Mob style politics in TX encouraged by PP Prez

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by JerseyGator01, Jun 26, 2013.

  1. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    Can be either, and either one can change their mind later too.

    What, you think if a woman says "Let's have sex" and a man says "Okay." that wasn't consensual sex because the woman didn't give the final ok in that exchange?

    [​IMG]
  2. gatorchamps0607
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    So its not really "my body my choice"?

    It's my body my choice unless this guy sweet talks me into having unprotected sex?
  3. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    Umm, my point is that no one categorically has the final say, because it depends on the situation.

    Noticed you didn't quote my example and respond to that. Let me know when you've come up with a witty explanation of how it jives with your ridiculous "women always have the final say and it therefore isn't the man's fault" narrative.
  4. gatorchamps0607
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    So in this situation the women isn't basically giving the man rights to have sex with her? In the end the woman is the receiver.. the only way to receive something is if you accept it. Hence the reason the woman always has the final say.

    Either way, this is all irrelevant because sex isn't even the worst part, its the part about not being protected and after that, not figuring out you're pregnant before you have to kill something that has a heart beat already.
  5. gatorchamps0607
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    Don't get your panties in a bunch, its not my fault you added a cute little gif and an irrelevant hypothetical to your post.
  6. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    That only matters because you've chosen to focus solely on the woman. If the man had said "no" the woman also wouldn't be pregnant. It takes both parties agreeing for consensual sex. Or to use your middle school narrative, you can only receive something if someone agrees to give it.
  7. gatorchamps0607
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    So then you agree the woman has to accept it, right? She also has to accept unprotected sex, right?

    Too easy.

    :grin:
  8. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a problem with abortion being available even if she had unprotected sex planning to have an abortion later. Do I think we should try to discourage people from wanting to? Sure. But I don't think we can or should tell them that they can't.

    The only reason I got involved with this discussion was to point out that your "last word" theory is moronic and that you can't have consensual sex without both parties, something that has apparently escaped your grasp.
  9. gatorchamps0607
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    Aww, when you're backed into a corner, you call people morons? That's cute.

    So you're trying to tell me a woman doesn't have the final say in sex/unprotected sex?

    So it's really not "my body my choice"?

    Can you at least pose some type of challenge in this discussion?
  10. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    My point is that there isn't a categorical answer. When something, by definition, requires both parties to agree, you can't categorically say that one or the other had the "final say." By definition it doesn't happen without both parties agreeing.

    If a woman has the "final say" in that she can refuse to have sex with a man, the man also had the "final say" because he could refuse to have sex with the woman. The entire point anyone is trying to make to you is that "pregnancy (or sex) is all the woman's fault" is wrong.
  11. gatorchamps0607
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    Getting pregnant is the woman's fault 100% of the time unless she is tricked or raped. Do you agree to that?
  12. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    A woman getting pregnant is also a man's fault 100% of the time without any exceptions at all. That's sort of the nature of an act that requires two people.
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  13. bovinagator
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    Gator Ben,
    I'm curious, if 5 clinics meet the requirements of the legislation what makes it " impossible" for the others?
    If Ford can meet the mpg requirements why can't Chevy?
  14. icequeen
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    icequeen Well-Known Member

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    You used the "pulling out" scenario as a viable birth control method. Tried many times by many people. It's not 100%, right? So if a woman is relying on the guy to pull out, and he doesn't, then it's her fault, right? Or if didn't pull out at the exact time and she gets pregnant, then that's her fault, too, right?

    Condoms break. So if she becomes pregnant that's her fault, too, right?

    If a guy puts on an ill-fitting condom and part of the semen comes out, that's the girl's fault, too, correct?

    Yes, it's a woman's body. Yes, it's her choice to open her legs as you keep putting it. But I guess when a guy agrees to sex he's actually doing it against his will? No. It's HIS choice to enter her, and therefore, HE should share some of the responsibility and not get out of it with just a "way to go, man" from his friends and family.

    And a guy, too, has a final say. He can pull out and say that it's wrong. He can keep it in his pants so if she opens her legs nothing can happen. He can be a man, say goodnight, and go home.

    You keep harping on a woman's personal responsibility. So men have none?

    And not that you particularly care, because frankly you're that far out there, but I have NO problems with not letting a woman have an abortion if the father wants the baby. I have NO problems with a father blocking an adoption because he wants the baby and he refuses to terminate his rights. (and I don't mean in the case of the few pregnancies from rape that do happen) And while I'm anti-abortion, I understand what would lead someone to think that's their only option.

    Your particular type of mentality is what gives the rest of us Republicans a bad name and makes it a nightmare to bring in more Republicans. You are the very caricature of an intolerant extremist Republican that Democrats parade around and say, "see? This is their party" versus letting us focus on the issues that are important.
  15. gatorchamps0607
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    So a woman who has the potential to get pregnant isn't at fault when she doesn't require the man to wear protection? I can understand an accident, it happens.. but to outright have no protection? Thats not ultimately on the woman? So again, it's not really "my body my choice" then?
  16. altalias
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    So when the Nazis killed the Jews it was not murder because the government approved?
  17. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    The law requires everyone practicing to have hospital admitting privileges within 30 miles of any clinic within which they practice. In some rural locations that completely rules it out.

    The bigger deal is that it requires any clinic to meet the standards for and be licensed as an ambulatory surgery center. Even for clinics that physically could be modified to meet those requirements, it would be prohibitively expensive for nearly all of them to meet and they would be forced out of business because of an inability to do so. That is, of course, the entire point of the bill.
  18. malligator
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    malligator Well-Known Member

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    If both parties are responsible, why don't both parties have to sign the papers to have the baby murdered? I'm 41 and childless. I'd love to be a father, but at this point in my life I probably never will be. If I got a woman pregnant who didn't want OUR child I'd "man up" and support her during the pregnancy and then raise MY child alone. I guarantee you there are many more men out there like me, but we don't get a choice. You want equality? Then support equality.

    ***ADDED***

    I saw you addressed this in a post while I was posting so this response isn't directed at you. My point still stands in general, though.
  19. gatorchamps0607
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    1. Technically, I never said pulling out was a good option for everyone, its very risky. I simply said it worked/works for me and my wife. In a situation where both are ok with pulling out, ok both are to blame but the woman still holds more blame in this situation.

    2. I addressed the condom breaking but that was after you had posted this response. That happens and I would put more blame on the guy, obviously.

    3. I am NOT a repiblican. I am NOT a democrat. I am NOT part of ANY political party. Supporting a crooked government party is no better than supporting a gang. I have my own thoughts without needing someone else to tell me what I should be thinking.
  20. JerseyGator01
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    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    It's arguable whether there is one facility in NJ that can treat my rather common form of cancer, yet the fringe left is upset over this in addition to judging the motive of the bill writers. It keeps getting better.

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