The Real Reason the Country's Going Broke

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by ncbullgator, Feb 12, 2018.

  1. philobeddoe

    philobeddoe GC Hall of Fame

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    Interesting discussion. Answers are not simple.

    Something I've always wondered about the end of life. Setting aside the emotional aspect .... or the fact many suffer a mental incapacitation at the end of their life ........ what is the reason one wants to prolong life at the end? (Presently, we're presently going through this with a sibling with terminal metastatic lung cancer and they are wanting treatments to prolong life ... and the quality thereof is not good). But, why prolong? If you are a believer .... you leave a terrible existence for Paradise. If you are not a believer .... there is no afterlife ..... there is no continuing experience ...... so, why is the human existence and continuation thereof @ end of life important?

    And something else .... we always hope someone doesn't suffer a painful death. Why? doesn't matter for the very same reason ... a believer is in Paradise .... and a non-believer is surely not going to remember they suffered at the end. I always questioned the logic of "wanting" to continue the human existence via extreme medical treatment when it it really not meaningful.

    And one more thought ... given the cost of end of life treatment and the burden it places on so many ..... is it a sin for a believer to want to continue measures to extend the inevitable? Is it a form of gluttony ... waste that one should want to avoid?
  2. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    Why is it selfish to live an unhealthy lifestyle? If you want to enjoy life that way...you should.

    Selfish is thinking you have a right to someone else's labor for your benefit at their expense.
  3. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Selfish is thinking your "labor" is entirely your own. Selfish is thinking you owe nothing to your fellow Americans. Selfish is valuing a few bucks in your pocket over the lives of others.
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  4. studegator

    studegator All SEC

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    I asked a couple of them about the extreme waiting times I read about in the US media. They said for the most part, just go to a clinic a little further drive. They did not see this as an issue.
  5. studegator

    studegator All SEC

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    I'll add- get rid of the lobbiest and have term limits to curb Kingdom building by the politicians.
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  6. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    No. Selfish is thinking you have a right to someone else. Selfish is thinking you should be forced to provide legal services because your fee is too big of a burden. I mean who are you to charge $300 an hour/33% contingency fee (plus or minus)? You could clearly charge less. But instead choose to burden people with high costs for your services.

    ***That is not me complaining about lawyer fees. I just paid my $150ish bill to a fantastic employment attorney for a half hour of their time.***

    Just making the point of what selfish is...
  7. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    Going to a clinic and needing to see a cardiologist/oncologist/specialist are two different things. Could you survive the former...probably not gonna kill you. The latter however is a different issue. And both are longer.
  8. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Most lawyers do pro bono work for those who can't afford it. You weren't complaining about not getting paid for your labor as far as I understood it. You were complaining about paying taxes. Is that the correct interpretation?
  9. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    Doctors do plenty of pro bono work.

    I am just calling out your idea that selfish is living an unhealthy lifestyle.

    It is not.

    But thinking you have a right to someone else's life (labor) is absolutely selfish.
  10. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    It is when other people have to pay for your unhealthy lifestyle.

    I'm not sure what your point is for doctors. You were just talking about lawyers.

    And what do you mean by this? You're stating this in abstract terms. Do you mean taxation? Do you mean slavery? I'm not sure what point you're making.
  11. dynogator

    dynogator GC Hall of Fame

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    Me, too. And the sooner the better.
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  12. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 VIP Member

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    It's always all, or nothing, isn't it. :rolleyes:

    There is an in between, rational approach, to freebies that are given out to some people that may not deserve it. Slowing the increases alone would go a long way.
  13. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Ah yes, the in-between, rational approach of "take the freebies from the people who vote for the other side, but let the people who vote for us keep their freebies."
  14. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 VIP Member

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    That's what you said... Lawyers... :rolleyes: :D

    I said we should slow down the increases.
  15. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Kind of hard to slow down aging. Let me know if you figure out how. ;)
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  16. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 VIP Member

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    The inflation based increases that, are almost always more increase then the actual inflation rate increase.
  17. dynogator

    dynogator GC Hall of Fame

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    Perhaps in cases of dementia and Alzheimer's, individuals could draw up a legal document stating when they want treatment withheld; that is, at what point of diminished capacity should certain actions be taken? Have patients make decisions while they still can, knowing that sometime in the future they will be unable to do so. This approach would certainly give me some peace of mind, and a sense of control of my future.

    This document should include, IMO, an option for assisted suicide.
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  18. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    No one should be required to pay for someone's unhealthy lifestyle. You are the one advocating for that via universal healthcare. I am not.

    I used lawyers as an example as I assumed you were likely in that profession based on your name. The point is you are advocating to the right to a person's life who works in healthcare (doctor/nurse/tech/etc). So why should we not have a right to your life (services)?

    I don't think we should. But since you think it is okay to have a right to someone else's life I figured you would support universal legal services to bring down your high costs.
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  19. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer Premium Member

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    Lol. Seriously? They're not slaves, dude. They get paid.

    We already have that. They're called public defenders.
  20. QGator2414

    QGator2414 VIP Member

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    No they are not. Yet you have determined they should get paid what you feel is right.

    And no. We do not have universal legal services. Nice red herring though.

    I get you apparently should have the right to charge what your services are worth and those in another industry should not be able to.

    That is a definition of selfish for sure.