How much does food influence health ?

Discussion in 'Gator Country Health and Fitness' started by Dreamliner, Aug 2, 2012.

  1. UFNut
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    UFNut Premium Member

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    ^^ valid, but you could consume chicken & milk that weren't pumped with hormones. There is also the question of whether you consider the hormones to be bad. As for the milk, I'd say you should switch it out for some healthy fresh brewed green tea :). (though as far as I'm concerned so long as you aren't drinking soda, you're already one step up).
  2. UFNut
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    damn I'm hungry now.....thanks to you guys I'm thinking about all my unhealthy options ;P.
  3. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    This is what I ate today:

    Breakfast: just coffee with artificial sweetener and half-and-half.

    Lunch: whole bag of stir-fried garlic chicken and iced tea. Then followed with double-decker PB&J sandwich (on whole grain of course, got to eat healthy!), a banana and Coke Zero.

    Dinner: ground beef with sauteed onions, baked potato with some sort of artificial butter laced with all manner of preservatives and can of green beans.

    Probably going to have a couple of scoops of Moose Tracks ice cream in a bit.

    Oh, forgot the two beers. The main thing is that I try to get as many preservatives as I can. I gather that preservatives are good for us. After all, we're eating a lot of them and we're living longer than ever. Hence, the name 'preservatives.'
  4. UFNut
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    Actually sounds like a pretty decent meal set to me, especially given how much you work out. Not sure it falls in line with your rhetoric that it doesn't matter what you eat though. Its obvious you do care, no matter what you say. Odd, that I think the whole wheat bread is probably the least healthy thing you had to eat though ;P.

    Hard to tell if you're being facetious with that last paragraph. Pretty similar to what I had, except I ate breakfast today, though I don't always. I feel better when I exercise if I've eaten something earlier in the day.

    Maybe someone else is arguing with you about eating a little margarine with your potato, but its not me :). I agree its not healthy to constantly micromanage what you eat...I just think its laughable that the overall composition of your daily eating habits outside of calories doesn't matter. Just like I think its unhealthy to eat nothing but donuts, I think its equally unhealthy (and practically impossible) to eat nothing but romaine lettuce. Its better than dying from starvation, but your still gonna be pretty damn hungry as it takes a lot of lettuce to rack up 2k+ calories.
  5. kkg8r
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    You'll get repped for that all day! ;)
  6. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    The whole wheat thing was tongue-in-cheek. Of course the paleos would say that grains are killing me. I'd say no, but suspect that grains are overrated.

    FYI: my food choices are predicated on three factors: (1) taste (2) texture (3) convenience.

    And isn't the donuts thing a bit of a strawman ? I mean, who eats nothing but donuts ? Indeed, who eats primarily fast food ? Of all the 72-hour food journals I've collected from clients, none have reflected eating habits remotely close to that. Yet, all ranged from overweight to obese, and some suffered fairly profound health issues.

    For people who desire to decrease their mortality risks, I recommend that they choose their parents wisely, don't smoke, control their weight, get a little exercise, laugh, hug, manage stress and above all, stop worrying how long they'll live.

    Seriously, I'm 56 now. It would be nice to imagine that I've only lived half my life. And then I look in the mirror, in the morning, and think ... hmm, maybe 86 wouldn't be so bad.
  7. UFNut
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    If you read one of the hack diets (atkins, southbeach, etc. -- note I don't include Paleo, cause I think it is actually rather logical, though I can't figure out what their problem with potatoes is, seems like a Paleo food to me...), they think the typical american eats a donuts for breakfast, mcdonalds for lunch, and pizza for dinner (the idea of which makes me want to throw the book through my window, no one does that....well not no one, but it's certainly not typical). I simply stated that, cause I thought the premise we were going on here, was that what you eat doesn't matter, and that calories were the end-all....and if that's the case, you should be able to subsist off nothing but donuts, but you can't, not for long anyway, and you're going to feel like shit.

    I know someone who tried to lose weight eating nothing but salads (bro-science I know)...he felt like shit, but he didn't die. This is because you can't just eat some subset of healthy foods either. One needs a balance of nutritional elements to live and feel good while living.

    I simply think if you establish a good habit of eating a healthy balanced assortment of foods (note the difference between saying an assortment of healthy foods), that you no longer have to worry about counting calories anymore, because you can just naturally adjust what you eat from week to week. Frees you up to spend more time on the Babes thread, or if you're lucky enough to live near a nice beach with bikini-clad attractive women then frees you up to spend more time there. Assuming you eat this nice balanced diet and perform moderate amounts of exercise, you'll look good while you do it, and that's the important thing right?
  8. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    Two points:

    (1) I appreciate the opportunity to clarify the distinction between "You can eat nothing but donuts and lose weight", which is true, and, "You can eat nothing but donuts, interminably', and expect to feel good, which is probably not true.

    (2) But since no one ever does that, it's a far cry from the sort of hysteria that fosters, as you put it, micro-managing.

    BTW, I have little concern that my clients aren't getting the requisite macros, vitamins and minerals, and that's BEFORE I begin to work with them. Their problem coming in is too many calories. So. 'balance' does not help them. 'Less' is what they need to internalize. It is often the case that I can recommend that they eat just the way they're currently eating, just less of it.

    The article is posted to quell fear of eating, that is, fear of eating this or that food, or not getting this or that food ... and consequently being wracked with disease and dying. I just strongly suspect that that's no way to go through life, especially since we know we're all going to die.
  9. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    Foods I have eaten this week:

    burger, fries, pizza, donuts, cookie, candy, enriched white rice, breadsticks

    Am I going to die ? Yes, yes I am.
  10. UFNut
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    Think I understand you now. So I gather you're saying that, you are trying to quell the notion that all you have to do is eat balanced and you lose weight without concern to how much you eat (or how active you are, which certainly helps). So given that they are eating primarily decent foods (not necessarily great, but decent) they simply need to eat less of it. No such thing as super foods, or whatever they call things like omega-3, etc. I'd say this is primarily true, but I think I'd prefer if my clients (if I had them) were to stop consuming things that made this process difficult, like sodas, and ridiculous calorie expresso drinks & smoothies. Some people discount this sort of caloric intake, when they shouldn't. I notice you drink zero calorie beverages for the most part so likely think this is a valid concern as well. I do notice you don't mention your water intake, but likely assume you consider that to be very important for weight loss and health in general, especially if you are utilizing weight training (or, sigh...cardio) for weight control and/or muscle gains. Not to mention sleeeeep.

    On the other hand you'd think that if someone were eating a decent diet and they were gaining weight, the first logical thought would be, must need to eat a little less, and/or step up the exercise. But common sense doesn't seem to be very common these days, I guess.

    Then again, in my best "not so fast my friend" impression, I think that better dietary choices in some places will help keep your clients from overeating in the first place, by being more satisfied by the meals they're eating, as surely you wouldn't disagree a big juicy steak with equal calories to a couple slices of pizza will make you feel fuller. Though I do understand how hard it is to convince people and it may just be easier to say "eat less", but then, I think it must be difficult to get them to do that either.

    Either way I think your advice to them is good, now that I think I understand what you're saying. I am curious though, what would you say is the percentage of people who say they are following your advice but obviously are not (i.e. not losing weight). Or are they mostly honest about it if they've been "cheating". Just curious.
  11. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    You pretty much nailed it. Now, I take a nuanced approach regarding 'better choices.' Yes, we know that protein tends to afford better satiety for many folks. However, here's my thing: I very much want my clients to eat the foods they enjoy, literally zero restrictions. Therefore, I invite them to embrace hunger pangs as they are transient and do not signal an actual biological need for nourishment.

    You see, I'm digging my heels in a bit on this one point. I see people going overboard, in their anxieties, and don't want them to squander the opportunity to gain mastery over food, so as to allow them to lose weight eating any of the foods they enjoy. And why not ? Why not now while they're wanting to lose weight ? Eventually they going to eat them anyway.

    I counsel my clients not to start at the beginning but rather 'plan for the end.' That is, I invite them to pretend that they've already lost their weight. I then ask them to imagine how they got there, was it by depriving themselves the foods they enjoy ? Was it by engaging in forms of exercise they are not likely to continue long-term ?

    I'm quite strong on this point because I want them to plan for weight-loss (and maintenance) in the context of the overwhelming probability that they will simply gain the weight back. Sustainability is key. And sustainability points to minimum effective dosage, as small a change as is necessary and no larger.

    Now, to another point of yours, I do have clients who are obviously not helping themselves coming in. And occasionally I have the good fortune to find an 'easy red button' in their food journals.

    For example, one of my obese clients was getting 8-9 cans of sugared soda a day, no kidding. BUT, I didn't look at that and think 'unhealthy.' Rather, I looked at 8-9 sodas and thought '1,000 calories.' So, I had no problem negotiating her down to two cans a day and asking her to cultivate a habit of savoring them as here 'special treat.'

    Finally, not many of my clients 'cheat' after I've gotten hold of them. There have been notable exceptions, but one thing I use to my advantage is their own acknowledgent that they've been caught red-handed coming in. This is to say that they either underestimate food intake on their food journals, or they outright lie about it. So, they get some rather straight (albeit diplomatic) talk coming in.

    I had on client who complained about not being able to lose weight. Her food journal had her getting 800 to 900 calories a day. I knew something was amiss, so as I probed a bit, I also talked about Energy Balance Theory and how it works for everyone, and how it's unforgiving, and why we ought to be happy about that ... and finally she allowed as to how she'd left out a foot-long philly cheesesteak sandwich.

    "But it was only one thing!", she whined. :laugh:
  12. UFNut
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    UFNut Premium Member

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    NOTE: I had noticed already your response but thought since we seemed mostly in agreement I'd leave it alone :). (in reference to your post on the THFGT board)

    I shudder to think what my body would look like if I were actually consuming 800-900 calories per day though, lol. For my weight and activity that'd be over 2k calorie deficit probably, so I'd probably need the cheesesteak :).
  13. Dreamliner
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    Dreamliner Well-Known Member

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    There is actually a designation for ladies like this. In the modern parlance they are "too little eaters." That is, they complain that they eat far to little not to be losing weight. I call them "whiners" for short.

    A recent study of too little eaters showed them estimating their daily caloric intake at 1,082. Calories. Their average calorie consumption: 2,081

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