How weak, spineless, and ignorant are our American school adimins?

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by gator7_5, Dec 20, 2013.

  1. gator7_5
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    gator7_5 Well-Known Member

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  2. gatorman_07732
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    gatorman_07732 Well-Known Member

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    Don't you even think for a second only the northeast is susceptible to this garbage.
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  3. gator7_5
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    gator7_5 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I know. Thankfully, we'll be close to dead last to be infected by this plague in Lower Alabama.
  4. Spurffelbow833
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    Spurffelbow833 Premium Member

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    I don't even want to hear the butchered version. This is why public education needs to go away.
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  5. Spurffelbow833
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    Spurffelbow833 Premium Member

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    None of us is as dumb as all of us, and mandatory public education is the ultimate expression of that truth.
  6. gatorman_07732
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    gatorman_07732 Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that they're not kept in check by the people.
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  7. chemgator
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    chemgator Well-Known Member

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    This is unbelievably stupid. Most of the "outrage" is from people who are not Muslim, or Jewish, or any other faith. Why would Muslims, Jews, Hindus, or Buddhists be offended by Christmas songs? If a student at the school is of another faith, you could include a song from that faith to keep her from feeling left out, just don't chop up the Christmas songs to omit all "potentially offensive material" for some anti-Christian bigots. I could see a need to edit or omit a song if it specifically trashed another religion, but that is not the case here.

    It reminds me of a story a few years back where banks were doing away with "piggy banks" because they might offend Muslims. I had a large group of Muslims from Saudi Arabia visit several years ago for work. I took them horseback riding on their day off, which they enjoyed. The ranch also had a small pig farm. I asked the Saudis if they wanted to see the pigs, and they said yes. Obviously, they were not offended by the sight of pigs--they just didn't want to eat one. The outrage was manufactured, probably by someone who didn't know any Muslims.
  8. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    Removing all of the religious references is an absurd solution. At the same time I question whether the inclusion of what is plainly a religious song in a public school's production to start with was a terribly good decision.

    Seems like the solution here is just don't sing Silent Night at public school holiday productions in the first place - you don't have to deal with the thorny issues of producing what is, unquestionably, a religious song at a public school event, nor do you upset people with the silly alternative of trying to turn it into a secular song.
  9. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Well, we are talking about plainly religious holiday as well. What is the giant freaking deal about Christmas actually being Christmas? I remember being taught all sorts of things about Hannukah in school, and even making our own dreidels. If a government school is pathologically incapable of recognizing Christmas as the religious holiday it exclusively is and letting it's cultural references in school stand upon that immutable truth, why not just get out of the game altogether? December is just another month of the year, there's a semester break around the end of the month, and no fanfare of any kind?

    By changing the lyrics, the school is trying to expel from the holiday its actual meaning. Even nominally secular Christmas music is still about Christmas, and so is necessarily about the religious holiday.
  10. gatorman_07732
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    gatorman_07732 Well-Known Member

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    This is what happens when there is no accountability. The parents need to put the heat first on the principle.
  11. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Actually, the pushback needs to come from the students, who should have just belted out the actual lyrics, and then been met with smiles of supportive approval from their parents for flouting the disgraceful excesses and abuses of the self-important boobs that run their school.
  12. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good, let's do it.

    To be honest that's how I think government should handle religious holidays. If you want to give time off for them, be my guest, but the government isn't who should be doing some recognition or celebration of the holiday, there are plenty of outlets for people to do that on their own. Trying to have a "non-religious Christmas celebration" at school is absurd, largely for the reasons you pointed out, so just have a winter break and let people do whatever they want on their own for Christmas/Hannukah/whatever and celebrate it as they see fit.
  13. HallGator
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    HallGator Administrator VIP Member

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    One of my best friends is an elementary school music teacher. He got into a bunch of crap over having one of his classes practice with a song that had a religious nature (don't recall what the song was) to it. One of the students come from a family that was atheist and he wound up having apologize to the whole family to keep his job. This was several years ago in a small town here in North Florida.
  14. tegator80
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    tegator80 Well-Known Member

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    I take it from a different perspective. Using zero-tolerance on drugs to justify suspending girls for bringing Midol to school for cramps or a first grader kissing a girl or pointing a finger and saying "bang" is the school's attempt to follow the squirrely thinking the parents get themselves into over children's safety. I have always said that the problem with public education is the public. Private schools get to play by their own rules and if you don't like them then you are free to keep your children away. I see the silliness as a manifestation of a lack of rudimentary skills in the general population to discern what is a real problem and what was fabricated by Chicken Little. In the Northeast, or in the larger cities everywhere, the only people still around in the school systems are either incompetent or want power/control.
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2013
  15. asuragator
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    asuragator Well-Known Member

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    I was with you until the last sentence, which to me is misses some other choices. We live in an increasing multicultural society where in the past Christian traditions or songs went unchecked in schools. This is changing just as the norms and expectations are with respect to this increasing religious and ethnic diversity, and these incidents are an outcome that changing process.

    Yet, it's also true that there schools/administrators/teachers that mishandle the situations, sometimes from incompetence, sometimes from trying to do the right thing yet still being blamed, but because public pressure and conflict between past norms and changes puts them in a tough spot. We also have a public--i.e. parents on both sides that are unwilling to compromise about such issues so they dig in. And really, I put a lot of blame on the parents for their own roles in creating the problems or disallowing them to be solved amicably.
  16. TJtheGator
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    TJtheGator Well-Known Member

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    The day will come when churches aren't allowed to display crosses, synagogues aren't allowed to display the star of David, and mosques aren't allowed to display crescent moons. The simple presence of a religious object ANYWHERE will offend someone, and liberal judges will ban their display.
  17. tegator80
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    tegator80 Well-Known Member

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    I can't argue with this. What I was trying to say is that your reasons are people stirring of the pot. Afterwards, the competent ones are frustrated and leave. And usually the ones who stick it out either can't move on or they have ulterior motives.
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  18. DaveFla
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    DaveFla Well-Known Member

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    Yahoo has a 'War on Christmas.'

    /rivergator.
  19. asuragator
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    asuragator Well-Known Member

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    Agree it can certainly drive out competent people. I don't envy ED administrators. Can't be easy dealing with fickle, often unreasonable parents. I'm glad in my job I don't have to. :)
  20. gatorman_07732
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    gatorman_07732 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with jdr here and can go from my own experiences. I live in the NE and my girls are in a great system that I wouldn't trade for the world. I think you painted a very broad picture with your last sentence. Sure some whacky things happen here, however it would say it's more pervasive.

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