NBA Playoffs

Discussion in 'Nuttin' but Net' started by Allanon, Apr 19, 2014.

  1. bakaduin
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    bakaduin Super Moderator

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    Beal has been a great player for the Wizards but I can say that they embody the "team" philosophy as much as any squad in the NBA. Every one of their starters average double digit points. Every starter averages between 4.5 and 9 rpg and every one except their center, Gortat, chips in assists. This is to say, the Wizards wouldn't have made the payoffs without Beal but they equally wouldn't have made it without Gortat, Nene, Ariza, or Wall.
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  2. corpgator
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    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps, but I think they could find decent replacements for anyone but Wall.

    Beal on the other hand is a rare commodity in today's NBA. There's a always a lot of talk about the lack of talented bigs, but there are more of them than 2-guards. How many are better than him in the NBA right now? Harden is the only one I can definitely say yes about. He's still young too. The Wizards got a steal by drafting him since they'll have one of the best players at his position for years to come whereas every other player has plenty of others as good or better.
  3. bakaduin
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    bakaduin Super Moderator

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    The question is how important is the shooting guard in today's NBA? That isn't to say that there aren't great SGs in the NBA but if you are making your team from scratch you aren't going to get a whole lot of production from a SG except for the truly elite.

    In the Top 50 PER you will find that it breaks down as the following:
    PG- 12
    SG- 4
    SF-5 (But includes 3 of the top 10 players)
    PF- 16
    C-13

    The Top 50 EWA breaks down as follows:
    PG- 11
    SG- 6
    SF- 8
    PF-13
    C- 12

    I would put Beal as a top 5 SG at this current point with Harden, Wade, and Dragic definitively above him and probably DeRozan as well.
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  4. corpgator
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    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    And small forward includes 2 of the top 2 although Durant's role on offense tends more towards SG since he doesn't end up on the block much at all. Or you could say he handles the offensive load of both the 2 and 3 since they never put any competent wings beside him.

    Which 4 shooting guards did you find in the top 50 of PER? I guess Wade, but there's not a team in the league aside from Miami for sentimental reasons that wouldn't trade Wade for Beal. Better contract, better potential, doesn't missed 30+% of games because he's old, etc.

    I forgot about Dragic, but I think of him as more of a hybrid SG/PG, but then so is Harden. The offense runs through him and not the point guard. The same was true for Jordan, really. He averaged a triple double for 20 games when they flat had him run the point in 88 and the triangle was built for the ball to go through him.

    Beal's really the only SG in the mold of Kobe that I can think of right now who's a pure shooter who can also drive well, but a good shooter first. And he plays D too, something Harden only pretends at.

    Big men are coming back with a vengeance as your stats show, though. We're all living in the Brow's world; we just don't know it yet.

    And bigs will always be more valuable because of their larger defensive impact, but it's to replace production at positions where the talent is scarce.
  5. Bedlam
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    Bedlam Well-Known Member

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    He's not really like Kobe. He's pretty much just a shooter at this point, much more like Ray Allen than Kobe, but not as good as either. Beal doesn't have enough around the rim game. Less than 3 FT attempts per game. 42% on 2 point FG's leaves a lot to be desired. Kobe was always a wizard around the rim.

    If Beal develops that part of his game, he can become the best pure SG in the game. Kind of by default really though. The rise of the shoot first PG has killed the SG position.
  6. bakaduin
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    bakaduin Super Moderator

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    I think your point about Dragic and Harden illustrates my point. True SGs aren't as valuable in the NBA as other positions. There aren't many SGs in the PER top 50 and 2 of the 4 on there take on other roles (Manu and Wade being the two who don't).

    Beal finishes 23rd in PER and 18 in EWA for SGs. I think these numbers are artificially deflated because he is a bit inconsistent (which is to be expected for a young player) and he plays on a team that is very well rounded so he doesn't have to "carry them" like some of the other stars do. He is certainly better than a good number of the SGs ranked ahead of him.

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/sg

    There is the list with the top 5 being Harden/Wade/Dragic/Ginobili/DeRozan and I think you could make the case for all of them being a better SG. With Harden/Dragic you can argue the ball goes through them on offense so they are more hybrid 1/2 players. With Ginobili and Wade you can argue they play less minutes and take more games off respectively. I truly think DeRozan is a blossoming player in the tier just below All-Star much as Beal is.

    Beal is growing each year and is the 2nd most important player on the Wizards at the moment. That being said Washington has the best young backcourt in the NBA and they could end up being the best period if they get to spend their careers together.
  7. Ahab
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    Ahab Well-Known Member

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    Wizards still would have made the playoffs w/o Beal but that's only b/c the East sucks so bad. That said, I still love him as a player.
  8. Angaza
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    Lemarcus Aldridge going off against Houston.
  9. gatorr4life
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    gatorr4life Well-Known Member

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    Houston shouldn't be struggling against Portland. Way too much talent.
  10. Angaza
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    Angaza Member

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    They don't seem to run many plays.
  11. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    No, they really don't. Their entire system is based on transition ball action and lots of high ball screens. But they bog down terribly in the half-court and that is not a recipe for playoff success.

    And even though I am something of a Rockets fan, there is nothing more enjoyable than watching Terrance Jones get abused by Aldridge. What a show by the latter. He has been unbelievable the last two games. Sort of becoming an updated version of Shawn Kemp for the Rox. They have no one who can defend him.
  12. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    Everybody has talent in the NBA. It is all about matchups. What the Rox don't have is the ability to execute in the halfcourt against Portland's set defense (Batum and Matthews are doing great jobs defensively on Parsons and Harden) and defend Aldridge (he either backs Jones down or shoots over Asik).
  13. yellowboy90
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    yellowboy90 Member

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    I'm not a fan of Aldridge offensive game but he has played big so far. He takes a lot of bad shots and I question if he can continue to make them going forward plus the Blazers needed him to score 40+ for them to have a chance. Their going to need the others to step up at home to take this series. I think they can though.

    Re Beal: There are other metrics out there besides PER and they are not to favorable for Beal. I hope he improves but right now his game needs a lot of work.
  14. UFSECKINGS
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    UFSECKINGS Well-Known Member

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    So, are we all on the Wizards (Beal) bandwagon?
  15. corpgator
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    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    According to the sports VU cameras, they ran 1 Howard-Harden pick and roll the entire game yesterday. They should be running that play every time down the court.
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  16. Ahab
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    Ahab Well-Known Member

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    James Harden's defense is SO bad. He had 2 or 3 critical breakdowns at the end of the game last night. Until he starts competing on the defensive side of the ball, the Rockets aren't winning anything.
  17. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    The funny thing is that he played great defensively with the Thunder. I wonder if their pace and how much they depend upon him offensively has just worn him down. It would probably do him wonders to actually try and get in shape at some point in time.
  18. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    I agree with you. Stotts runs a lot of the old San Antonio stuff with them, like the Lillard-Aldridge flat ball screens to isolate Aldridge in pick and pop and high post situations. Then he can either back down a smaller player or shoot over a bigger player who has to worry about his quickness. You can't really help on a four who is 18-20 feet away from the basket. Their scheme works and it often frees up Lillard, Batum, Williams, and Wright for wing jumpers off those little flare screens or Matthews for cuts to the basket off the weakside. I like Stotts a lot. It helps that he learned a ton from Carlisle, as well.
  19. corpgator
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    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    He was never good defensively with OKC, mostly average, but he was never as bad as he is now with Houston.
  20. yellowboy90
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    Was not able to go back and watch this play but at the end of the 3rd qtr it looked like Harden didn't even try to get back on offense. I think they had like over 30 secs on the clock too. Luckily Beverly was able to hit a sot in the lane but what if he needed to kick it out? Harden was barely across the half court stripe. It was really weird.

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