Liberals have created their perfect Utopia.

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by theorangebluewinagain, Aug 24, 2013.

  1. oldgator

    oldgator Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    13,605
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings Received:
    +139
    it would be real interesting to see the number of Dems on welfare, food stamps, etc and the number of Republicans on welfare, food stamps, etc

    no doubt the number is likely quite large for number of Dems receiving such moneys from the taxpayers

    But don't underestimate republicans and dems living in trailer parks, etc. There are likely a large(not as large as dems) number of Republicans living off of taxpayers also.


    In any case---I am all for more rigorous work requirements for people to receive taxpayer money. ie--military service, regular private sector jobs, even public works projects to improve infrastructure.
  2. gatordowneast

    gatordowneast Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    11,747
    Likes Received:
    303
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +985
    No party, race, ethnic group has a monopoly on stupid. Nor do any have a monopoly on food stamps, housing vouchers, medicaid, aid to dependent children, head start, obama phones and the 82 other federal "free shit" programs.

    That said, the one group that has done better under Obama is the "mooch class". Think about it. Of the top earners, taxes have all gone up, bonuses for most are not as aggressive as 5 years ago...the inherited wealth or super wealthy are not impacted as their income is through trusts. The middle class has been raped by Obama. Mooches have had it pretty damn good. 99 weeks of unemployment with all the freebies you can sign up for.
  3. wargunfan

    wargunfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2010
    Messages:
    4,567
    Likes Received:
    149
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Inside your head.
    Ratings Received:
    +189
    Smoking opium was once unknown in China. And then in the 18th century the British introduced opium laced tobacco into China. Soon hundreds of thousands of Chinese were addicted to opium and spent all their days getting high in opium dens. The Chinese were not lazy or stupid but once addicted nothing could stop the destruction of their lives brought on by opium.
    Cradle to grave welfare was once unknown in America. And then in the 20th century the Democrats introduced federal welfare into America. Soon millions of Americans were addicted to government handouts and spent all their days watching TV and eating free cheese. The Americans were not lazy or stupid but once addicted to welfare nothing could stop the destruction of their characters brought on by government handouts.
    Moral of the story: It would be cheaper to give them free opium.
  4. MtownGator

    MtownGator Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2012
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    213
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Memphis,Tn
    Ratings Received:
    +321
    Not on any side -
    I feel like - you study and learn and get a good job and a pay that allows you to live within your means, then you have nothing to complain about.

    I did read an article the other night that said that some states were paying 15 dollars an hour when it was all broken down to those who used the system and that it was killing the ambition of anyone who went to work full time for the minimum wage of 7 n change........Time to take away the free ride for those who wont get off their asses.
  5. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    33,046
    Likes Received:
    2,513
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings Received:
    +4,549
    These (Democrats') tactics are all about BUYING VOTES!
  6. umcpgator

    umcpgator Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2007
    Messages:
    1,130
    Likes Received:
    24
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Maryland
    Ratings Received:
    +37
    You are full of it if you actually believe that historical account about opium in China. There is about 400 years of previous opium use that you skipped over.

    Also welfare was known since Roman times and the idea of alms has been promoted throughout history by various religions not just governments as acts of virtue.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium#Recreational_use_in_China
  7. GatorRade

    GatorRade Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    6,939
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +750
    Then how do you explain the millions of non-politician citizens in the US that also favor a social safety net?
  8. gatordowneast

    gatordowneast Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    11,747
    Likes Received:
    303
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings Received:
    +985
    Rade, we (demo, pub, indep, libertarian, green) all agree that a social safety net is imperative. Clinton, working with the Pub house, collaborated and came up with a welfare program that worked fairly well.

    Unfortunately, our social safety net has again exploded into a LIFESTYLE.

    Can anyone honestly say that is a good thing? The self esteem of people who can work but don't is awful. Their kids watching their parent or parents mooch and freeload...not good. I'm a proponent of placing a 2 year consecutive and 5 year total lifetime max for any and all "federal" aid. After you run out, you rely on churches and charitable organizations.
  9. GatorRade

    GatorRade Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    6,939
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +750
    I think everyone can agree that we do not want a welfare system that actually makes people useless, and I think the article illustrates such a danger. I was specifically referring to rick's insinuation that all democrats simply endorse welfare for votes and not social good.
  10. wargunfan

    wargunfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2010
    Messages:
    4,567
    Likes Received:
    149
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Inside your head.
    Ratings Received:
    +189
    Of course there was opium use in China before the British. But the British forced huge quantities opium laced tobacco into China at the point of a gun. And yes the Romans kept the peace by giving the masses bread and circuses. Got any more middle school history lessons for us?
  11. Matthanuf06

    Matthanuf06 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Messages:
    10,825
    Likes Received:
    17
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings Received:
    +17
    Lazy, smart, etc is just semantics in the political context.

    Humans work in their self interest. They want food, water, shelter, money, and happiness.

    It is all about incentives in regards to self interest.

    Wealth redistribution causes people not to work because they are incentivized not to work. It is against their self interest. It is the rational thing to do.

    The main problem with socialism is that it focuses on emotions rather than incentives and self interest. They want to do what they perceive is right, moral and for the greater good. But it's all on the surface level, and they ignore all consequences. They ignore how their policies will impact the behavior of individuals.

    Socialism cannot work because while they can implement it broadly they cannot make individuals act in such a manner. Individuals will always act on their self interest. Socialism requires that they act for the greater good
    • Like Like x 1
  12. GatorRade

    GatorRade Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    6,939
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings Received:
    +750
    This is a model for human behavior that I can get behind. It is simple, so there are going to be many exceptions to the generalizations, but it generally works on a population level. And not only can it more accurately predict behavior than the "All ________ are lazy" model, it recognizes that people are people. See below.

    I am not sure this is true. I think that to you it is semantics, but others that throw around the words "All __________ are lazy/stupid/evil" actually believe that there is something inherently different in those people. They allow their tribal instincts to turn these people into something less - something worthy of scorn or pity. I think this trend is dangerous. It isn't just a matter of disagreement in their minds, at that point. The other tribe is seen as incapable of honesty, analysis, and/or hard work. They can't be trusted. Apart from being a generally appalling worldview, it could be dangerous to democracy.
  13. wgbgator

    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Messages:
    23,116
    Likes Received:
    403
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Ratings Received:
    +1,674
    http://www.businessinsider.com/does...ce=slate&utm_medium=referral&utm_term=partner

    A few issues with the Cato study:

    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page