Immigration Bill could break US into ‘two Countries’

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by DarthG8RV3, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget parts of Colorado, Oregon, Washington, and Texas. The Aztlan movement was big in the 60's and 70's, but hasn't been anything major since. And having lived in the west for over the past two decades, I can tell you the movement is all but dead. The Hispanics that live here understand how much better they have it over Mexico. And they do not want to re-assimilate.

    Again, Hispanics are graduating high school in record numbers, and going to college in record numbers too. Plenty of Hispanics in politics out west, including R Governor Richardson of New Mexico, and D Congressman Grialva of Arizona. Both are examples of 2nd generation Americans who were the first gen in their respective families to graduate college. There are only more to come. And neither Richardson or Grialva advocate a return to Mexico. It's just more xenophobic scare tactics from the right.
  2. fastsix
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    fastsix Well-Known Member

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    "Just one drop" - is that the cut off?
  3. 92gator
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    92gator Well-Known Member

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    ....and yet, Miami continues to thrive.

    (and I'm not a big fan of the city--my blood pressure skyrockets the moment I enter it...but it's not like the city is crumbling like Detroit, or so many other rust belt cities, with almost no immigrants...).
  4. 92gator
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    92gator Well-Known Member

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    From the immigrants' perspective, that's not what's going on. Yeah, you have "la Raza", and a few fringe groups that probably would like to see that--but what motivates most illegals--the vast majority--frankly, is capitalism. Most come here, for opportunity. Most bust their asses for what we consider meager wages--not because they are meager--but because they are substantial, compared to what they could make in their own lands. Most want America to thrive--but they also want to be a part of America thriving--not just living off the crumbs that fall off the table....

    Let me put it to you this way--if the GOP obtained control, and offred Illegals the opp'y to participate in the tax system--to work for regular wages, with taxes withheld--most would jump at the opp'y.

    Problem is, the Left is offering that, PLUS a boatload of free goodies (and teh GOP isn't offering anything of the sort--not even what I mentioned hypotheticallly above). That's not the illegals seeking to 'destroy western civilization' or anything of the sort--

    ...that's ordinary ppl., being courted by a political side, and responding as most ordinary ppl. in their circumstances would.

    It's reflective/consistent with the number one question that motivates capitalism:

    What's in it for me?

    Hence the 'Amerindian' /'mestizo' you seem to have a problem with, aren't really the problem--they are the insturmentality of the problem. The problem, is the domestically grown and harvested political ideology that perpetuates the myth that we can provide goodies that we can't pay for, indefinitely, and promise all these wonderful benefits....and *pay* for it all with more and more debt.

    Actually, that's not really even the problem--more like the fundamental flaw, measured agaisnt reality--the real problem, is that those with authority who champion that ideology, know it's not possible to actually live up to their promises--certainly not sustainable--but that's not the point. The point, is to centralize power--with THEMSELVES, appointed as trustee of the public funds, and the authority to decide who gets how much...and how much they get to keep.

    Don't you think that's a tad sophisticated for simple minded folks who go to sleep every night wondering how they're going obtain sustenance to satiate the void in their bellies, and quiet the rumbling...and obtain the same for the woman in their bed, and the kids, in the next room? :geek:
  5. DieAGator
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    DieAGator Well-Known Member

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    You're so misguided.
  6. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    And you are too simple minded for all you can do to retort to my facts and figures is an ad hominem attack calling me misguided.
  7. KelticGator
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    KelticGator Premium Member

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    Ding, Ding, Ding - Racism alarm!!!!

    I'm surprised on how many racists there are on this board who obsfucate their latent hatred of others with ideas of "protecting western civilization".

    As if the US isn't already a hodge podge of various cultures rather than having a singular defining heritage. Perhaps we can have another thread defining the racial purity we need to espouse to in order to clear up any confusion for the non-bigots on this board.
  8. PIMking
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    PIMking New Member

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    [​IMG]
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  9. PIMking
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    PIMking New Member

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    well there is a movement in our post high school education system that allow less capable students into college over those who are more qualified
  10. PIMking
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    PIMking New Member

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    Cubans want to be here, they love it here and love freedoms that we have here. little different than some other cities in the west that don't have such a huge cuban area
  11. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    That's a cop-out. Ever known a high school grad that can't get into college somewhere? Of course not, because all local community colleges accept local high school grads. And a JUCO student, black, white, or any color inbetween still counts as a college student.
  12. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    Repped!
  13. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    Damn right... Those two (Cubans and Mexicans) are very different cultures. Cubans have no problems Americanizing, but the Mexicans want Americans to Mexicanize for them...
  14. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    Mexico has an over-abundance of cheap labor and little demand. The US is exactly the opposite. We have a high demand for cheap labor, and not enough of a supply coming from our citizenry. So, why not let supply meet demand? Like Canada, which has a relatively simple system that allows employees file for guest workers after they prove they cannot find citizens to fill the open positions. Or, we could follow the lead of Mexico, and close our borders despite having a completely opposite fiscal supply/demand of labor. Yes, that's sounds rational...NOT!
  15. Gatorrick22
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    Gatorrick22 Well-Known Member

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    We have an overabundance of immigration laws with no one to enforce them.

    Breaking the law is not the answer no matter how many times you post the same exact thing. Nothing has changed, in the fact, you are basically condoning law-breaking for "cheap labor".
  16. PIMking
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    PIMking New Member

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    I meant it at higher institutions, right now there is a lawsuit going against Texas because they accepted minorities who were not as qualified as the girl who is sueing them
  17. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    To Gatorrick: Breaking the law is the answer when cracking down on the law leads to labor shortages. A better solution is to change the law to make those here or coming here legal, as they are here or will be coming here anyway.

    I'll keep posting it until people realize that if you are advocating for increased enforcement only, you are advocating a policy that increases spending by billions, increases the number of Federal employees by tens of thousands, increasing inflation by creating labor shortages (similar demand and decreased supply), and actually increasing unemployment, as a shortage in labor in things like picking crops trickles down the line. 25% less crops picked equals 25% less trucks to deliver crops to markets, equals 25% less crops to have to stock on shelves, and equals 25% less goods to sell at the check-out counter. I've linked the fiscally disastrous results of increased enforcement only policies dozens of times. They are facts, and while you are entitled to your own opinions, you are not entitled to your own facts. Now ask yourself this, what's a better fiscal policy? Increased enforcement only, or a Gang of 8 style solution? The answer should be obvious.

    But it's not only a better fiscal policy, but better security policy as well. Think of all the money we will be collecting from immigrants in the form of Visas and fines. It will help pay for border patrol. In addition, if we created a legal way for immigrants who want to work to enter, they will enter legally, thus removing thousands of immigrants from crossing the desert. Simply put, controlling crowds in urban crossing areas like El Paso, Nogales, and San Diego will be much easier and much more cost effective then attempting to patrol the entire, 2,000 mile border.

    And to PIM, what I linked was a story staying Hispanics are graduating high school and entering college at record numbers. It made no distinction between a 4-year University and 2-year CC. The Caucasians suing Texas because they cannot get into the same school with better numbers than Hispanics is a separate discussion, as both the Hispanics and Caucasians are still enrolling in a college. Which for my purposes, is all I'm counting.
  18. g8trjax
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    g8trjax Well-Known Member

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    Come on, you honestly believe any of this? Who is going to enforce all these tough, strict, new bullshit laws? Obama? Congress? Maybe homeland security. Surely you realize they don't enforce the one's we have now.
  19. AzCatFan
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    AzCatFan Well-Known Member

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    The current laws aren't enforced now because when states such as Arizona, Georgia, and Alabama passed and enforced their own laws, the fiscal results were disastrous. I have posted the links several times, and you can do your own Google search.

    Big business simply won't allow states or the Feds to try and enforce our current laws again. Not good for the bottom line. So either we change the laws, or we accept the status quo. Those are our only real two options.

    If a Gang of 8 law passes, it won't be perfect. But it will allow for labor supplies to come closer to meeting demand. The law will also raise money from the migrants themselves. Now imagine how much better enforcement we would have with a bigger budget and significantly less illegals because the majority of migrants were here legally.

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