If Iran gets a nuke, what do they do with it?

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by OklahomaGator, Jan 24, 2014.

  1. chompalot
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    chompalot Well-Known Member

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    Michi, you must be blind to the Arab spring.
    Iran is realizing that it is in their best interest to rejoin the rest of the world instead of being an outcast. Just like we do what is in our best interest, so do the Iranians. Nothing irrational about how they act. Brutal... yes. Irrational... no. We can trust them as far as we give them a deal that is in their best interest. And a deal that is in their best interest not to renege on.
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  2. gatorev12
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    gatorev12 Well-Known Member

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    The Iranian moderates may want our culture...but millions of others in Iran don't. To them, our culture is immoral, hedonistic, and toxic. Shows like the "Shahs of Sunset" only play into that image--and the Iranian leadership uses that to show just how awful American culture is.

    And trade is only useful up to a point. We trade with both Russia and China--and neither seem to pay particular mind to what American foreign policy interests are.
  3. tim85
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    tim85 Well-Known Member

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    Do I think they're irrational? Yes, any rational person would.

    Do I think you can negotiate with them? Yes, but can you negotiate with them to with any kind of significant success? Probably not.

    Do you even really know how annoying and offensive it is to have to respond to trash like, "See..neocon...Christian right, etc..?" Do you think that's an effective way of really discussing a topic with someone? It just reflects the mentality you seemingly have of this whole, "my side is right, your side is wrong."
  4. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    The Arab Spring has by and large been an uprising of fundamentalism. The small minorities brave enough to publicly encourage western reforms get dogpiled under and ultimately end up worse off if anything.

    Iran wants to be a nuclear-armed state. Period. They are participating in talks with the west because a) they obviously have no intention to actually be bound by any agreement they might make, and b) they realize that we've reached a point that the only thing behind the Great Satan and its cohorts desire to talk... is the desire to talk again. They know that about the only two countries with the inclination to do more than stand in the door and make remarks are Israel and probably Russia... and that as long as the grease the wheels, the Russians will be cool.
  5. G8trGr8t
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    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    well giving them funding and time to advance their program is certainly not a good option yet that is what we have done.

    restricting their funding and cutting off their imports of critical machinery and exports of oil is the best way to leverage Iran into agreeing to dismantle their nuclear program. we had that going strong enough to force Iran to the table and then 0 stopped it, reversed it, and I fear that it will be hard to get started again and if we do it will be too little, too late.

    0 helping Iran to get nuclear weapons will be one of the long list of the failures of his administration but I have little doubt that 0 and his minions will figure out a way that it is somebody else's fault. That is the lib way, everything is somebody else's fault and there is nothing that enough of somebody else's money can't fix.
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  6. gatorev12
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    gatorev12 Well-Known Member

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    ...and why is it not in their best interest to renege on our pinky-swear "deal?"

    Here, I had thought that even discussing "hey, IF they renege on the deal, they need to know about the consequences"--was considered so "damaging" to "the deal" that Obama demanded Congress knock it off. For-sure, there were no consequences in the "deal" Obama recently made with them.
  7. CHFG8R
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    CHFG8R Premium Member

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    Iran wants to be considered among the "big boys" on the world stage. No. 4 would end that quick and set them on a path to destruction. Fittingly, I think as time has gone on (and their power solidified), even the Iranian Mullahs are more politically inclined and long-term in their thinking than some would like to believe. Religion, now, is more of a pure tool for control than the overriding philosophy it was at the beginning of the "revolution."
  8. chompalot
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    chompalot Well-Known Member

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    I am just calling a spade a spade. It goes without saying what option the neocons would choose if they could and I've been around too many right-wing Christians that seem to think the same way as the neocons. My objective is to open up some of those Christians on the right so that they might see the folly of their ways. The Iraq War was very upsetting to me and I put a majority of the blame for that war on the neocons and the Christian right. Not saying they are the only perpetrators but they were the main ones.
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  9. Lawdog88
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    That is much wishful thinking, for people running the country of Iran who fundamentally value premature death and dying as the will of God, as much if not moreso, than life and living.
  10. CHFG8R
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    CHFG8R Premium Member

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    Arab Spring has little to do with the goings on in Persia/Iran, which is 30 years past it's similar "revolution." You also forget the ingrained hatred for Sunnis throughout much of the Iranian/Persian population. I think, in discussions like this, distinctions should be drawn between the Persians and the Arabs as they are actually quite different in many ways.
  11. CHFG8R
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    Really. Can anyone name the last time an Iranian engaged in a suicide bombing?

    From what I can gather, the Iranians like to do the "batchit crazy" routine by proxy through their "batchit crazy" Arab surrogates. Seems they don't typically have the stomach for that kind of stuff.
  12. chompalot
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    chompalot Well-Known Member

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    I thought I had deleted the Arab spring part. I left it in by mistake.
  13. asuragator
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    asuragator Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. It's what leads me to think that even with a nuke, they wouldn't be so tragically foolish as to use it, but it would provide them leverage--so they believe--in the legitimate political arena (so to speak).
  14. CHFG8R
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    I was responding to Michi. Sorry for the confusion.
  15. CHFG8R
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    CHFG8R Premium Member

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    See: Pakistan.

    Even if Iran gets a nuke and the missiles to deliver it, that situation is still more concerning to me. And no threads about Pakistan having a nuke.
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  16. CHFG8R
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    The irony of Iran, IMO, is that on a cultural and even political level, they are clearly the best suited of all the countries in that region to be our ally.
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  17. wgbgator
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    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

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    I dont expect them to embrace our culture completely, but exposure to it and their increasing prosperity certaintly works in our favor. Let them build the barrier and keep the barbarians out rather than us doing it via sanctions or embargo. Then their censorial religious regime are the "bad guys" in that situation rather than us, and it will be obvious to all but the most devoted to the revolution.

    Also, notice how no one talks about war with Russia or China as a serious posibility, even if our interests are often at odds.
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  18. gatorev12
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    gatorev12 Well-Known Member

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    Unlike Iran, none of Pakistan's leaders have made public statements about wanting to annihilate other countries and how they're a "cancer." And no, I'm not just talking about the former President either. Many of Iran's leaders have publicly said similar things.
  19. CHFG8R
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    Which leaders would those be? I mean, who is the freakin' leader of Pakistan? That alone, kinda scares me. I guess if we keep paying off the right people, we are safe (fingers crossed). But, in reality, which country is more likely to "lose" a warhead or two to a terrorist organization? Sorry to disagree, but I find the situation in Pakistan a lot more troubling in these regards.

    You see, these are the real psychos (the ones some are trying to make the Iranians out to be). The Iranians? Meh. It's all politics to them.
  20. Lawdog88
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    Are you talking about their proxies, or the identities of pieces of actual Iranians left over in bomb debris ? To the second part, I don't know.

    But if you are saying that the Iranian mullahs / leaders / headmen are not comfortable casually - but quite pointedly - talking about death of infidels, others, and themselves via self-sacrificial death, as an instrument of religious / political foreign policy, you would be mistaken.

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