Hamas tells kerry to pound sand ( says no to cease fire)

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by g8orbill, Jul 24, 2014.

  1. g8orbill
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    g8orbill Gators VIP Member

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    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/0...e-agreement-out-hamas-as-gaza-violence-rages/

    "When it comes to the balance of power in this crisis between us and Israel, they are the executioners, the aggressors, the occupiers, the settlers, and we are the true owners of the land," Hamas leader Khaled Mashaal said Wednesday in a televised speech from his home-in-exile in Doha, Qatar. "We will not accept anything but the end of the siege."

    The Wall Street Journal reported Thursday that diplomats from the U.S., Israel, and other Middle Eastern countries are reworking a cease-fire proposal made by Egypt's foreign ministry last week. The paper reports that the new proposal would call for both Israel and Hamas to cease military operations in the coming days before calling on the U.S. and the international community to begin talks on a long-term economic program for Gaza.

    Hamas rejected the initial Egyptian cease-fire proposal on the grounds that it had not been consulted by Cairo, and claimed that the plan did not provide for the lifting of the blockade or the release of militant prisoners from Israeli custody.

    The Journal reports that Hamas' demands for the freer movement of goods into Gaza are likely to be met with resistance by Israel unless it is allowed to monitor the trade for weapons bound for Hamas.
  2. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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  3. MichiGator2002
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    Israel's already had three ceasefires broken by Hamas in the last, what, week? Talking is done, IMO. The best interests of Israel and of Palestinians (with brains) are the same -- Hamas scattered to the wind. Every time Israel has Had Enough and is ready to finally purge the filth that are Hamas and/or Hezbollah from the region, the world throws an absolute hissy fit and they stand down.
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  4. g8tr80
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    g8tr80 Well-Known Member

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    The only true way that there will be a cease fire is if Israel rolls back to its' 1967 borders, give Jerusalem to the Palestinians and recognize Palestine as a state with Jerusalem as its' capital. Then, and only then, will the Palestinian discuss recognizing the right of Israel to exist. This is directly from one of the "negotiators" Kerry and the Egyptians have to deal with. Other than that, a cease fire is right around the corner.
  5. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    67 borders and recognized statehood are definitely a go/no-go line for Palestinians (and one Israel has largely agreed to before, although it's not clear that they would now).

    Jerusalem less so - recognizing East Jerusalem as being Israeli is definitely a no-go line, but they have indicated that they would accept the "international city administered by the UN" approach to Jerusalem.
  6. orangeblueorangeblue
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    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

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    Actually this time around (as it has been of late), it's the borders and the ability to apply for state status with the U.N. without sanction.
  7. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Because Israel lived in peace and tranquility prior to '67, amirite?

    It's naive to even indulge this. The radical element in the Islamic world and among the Palestinians controls, and as long as it controls, the goalposts will continue to shift. That element is human detritus, and would only (maybe) be sated if Israel were driven straight into the sea. Have you seen what Palestinians put on TV? 21st century blood libel, Jewish shopkeepers literally slitting Muslim childrens' throats for the special ingredient in the matzos.
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  8. g8tr80
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    g8tr80 Well-Known Member

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    Of course it is. We are talking conditions for a cease fire. We aren't even talking about a peace treaty. That will never, ever happen. That is what makes it so ludicrous. The whole 1967 border thing is a joke to begin with. Hmmmm......what happened in 1967 that shifted the borders....let me think.......
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  9. swampspring
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    swampspring Well-Known Member

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  10. MichiGator2002
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    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    A ceasefire is a fall back position from "victory". That's what Israel should be focused on, and what the entire world should be supporting them in.
  11. dadx4
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    dadx4 Well-Known Member

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    That's NOT going to happen.
  12. dadx4
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    dadx4 Well-Known Member

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  13. GatorBen
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    GatorBen Well-Known Member

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    The start of the Six Day War was a mess, and culminated from the combination of a few elements within IDF looking for an excuse to fight some of its neighbors, Nasser being a loud mouth, and Egyptian subordinates only passing pieces of the intelligence they were receiving from the Soviets up to Nasser.

    The Soviet Union initially sent Nasser a heads up that they believed an Israeli invasion of Syria to deal with the Golan Heights was imminent. The problem? The Soviet Union also sent Egypt a warning to be careful because they believed Israel was looking for an excuse to invade Egypt as well, and that second warning didn't get passed up the Egyptian chain of command to Nasser.

    Egypt responded by increasing the troop presence in the Sinai (although not to anywhere near the levels they would need to mount an invasion) and declaring that they intended to honor their mutual defense pact with Syria in the event Israel invaded Syria. They also responded by closing the Straits of Tiran, which their right to do was subject to debate under international law. Nasser offered to refer the legality of closing the Straits to the ICJ for determination, but Israel refused and declared it an act of war and invaded the Sinai.

    Basically, as a result of a bunch of chest puffing and a game of telephone, they wound up in a war that no one in the region (with the possible exception of a few non-mainstream folks in the IDF command) wanted to fight.
  14. HallGator
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    While Hamas is bringing a lot/most of this on the Palestinian people I don't trust the Israeli government any further than I can throw them. Hell, I don't trust our own government so why the devil would I trust theirs.
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  15. dadx4
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    dadx4 Well-Known Member

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    I trust Israel's government way more than ours.
  16. HallGator
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    Yeah, because...............................? Whose interest do you think they care about? Ours or theirs?
  17. shelbygt350
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    shelbygt350 Well-Known Member

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    Whose Charter calls from the destruction of one type of people and a specific country?
  18. dadx4
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    dadx4 Well-Known Member

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    Alex, I will take who is Hamas for $1,000? :cool:
  19. orangeblueorangeblue
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    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

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    Hamas point of contention since 2008 has been the 1967 borders and a two-state solution. This is obviously not something Israel will ever be interested in.

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