the best placekicker out there is. I don't think any one player would have helped the offense too much, but if we could make kicks we might have won another couple of games.
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2014
  16. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    Trick question as far as the offense goes, because no one could have fixed the sucky Offensive coordinators we've had the last three years (Weis and Pease). But, defense is a different matter. We missed of a ton of great defensive guy, but we landed a ton of great one too. I'll leave the list of players to you guys/gals.
  17. Tito22
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    Tito22 Premium Member

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    Any top QB
  18. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    We got the top QB. It's the offensive coordinators/line coaches that have sucked.
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  19. Tito22
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    Tito22 Premium Member

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    I mean top QB in college right now. Mariota, Manziel, Hundley, Braxton, Hogan, Teddy, and a few others are all better than the supposed top QB of that class.
  20. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    Say what you want about our QB, but he's only as good as the team and coaching around him...

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