How The NRA Built A Massive Secret Database Of Gun Owners

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by gator996, Aug 22, 2013.

  1. gator996
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    gator996 New Member

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    Wonder if the gun who were so afraid of the government making a national registry are OK with this...


    http://www.buzzfeed.com/stevefriess/how-the-nra-built-a-massive-secret-database-of-gun-owners

    How The NRA Built A Massive Secret Database Of Gun Owners

    While the National Rifle Association publicly fights against a national gun registry, the organization has gone to incredible lengths to compile information on “tens of millions” of gun owners — without their consent.

    posted on August 20, 2013 at 10:49pm EDT


    WASHINGTON — The National Rifle Association has rallied gun owners — and raised tens of millions of dollars — campaigning against the threat of a national database of firearms or their owners.

    But in fact, the sort of vast, secret database the NRA often warns of already exists, despite having been assembled largely without the knowledge or consent of gun owners. It is housed in the Virginia offices of the NRA itself. The country’s largest privately held database of current, former, and prospective gun owners is one of the powerful lobby’s secret weapons, expanding its influence well beyond its estimated 3 million members and bolstering its political supremacy.

    That database has been built through years of acquiring gun permit registration lists from state and county offices, gathering names of new owners from the thousands of gun safety classes taught by NRA-certified instructors and by buying lists of attendees of gun shows, subscribers to gun magazines, and more, BuzzFeed has learned.

    The result: a big data powerhouse that deploys the same high-tech tactics all year round that the vaunted Obama campaign used to win two presidential elections.

    NRA spokesman Andrew Arulanandam declined to discuss the group’s name-gathering methods or what it does with its vast pool of data about millions of non-member gun owners. Asked what becomes of the class rosters for safety classes when instructors turn them in, he replied, “That’s not any of your business.”
  2. oldgator
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    oldgator Premium Member

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    love how many cons believe it just fine and ethical for NRA(as well as insurance companies, etc) to develop massive databases about citizens(without the consent of the citizens) and often use the data against citizens. But that it is wrong for the govt to do it.
  3. Lawdog88
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    Lawdog88 Well-Known Member

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    So if it is so, will they use the information for good or bad, of firearms owners ?

    Could the same be said of the government, if the government obtained / retained similar information ?

    (Conceivably, the government could have similar types of information, at least from firearms purchase applications).
  4. gator996
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    gator996 New Member

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    Before you debate speculated "good' or "bad" uses...

    How about debating the existence of a registry by anyone?
    A registry of NRA members & non-NRA members.


    What's a "good" use for firearms owners?

    Maybe listening to the 90% who want background checks or ignoring them?

    :shhh:
  5. LittleBlueLW
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    LittleBlueLW Premium Member

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    The NRA is a joke. And I own many guns.
  6. gatordowneast
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    gatordowneast Well-Known Member

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    996, you and old and River and Row and Fred and other lefty, libbies don't have to own a gun if you do not wish. Various cities have had "turn in your gun" days where they've paid $50 to take weapons off the streets. Have at it.

    I do not fear the NRA, rather a government so large that it has now been caught spying on innocent citizens and whose Treasury Department has been harassing those whose beliefs run contrary to the current administration.

    Me thinks I will keep my shotgun.
  7. oldgator
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    oldgator Premium Member

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    You ask a very reasonable question. To answer that question, it might be helpful to follow a useful adage. Follow the money.

    Suggest you look up where NRA gets most of its money. Is it from everyday NRA members who hunt, sport shooting, etc and are middle income or lower. Or does vast majority of money the NRA gets to finance its activities come from ---political power brokers(Mainly GOP) and corporations that manufacture guns, sell guns, etc.
    By far the majority of money that finances NRA comes from political power brokers and corporations.

    With the above being the case---look for the following
    ---on issues in which NRA membership and corporations are in agreement---look for the NRA to take that stance with its lobbyists in Washington DC
    ---on the few issues(note the word 'few) in which the opinion of majority of NRA members differ from the wants/opinion of political power brokers/corporations---you will see the NRA take the stance of the power brokers/corporations instead of the majority of the NRA membership.

    The above is well documented in regard to laws regarding closing of gun sales loopholes. Majority of NRA membership is for closing such loopholes. While the corporations want the loopholes kept open to facilitate their sales to NRA members, criminals, foreigners, etc for either legal use or illegal use.

    I was a member of NRA for many years but cancelled my subscription when they would at times not take the stance of majority of NRA members, and instead lobby for gun manufacturers and retailers.

    I believe that majority of NRA members are rock solid people, excellent citizens, backbone of good values, etc. I also believe that majority of NRA members would be upset, aggravated by, etc new laws requiring waiting periods to allow checks be made of gun purchasers. i also believe they would be willing for such laws to be made if such laws check to see if a gun buyer has criminal record, listed on terrorist watch list, whether or not the person is an American citizen. I also believe the majority of NRA members believe that 2nd Amendment protection should only apply to American citizens and that measures should be done to prevent non citizens from having that protection.

    In addition, it is highly likely that NRA currently does, or plans on selling data on its database to gun manufacturers, gun retailers, and politicians without direct consent of NRA members.
  8. gator996
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    gator996 New Member

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    Conservatives have fought in Arizona to not allow for gun buyback programs to take the guns "off the street"....FYI, they passed a law that those guns could not be destroyed but had to be re-sold back into the community.


    You don't fear the NRA....

    How about Google? Facebook? The big 3 credit reporting agencies?


    If the conservative fears about a national registry are to be believed then you on principle shouldn't be in favor of ANY organization archiving data.


    What business is it of the NRA to be archiving non-member ownership data?

    :ninja:
  9. oldgator
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    oldgator Premium Member

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    I'm a liberal, and would be all for a buyback program with the guns to be resold to the public provided the following is included.
    ---thorough background check of persons buying the weapons
    ---money made(after the initial price paid during buyback is deducted) from the re-sale of guns go into the medical care of people injured by guns. Or the money used to finance public classes on safe use of guns(conducted by ROTC instructors or local police).
  10. gator7_5
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    gator7_5 Well-Known Member

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    The gov has our information involuntarily on file since birth. Whatever the NRA can get on their own is fair game, I suppose. No different than the Democratic Party compiling a list of everyone who is or is not a democrat.
  11. gator7_5
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    gator7_5 Well-Known Member

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    Good business.
  12. DaveFla
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    DaveFla Well-Known Member

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    The NRA knowing that I own firearms doesn't scare me one iota.

    The government having this information, however, scares the hell out of me. The government, afterall, has a history of mis-using this kind of information to the detriment of its citizens. NRA? Nope.
  13. gator996
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    gator996 New Member

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    The govt has your gun ownership data since birth...
    (assumed before you owned a gun???)


    If its fair game for the Democratic party & the NRA...

    Why is it a secret government takeover if the federal government wants to require background checks?

    Wasn't that supposed to lead to a national registry that abridged 2nd amendment rights?

    But you suppose its fair game for political organizations to make their own national registry?


    Could please explain the logic behind that view?
  14. oldgator
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    oldgator Premium Member

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    so you are in favor of govt not requiring proof of place of birth for people born in the U.S.?

    policies and actions done by govt are via a system of elected representatives. Are you proposing that newborns or fetuses vote?

    In regard to NRA, Dems, or GOP filing their databases with info about people being fair game. I assume you are simply saying that it is within the law. If that assumption is correct, consider the following...

    Just because a law, policy, etc of a person, group is legal---does not mean it is ethical
  15. gatordowneast
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    gatordowneast Well-Known Member

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    What business is it of the NRA to be archiving non-member ownership data?

    :ninja:[/QUOTE]

    New member solicitation?
  16. squigator
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    squigator Premium Member

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    Agree. The day the NRA gains taxing and police powers and stops fighting guvment intrusion we can start to worry.
  17. oldgator
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    oldgator Premium Member

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    the issue of databases(be they acquired/developed by individuals, businesses, religions, groups, govt, etc) in general should get its own thread. It is a major issue(IMO) in regard to power, corruption, etc regardless of who has the databases. And that the main ones who suffer are those who are contained in the database.
  18. gator996
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    gator996 New Member

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    New member solicitation?[/QUOTE]


    That's a justifiable reason....

    But if the argument is the making of a master list is violating your 2nd amm rights then how does the existence of one by someone other than the government OK?

    Non-members of the NRA don't want the NRA, or anybody else tracking their gun ownership.


    ....or is that only when Obama wants to track your guns?
  19. g8trjax
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    g8trjax Well-Known Member

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    That's a justifiable reason....

    But if the argument is the making of a master list is violating your 2nd amm rights then how does the existence of one by someone other than the government OK?

    Non-members of the NRA don't want the NRA, or anybody else tracking their gun ownership.


    ....or is that only when Obama wants to track your guns?[/QUOTE]



    Yeah, why worry? Obama's just like a big ol' fuzzy, lovable, teddy bear.
  20. LittleBlueLW
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    LittleBlueLW Premium Member

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    Someone gets it.

    This argument boils down to who has the power.

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