Fresh Takes: Old Man has Issues With Youngsters, Culture

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by wgbgator, Sep 10, 2013.

  1. wgbgator
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    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

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    In a new series, brought to you by me, I present today's freshest takes on culture:

    http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/10/miley-cyrus-is-young-america/

    Youngsters are adrift in a sea of narcism, despair and casual sex - agree or disagree?
  2. fastsix
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    fastsix Well-Known Member

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    As long as they stay off my lawn it doesn't really matter to me.
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  3. reformedgator
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    reformedgator Premium Member

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    I agree, but why do you think that's so prevalent in todays culture?
  4. OaktownGator
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    OaktownGator Well-Known Member

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    "Each generation imagines itself to be more intelligent than the one that went before it, and wiser than the one that comes after it."

    -George Orwell
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  5. rivergator
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    rivergator Well-Known Member

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    it seems like many are, but not the ones I know. nor the children of my friends. i know lots of young people who are nothing but great. Bright, interesting, fun ...

    those who do seem lost, I hardly think it's because of Facebook and Twitter. And Ablow's comments about Obama and McCain are simply stupid.
  6. docspor
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    docspor Member

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    "The danger of civilization, of course, is that you will piss away your life on nonsense." Jim Harrison
  7. wgbgator
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    wgbgator Sub-optimal Poster Premium Member

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    Pfft. What does that old guy know? :grin:
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  8. exiledgator
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    exiledgator Gruntled Premium Member

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    This is undoubtably true, but it doesn't alter the reality that since the "technological revolution" each generation is successively more open/tolerant/liberal in its youth. Some might call it depraved. Some might call it enlightened. What ever you call it: Miley Cyrus is not the Beatles.

    Whether this is a good thing or a bad thing is worthy of discussion, but there's no legislative action or religious doctrine that can alter this. Though I'm sure most of this thread will be devoted to blaming this ideology or that ideology, we should instead be focused on what is important to them and what drives them. Outside of that we have to hope they mature to lead us in our old age and/or that events conspire to create greatness out of what some see as narcissistic despair.
  9. OaktownGator
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    OaktownGator Well-Known Member

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    Talent aside, in the comparison between Miley and the Beatles, I think there is a legit cultural comparison.

    The Beatles were the devil (along with much of the 60s rock movement, and "hippie" culture) to a lot of folks in my parent's generation.

    I think to some extent, every generation views the challenges of the next generation like this.

    That said, Miley behaving like a cheap skank doesn't represent her whole generation... I'll give them more credit than that. They have challenges we never could have considered, but I expect they'll deal with them.... and then have similar concerns about the next generation.
  10. docspor
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    docspor Member

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  11. rivergator
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    rivergator Well-Known Member

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    she did a pretty decent version of Dolly's Jolene, too

    link

    but that doesn't excuse that really horrendous performance. it wasn't just a matter of her try so hard to be slutty, but she did it so badly.
  12. MichaelJoeWilliamson
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    MichaelJoeWilliamson Well-Known Member

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    Exactly so
  13. exiledgator
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    exiledgator Gruntled Premium Member

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    I think we're largely in agreement here. There is most certainly a huge comparison to be made, just as there's a comparison to be made between playing "cowboys and indians" outside with sticks and stones vs playing a Zombie first person shooter video game on a 60" Plasma with realistic brains blasting on the wall. Kids today are exposed to "more" earlier than you and I. Kid's tomorrow: even earlier, I suspect.

    I also agree she's not representative. I actually think there's massive potential in future/present generations as knowledge becomes ubiquitous but impermanent in consciousness. I think there is also great risk. Change is happening on an unprecedented scale and while Orwell's words still ring true, the future is more unknown than ever; as the present is less familiar than ever. A bit scary for the tweener (middle aged) generation.
  14. orangeblueorangeblue
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    orangeblueorangeblue Well-Known Member

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    Right, but I don't think that's a fair comparison. There have always been untalented-but-popular hacks around.
  15. exiledgator
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    exiledgator Gruntled Premium Member

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    The amount of perceived talent isn't what's being compared here.
  16. OaktownGator
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    OaktownGator Well-Known Member

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    The rapidity of change, the volume of information to process, the easy access to more "adult" information before people are really adults, the ease with which a life can be invaded if a person isn't careful, the difficulty in knowing how to structure education and career goals is such a rapidly changing world... there are certainly many things going on that we never had to deal with, and could be very stressful for anyone, let alone people also dealing with adolescence and learning to become a functioning adult.

    From those perspectives, I'm definitely with you.
  17. docspor
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    this discussion reminds me of this....I recall it as an interesting read & I am a Ramones fan...

    http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/29/magazine/29RAMONE.html


    What the parallel deaths of Ramone and Crosby prove is that it really doesn't matter what you do artistically, nor does it matter how many people like what you create; what matters is who likes what you do artistically and what liking that art is supposed to say about who you are.
  18. docspor
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  19. wargunfan
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    From a card carrying pessimist:
    If anyone can convince themselves that the moral fiber of the current generation (or for that matter the society in general) is in some way, any way, equal to previous generations then I congratulate you on your powers of self persuasion. Miley Cyrus is only a symptom of what now passes for popular culture.
    By any measure the last three generations are progressively less religious, less moral, more promiscuous, more drug using, less faithful, more licentious, more pornographic, less industrious and based on the number of those receiving welfare of some form, less ambitious than their grandparents.
    I too am an old man and I have a perspective that spans the last eight decades. I am well traveled and well educated. I have lived in diverse cultures. From that perspective I have looked across the passing decades and watched the demise of our culture as it proceeds unabated. This is a hard thing to watch and it must be even harder for a young person to hear. I guess when you have a different perspective and a lot of personal capital invested in this current society you don't want to hear an old man put down your generation. Hard truths are easy to ignore or rationalize away.
    I love my country and I still think it's the best hope for mankind. But it is so much less than it was in terms of the quality of the culture and the citizens that it produces. Each generation has its high points and lows but we have wallowed in relative prosperity for so long that we have forgotten what personal responsibility means. Even in wartime so few of us actually fight the wars that we have forgotten what real and personal sacrifice means.
    The young have bought into the lie that truth and morals are relative. This lie allows unlimited license for human nature to sink as low as its desires will take it. The result of this relativism is the human wreckage we see all around us. As moral absolutes have faded from our culture acceptance of the degenerate and perverted has become the norm. The dynamic of strong traditional families that was once the backbone of the country has been dangerously undermined by the explosion of single parent families and welfare dependence. A poverty stricken, uneducated and violent subculture has become a permanent fixture in this country. Racial division and hatred is tearing at the fabric of the culture. We have slipped into mediocrity in terms of the educational standards needed to maintain our place in an ever more competitive world and we are squandering the human capital that once made us the envy of the planet.
    Our young have become the victims of our own success. Perhaps we loved you too much, gave you too much, demanded too little from you and failed to instill character in you that would help you to live in freedom and prosperity without being ruined by them.
  20. docspor
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    You need to read the rational optimist. By almost every measure things are not only continuously getting better but the 2nd derivative is positive too. We live in an amazing time & it is tragic that you can't appreciate it. It seems that our unprecedented good times has the unfortunate side effect that people have the luxury to sit around and fret about what is wrong. Just a few generations ago, you'd've long been dead. Probably after a desperate, brutal life.

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