Jimmy Buffett has fooled you.

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by ncbullgator, Feb 12, 2018.

  1. GatorBen

    GatorBen Premium Member

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    Phish and Widespread Panic probably have the best claim to carrying on the Dead's "ethos."

    They're different enough in how they jam and the resulting feel of their music. The Dead were not the best musicians, but had phenomenal song-writers working with them and a natural ear, and thrived on chaos and disorder musically. Phish, at least originally, were very technically talented nerds whose musical construction was significantly less organic seeming than the Dead - and their jam sessions were much more organized as a result. Compare some of the crazy Dead jams, like Playing in the Band in its oddball 10/4 time signature that morphs out into one (or two, or three or four) other songs and then comes crashing back into Playing, or the 35 minute long versions of The Other One (or 45 minute Dark Stars), with Phish jams and the difference I'm talking about gets clearer.

    Do yourself a favor and go see a Dead & Co. show while Bobby, Mickey, and Bill are still touring. I know, I know, "but John Mayer...". It's worth it.
  2. anstro76

    anstro76 GC Hall of Fame

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    Phish plays long improvised jams much like the Dead, the comparison ends there. Trey is no Jerry
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  3. anstro76

    anstro76 GC Hall of Fame

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    Ben come on, the Grateful Dead was filled with great musicians. Jerry could proficiently play any instrument with a string. Bobby redefined the role of the rhythm guitarist, and Phil is a classically trained musician who happens to play bass
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  4. wgbgator

    wgbgator Very Stable Genius Premium Member

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    The Dead came out of the folk revival scene, so I think they have a little bit more of an 'Americana' vibe than Phish. Jerry Garcia was in a bluegrass band and played banjo prior to the Dead. I also wouldn't say the Dead had 'phenomenal' song writers, though some of their original tunes are classics for sure. Personally, I think they were at their best when they were jamming/riffing on older folky tunes or rock songs.
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  5. GatorBen

    GatorBen Premium Member

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    Let me clarify that the post was intended to be a bash on Phish, who I'm not a particularly big fan of, not the Dead. Heck, I subscribe to XM solely to get the Grateful Dead channel, which is basically all I listen to on the radio.

    I'm not trying to suggest that they weren't good musicians, just saying that, aside from maybe Jerry, no one was going to go out with the assertion that they were some of the most technically talented musicians ever. But that's okay, because what made the band great wasn't being a bunch of virtuosos on their instruments (as opposed to, say, Phish, who have a mountain of technical talent and use it to play a bunch of soulless music that doesn't tell a story and doesn't go anywhere).
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  6. GT Gator

    GT Gator GC Hall of Fame

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    My experience was very different. I saw Jane's Addiction soon after the show above at Einstein a-Go-Go on Jacksonville Beach -- it probably only fit 200 kids in the place. To this day, it was probably the best show I've ever seen.
  7. wgbgator

    wgbgator Very Stable Genius Premium Member

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    Jerry was definitely a top notch musician. If I may speak for Ben, I think the Dead made their musicianship seem more natural and effortless which might be mistaken for amateurism. Though for this argument I'm going to say Phish are more technically proficient musicians, which I don't necessarily equate to being a better band.
  8. anstro76

    anstro76 GC Hall of Fame

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    I get a bit defensive of Jerry. My bad. IMG_20150904_055009.jpg
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  9. GatorBen

    GatorBen Premium Member

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    Blasphemy, Hunter is the greatest lyricist who ever strode the earth. ;)

    There's a fine line on the rock songs - their Beatles covers, for example, are in my opinion almost uniformly terrible, and Bobby could occasionally pull out a real stinker.

    Me & My Uncle and El Paso, on the other hand, are phenomenal. Folk riffs are all great - Samson & Delilah is one of my favorites.
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  10. GT Gator

    GT Gator GC Hall of Fame

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    Like Michael Bolton jamming to Gansta Rap?

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  11. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Not a big Dead fan.* (I play with deadheads & have to fight off the dead covers - I know you rider is a bone I throw them. I owe it to Jerry for me learning the Mixo mode)

    I totally agree. It's the jams not the songs.

    * am a big fan of Jerry + David Grisman.

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  12. GatorBen

    GatorBen Premium Member

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    Toy with them. Throw them a cover of Lady With A Fan, but then refuse to continue on to Terrapin proper.
  13. wgbgator

    wgbgator Very Stable Genius Premium Member

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    With their rock covers I was thinking "Johnny B Good" which I always enjoyed their version of, so '50s stuff.
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  14. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    It's my understanding that the dead usually proceed Rider with China Cat...we've never done that. We actually play rider straight outta Come Together which works well.
  15. GatorBen

    GatorBen Premium Member

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    Don't blame you for that - I'm not sure anyone other than a Dead cover band could make the weirdness that is China Cat seem like it belongs in their set!

    (But yes, China Rider was the normal progression. Rider would very rarely get played without China Cat, China Cat would basically never get played without Rider.)
  16. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    Were they the main act? At the UF show, the majority of the crowd (myself included) were there for Love & Rockets. I had never heard of Jane's Addiction at that time. I distinctly remember someone yelling out between their songs "All your songs sound the same!" and Perry Farrell yelling back "All you assholes sound the same!" I also remember when seeing them in Orlando a year or two later (not sure which as they played at Visage in Orlando in '88, and '89), thinking how funny it was that now everybody wanted to see them, myself included.

    Btw...are you sure the show you saw wasn't in 1989? Because that's the only show at Einstein A-Go-Go that's listed around then.

    https://janesaddiction.org/tour/list/janes-addiction/1989/

    Mystery solved...I still have the ticket for the Orlando show. Sadly none for the UF show. The album "Nothing's Shocking" was released in August of '88, which explains why people, including me, wanted to see them in early '89, but didn't know who they were in '87.

    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  17. anstro76

    anstro76 GC Hall of Fame

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    Yeah but he was a sharp dresser!

    e51c216cd6bcadb099037ac64578d8bd--the-dead-zone-bob-weir.jpg
  18. NOLAGATOR

    NOLAGATOR GC Hall of Fame

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    I like Jimmy Buffets music but he is just another anti-capitalist lib rolling in money.

    He can live how he wants but you need to " dance with the one who brought you"
  19. GT Gator

    GT Gator GC Hall of Fame

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    You keep all your old show tickets???!

    Great find. Yes, it was definitely the show in 1989. I found the image below. On the same night you were seeing JA in Orlando, I had been to Einstein's A Go Go "The Feelies" (Remember them? Two drummers -- great show). I remember the opening band for that show and thought they were outstanding. However, I never realized until this moment that it was "Yo Lo Tengo," a band I ended up listening to about five years later (and still listen to them). Luckily, I bought two Jane's Addiction tickets that Saturday because they sold out that night.

    When I got back to Gainesville, I called all my friends trying to find someone to go with me to the Tuesday night JA show. No one would go because everyone had early classes and/or tests the next day. Finally a friend who had never heard of Jane's Addiction agreed to go. We listened to the Nothing Shocking on the drive to Jacksonville Beach.

    Jane's Addiction was the only act. My friend and I ended up pressed against the tiny stage. Fantastic show.

    BTW, I also went to the Dinosaur Jr (one my favorite bands) show a few weeks later.

    Look at this amazing January/February line up for a tiny bar on Jacksonville Beach. Note the February 9th show... I knew both of them well from the G'ville "underground" scene at the time.

    [​IMG]

    I also found this page that shows a bunch of shows I attended at Einstein's including Fishbone, They Might be Giants, and Pylon.

    http://credain6.tripod.com/id39.html
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  20. fastsix

    fastsix Premium Member

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    I kept all the tickets to many of the shows I went to through High School and some from UF. Then I stopped, but found the old tickets when I was visiting home one year and started saving them again. So there's a big gap from the mid 90s to the mid 2000s - although it's possible some are hidden away somewhere. No way I'd still have those tickets from the 80s if they didn't just sit in a drawer at my parent's house untouched for over a decade.