Michael Sam "I should have been drafted in first three rounds"

Discussion in 'Swamp Gas' started by tilly, May 11, 2014.

  1. OaktownGator
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    OaktownGator Well-Known Member

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    I didn't follow Jeffcoat.

    Do you think Sam was the best defensive player in the SEC (which is what I was getting at wrt the award he won)?
  2. gatorman_07732
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    Jadeveon Clowney even with all his issues in 2013 is a much better defensive player.
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  3. Hurtin4certain
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    There it is! He does seem to be a very proud gay man. Overhyped by the media, mediocre player, and he prefers dudes. So what? He will get his chance to compete on the field and we will see how he stacks up against NFL talent. Even women get open tryouts as kickers if I'm not mistaken.
  4. bigkid12
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    Why do you keep using 4.8? He ran 4.91. Only 6 guys outta 28 De's ran slower then him. The previous year, only 7 ran slower and 3 of those guys are 300+ lbs who will play DT or DE in a 3-4. He was a tweener who ran really slow. Then he thinks he should have went in the first 3 rounds? He's dreaming. If you're a tweener, you better run fast and be strong. He's neither.
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  5. G8R8U2
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    G8R8U2 Well-Known Member

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    Nope, nor do I think what he said was a very bright idea.

    I just don't think his 40 time was that unusual or a major factor in where he got drafted.

    I looked at the official combine 40 times, and his just doesn't stand out very significantly from the others... as I said before, his own teammate had a slower 40 and got drafted higher.

    These are just the guys that actually ran a 40; there's another 6 who chose not to run, some of whom probably chose not to because they know they're slow.

    Jadeveon ClowneyDEJr[​IMG]6-5 266 4.53
    Larry WebsterDErSr[​IMG]6-6 252 4.58
    Jackson JeffcoatDESr[​IMG]6-3 247 4.63
    Marcus SmithDESr[​IMG]6-3 251 4.68
    James GayleDErSr[​IMG]6-4 259 4.70
    Chris SmithDESr[​IMG]6-1 266 4.71
    Kareem MartinDESr[​IMG]6-6 272 4.72
    Will ClarkeDErSr[​IMG]6-6 271 4.77
    Demarcus LawrenceDErJr[​IMG]6-3 251 4.80
    Zach MooreDErSr[​IMG]6-5 269 4.84
    Scott CrichtonDErJr[​IMG]6-3 273 4.84
    Trent MurphyDErSr[​IMG]6-5 250 4.86
    Cassius MarshDESr[​IMG]6-4 252 4.89
    Ethan WestbrooksDESr[​IMG]6-3 267 4.90
    Michael SamDErSr[​IMG]6-2 261 4.91
    Kony EalyDErJr[​IMG]6-4 273 4.92
    Tevin MimsDESr[​IMG]6-4 260 4.95
    Kerry WynnDErSr[​IMG]6-5 266 4.97
    IK EnemkpaliDErSr[​IMG]6-1 261 5.01
    Josh MauroDErSr[​IMG]6-6 271 5.21

    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/combine/2014/ALL/DE/?:sort_col=7&:sort_dir=-1

    Spikes was drafted as a LB and he ran over 5, even with a beneficial hand-timed clock, right?
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  6. G8R8U2
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    G8R8U2 Well-Known Member

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    I used 4.8 because if you look at the next few times, they're like 4.84, and I just don't see much of a difference between a 4.84 and 4.9 (or 4.91)... I guarantee you the difference isn't noticeable with the naked eye, and like Belichick said regarding Spikes back when he ran 5+, it just isn't that important.

    I agree at his size he should have been faster, but again, if you look at the other times, there are guys lighter than him who ran virtually the same time or slower.

    I just don't think his combine numbers alone are responsible for his draft spot. At the beginning of the thread I said where he landed was not far off because most mocks had him going anywhere from 4-7.

    But if he'd never opened his mouth I think he'd have gone sooner, maybe 5th or 6th... it only takes 1 GM not wanting the headache to move you to another whole round because not every team needs a DE.
  7. gatorman_07732
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    It's not like the 40 is the only measureable exercise at the Combine. Sam had a poor showing in everything.

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-winners-and-losers-from-indianapolis/page/15

    I'm also saying this isn't the only reason he drafted so low. He is a man without a position in the NFL as they say and in addition there is the big elephant in the room as well, all contributing to his stock.
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  8. bigkid12
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    It wasn't even just his 40. His 3 cone was horrendous. Really poor agility. On par with 330 lb guards. 2nd worst bench outta all the DL's. If he came in and lifted 25 reps and ran 4.7 he would have gone higher. The workout was a major reason for his fall. A small part could be his sexual orentiaton. I mean if you're gonna take a guy who's gonna be a potential distraction, a slow, weaker tweener is not a guy a lot of teams wanna take a risk on.
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
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  9. ACCecil
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    ACCecil Well-Known Member

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    And a 4.91 is not the same as a 4.84 or 4.8 because a 4.8 can cover a 4.6 or 4.5 but that is pushing it because part of it isn't just top end speed but speed in and out of breaks (quickness). a 4.91 trying to cover a 4.6 or 4.5 ain't going to work. It does make a huge difference. And don't even ask me about 4.91 trying to cover a real burner like 4.3, 4.4 or 4.5.

    AzCat brought up Teddy Bruschi. That is a good comparison. Bruschi worked his ass off and ended up at MLB or OLB which is where a 260 lb guy belongs in the NFL. Then, on passing downs, he can stick his hand in the dirt and rush around those 330 lb slobs or he can act like he is rushing and drop into a zone. Fine. He has a shot at making the team but if he is 260 (undersized) and 4.91 (too slow) he can't play MLB or OLB and his chances as a FT DE are marginal. The goal is to make the team not get drafted. The tears are fine but lets not go overboard either as Atlanta put it very well in both his posts. Don't make a spectacle of yourself.

    Other guys cried .... no problem, But some of them are locks to make the team and get a big contract. Sam isn't. That is why I compared him to the people on American Idol who get invited to Hollywood, the first cut, and run around screaming and crying and mugging for the camera exclaiming how their life just changed. No, it really didn't. You got a long way to go. I'll say it again .... I am glad he got drafted, I could give a flying damn about his sexuality, but he is, so far. not playing his cards right with the kissing, allowing himself to be used by the media and having all th cameras there, putting himself "out there" so much, etc. Just stop. Jackie Robinson endured the abuse. He let his play do his talking. He was quietly determined. Sam could learn a lot from that kind of quiet humility.

    I doubt seriously he will make the team.
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  10. grant1
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    grant1 Well-Known Member

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    The NFL scouts found that he feasted on the cupcakes and teams with no OL (see UF), but disappeared against better OLs. That's why he slid (and his measurable).
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  11. StrangeGator
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    StrangeGator Well-Known Member

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    I have certain expectations about gay men whether they are football players or not. I was a little disappointed in his clothes. I expect a gay man waiting on an NFL signing bonus to dress better than that. Wasn't impressed with his boyfriend either. If you're going to kiss on national TV, both of you have to look your gay best. I will withhold judgement on his taste until he buys and decorates his house.
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  12. StrangeGator
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    You watch American Idol? I thought only women and gay men watched that show.

    You know I'm kidding.
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  13. atlantagator86
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    atlantagator86 Well-Known Member

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    You totally lost me here. Of course he's going to get his chance to prove himself to be an NFL player. Nobody has said anything otherwise. So what's the point you're trying to make here?

    The point that some of us are making is that by going well beyond just announcing he's gay and really putting his sexuality out in the public, he stands the risk of becoming a distraction in the clubhouse. That has nothing to do with talent. As others have paralleled, this could wind up being quite similar to the situation with Tebow where his lifestyle and the media circus that surrounded it overshadowed the talent.
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  14. GATORAZ
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    I really dont think he is better than where he got drafted. He sucks athletically

    Here is an excerpt from an article written about the Rams draft

    http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/0ap2...m-an-inside-look?akmobile=ios&akcarrier=other

    Before Demoff and Snead departed, the subject of Sam came up, but there wasn't a lot of serious discussion: Viewed as a "tweener" who doesn't necessarily fit their 4-3 scheme, Sam wasn't high on the Rams' draft board, and it was assumed he'd be gone by the time the team made its four picks in the seventh round, which was about where they had him rated.
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  15. gatorman_07732
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    gatorman_07732 Well-Known Member

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    Geez, couldn't you have picked a better word. ;)
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  16. gatorcity
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    So how did this guy win SEC defensive player of the year by "only dominating 3 terrible OTs"? Is the SEC that bad at defense nowadays? There wasn't anyone else more worthy?
  17. gatordavisl
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    gatordavisl Well-Known Member

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    Your best p0st, imo. Not that that's saying much. :p
  18. gatorr4life
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    gatorr4life Well-Known Member

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    So wrong... Lol
  19. OaktownGator
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    Others have mentioned this, but look at all of his measurables. The Cone drill is the most applicable speed/agility time for a DE (and probably most positions). Sam ran 7.80 - easily the slowest time of all the DEs... more than a second slower than his teammate Ealy who ran basically the same 40 time.

    He was also tied for the weakest in bench reps, and had the lowest vertical.

    Slow, inagile, weak and non-explosive is no way to make it in the NFL.

    And the circus act doesn't help him either.
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  20. mdfgator
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    mdfgator Well-Known Member

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    I think that's the debate, I am sure his being gay hurt him, however, he has questions regarding his projection the the nfl. It's a different game. The sec is great, but there are plenty of tackles that are not very good..he beat the ones that were not great, you can't beat great tackles on hustle alone....

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