Duke Gets #1 Okafor & #4 Jones Verbal Commitments for 2014

Discussion in 'Nuttin' but Net' started by Jaggator, Nov 15, 2013.

  1. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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    The rich get richer. Duke gets not one but both...Jahil Okafor and Tyus Jones, the #1 and #4 players in ESPN top 100. Duke will be loaded the next couple years getting the 2 best players at their positions.

    They teamed up and wanted to play at the same college. Narrowed it down to Kansas and Duke. They just went live on ESPN to announce this. Okafor said Coach K was the winningest coach and the reason he wanted to play for the legend when asked why Duke?

    Jones was asked who sold him on Duke. He said they sold each other and wanted to play together.

    Also, Duke is getting one of the best players to come out of Jacksonville that also signed with them for 2014.

    I wonder why Florida was never considered when we could really use a player like Okafor.
  2. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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  3. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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  4. Jaggator
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    Jaggator Well-Known Member

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  5. channingcrowderhungry
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    channingcrowderhungry Well-Known Member

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  6. BLING
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    BLING Well-Known Member

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    I like our class too, and best thing about our class is probably no "one-and-done's" in it.

    That being said, we need to land a big man in the worst way possible. I'd take a 7 foot "project" player just to have a big on the roster. Especially with this Damontre Harris business. We look like we're going to get some bigs in 15 and 16, but just ONE in 14 would be nice.
  7. REM08
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    REM08 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I bet Coach K is going to refuse the LOI's of these two - seeing as how they're probably one and dones! Look, I like Florida's class too, but there's no question it could be improved by a OAD big man.

    Dukes class is scary good and if they combine it with good returning players from this year - they may actually want to print up some 40-0 tshirts. Well maybe not go that far, but they'd be tough.
  8. A100
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    A100 Active Member

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    How did that Oden/Conley deal work out for tOSU?
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  9. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    You Kentucky fans really are sensitive about the one and done thing. Listen, it is pretty simple with our program: the complexity of our offensive system and Donovan's onerous approach to earning playing time means freshmen typically can't jump into the fray and do well for us. Brad Beal and Donnell Harvey are the only kids we've had who left after their first seasons. We've had plenty of highly talented future pros who could barely get on the floor or get touches as freshmen, let alone get to the league directly (Bonner, White, Lee, Horford, Noah, Brewer, Speights, Parsons). Other coaches may be more flexible in their approach or have more adaptable systems or less complicated systems and they tend do much better not only recruiting one and done players, but getting them to the league. If we had a regular diet of immediate entry players, there would be zero continuity in our program and it would drive Donovan to the brink.
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  10. BEH
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    BEH Active Member

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    What a load of crap.

    The Florida offense is no more complex than Calipari's. Geeze, I have played and watched basketball for nearly sixty years and the reason you go through drills all the time is to do things without thinking. Any system that is complex will fail even in the pros. One important feature that does matter is being used to playing with the same fellows, but they is overcome in the first few months.

    When most of your Florida players named went to the NBA the one year deal was not a rule. Beal was a one and doner because he was good enough to do it. Plus he thrived in Donovan's system just like the juniors and seniors did.

    Donovan has been in on recruiting nearly ever one and done player Calipari signed and had they gone to Florida that supposed complex system would not have been a bother to them at all.
  11. twodaparty
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    twodaparty Well-Known Member

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    Um one of the best teams ever to not win it all and that was only because they ran up against a once in a generation special team...
  12. jmoliver
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    We all bow down to the vast knowledge of BEH. What a dick.
  13. REM08
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    REM08 Well-Known Member

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    You certainly follow UF closer than I do, but I don't see it this way.

    The "system" isn't too complicated for a first year player. Its just not. Wasn't for Beal - and he's not one in a million. There just haven't been very many one and done types (like Beal) who come in mature and physically ready to have major impacts as freshmen and then have the option of being a lottery pick the following year. Your sample in this case (past UF recruits) doesn't have enough of these types of players for you to make the statement you do. I'd bet Wall, Knight, Irving, Tyus Jones, etc. all step in and...somehow...manage to execute Donovan's brain surgury-esque offensive schemes. Think Donovan's tepidness to give freshmen minutes keeps them off the floor? Not a chance. By March he'd have the players on the floor who gave him the best chance at winning ESPECIALLY on those last minute plays that flat out look like someone dribbling around before launching up an ill-advised or contested shot - if they dont' turn the ball over first. Sounds harsh, I think BD's a great coach. But the thought of his system being too heady for elite freshmen is laughable. I mentioned point guards because that's one of the more difficult positions to step in and play. The same would hold true for freshmen like Davis, MKG, Jabrari Parker, Randle, the list goes on... Granted, this is a special bunch and I'm not saying that every elite freshmen (based on recruiting ranking) or every one and done player would apply to what I suggest above.


    I have NOTHING against Billy and think he does a great job - would still take him at UK next time its open. I have nothing against fans who take pride in how their coach does things or recruits. I just don't agree that classes are better if they dont' have a OAD player and dont' agree that Billy's system precludes the vast majority of elite freshmen from playing a significant role.
  14. dangolegators
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    dangolegators Well-Known Member

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    You can have your rent-a-players. I like seeing the Gators build teams over the course of 2, 3 or 4 years. I like getting to know the players, seeing them develop and grow. I wouldn't trade places with Kentucky for anything. Calipari's one-and-done model does not appeal to me at all.
  15. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    Feel free to compare Calipari's DDO and Donovan's ball screen system. I look forward to hearing your breakdown, Naismith.

    Uh, that surely didn't prohibit players from leaving after a year.

    I agree. And he was the exception.

    And how many of those did he get? How many were one and done? The point is that freshmen don't integrate quickly into our offense. If your sixty years worth of obviously immense hoops knowledge maybe knew something about the last fifteen years or so at Florida, you could probably run down a list of elite prepsters who struggled their first season here with the demands of the system. It is with good reason that Donovan has often talked about the appreciable second year "bump" in our program: most freshmen don't pick up the system and get comfortable in its actions, options, and freedoms the first year.
  16. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    Most of this is addressed in the post to your fellow Cat above, but a couple of points:

    Then what exactly was the difference between Mike Miller, Brett Nelson, Matt Bonner, David Lee, Jo Noah, Al Horford, Corey Brewer, or Mo Speights between their first and second years? They were mostly all-league sophomores after nominal freshmen seasons. The guys who left or could have left the next year were mostly lottery selections or at least legitimate first rounders. What changed? Is it just typical second year improvement you can find at any program? What accounts for, in most cases, roughly a 75% to 150% improvement in offensive productivity as sophomores?

    Where did I say he wouldn't give them minutes? He has proven more than once that he will, specifically Mike Miller, Matt Walsh, Anthony Roberson, Nick Calathes, Brad Beal, and now Hill (though Hill is as much by default as anything). But what do all of those players have in common? Immense basketball intelligence. There were plenty of players rated just as highly who couldn't get on the floor or who struggled or who found themselves stuck behind a more experienced player because they couldn't pick up a different position (examples of those include Harvey, who wasn't a fulltime starter as a frosh because he couldn't execute our four spot, Lee, James White, Speights, Young).


    What's laughable is that you dismiss it without showing any evidence of what our system entails or the history that supports it.

    What I find fascinating is how you Cat fans come so easily conflate these two points because of your inveterate insecurity about the one and done philosophy. They are completely unrelated. We would take any number of elite preps if they fit our system and could pick it up and contribute as freshmen. Donovan has recruited many of them over the years.

    But that has nothing to do with the fact that freshmen in general struggle adapting to our transition ball action and rapid ball screen half court offense with all of its subsidiary sets, especially at the one and the four. The point in response to yet another insecure Cat knee-jerk response to a comment about one and done players is that instability hurts our program significantly more than it might hurt others (as seen by the transfer problems of Donovan's first ten or so years here) precisely because we can't expect freshmen to pick up our system and run with it as easily as others might be able to.

    Leave it to two Kentucky fans to try and poke holes in something that has nothing to do with their recruiting philosophy and which is nonetheless pretty easy to substantiate historically and schematically.
  17. REM08
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    REM08 Well-Known Member

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    You're right OAD brings instability and that it could hurt some programs more than others. I've never said going for every one and done player possible was the way to go for anyone.

    Other than that, you did a good job of convincing me that you think Florida has had many freshmen like the ones I named. Either the names you listed were on par, as freshmen entering college, with the players I listed and Donovan passed them over in favor of veteran players - or they weren't as good as the guys I listed and improved over time prior to being starters. Otherwise, you've got a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy going there. I can see why its the more attractive option. Maybe one day UK will land a coach I can be proud runs a system only understandable by nuclear physicists - or, you know, a player who stuck around for a second year...
  18. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    Of course, it is a case-by-case basis. Maybe you didn't follow recruiting much before Calipari arrived--I don't know. But many of these kids were top 10-15 recruits in their classes. Some were much farther down, but still exhibited a massive leap between years one and two (despite really struggling at times, far more than you might expect, as freshmen). That's why I said recruiting one and done players and the difficulties of freshmen adapting to our system are only tenuously related. Brandon Knight, Kyrie Irving, or John Wall would have been fine because they play so smart; others would be disasters. The point is that Donovan has become very selective about some of the kids he recruits precisely because he is more interested in how a kid might fit than in finding a way to make him fit.


    Again, despite your impression that all college hoops revolves around Rupp, it has nothing to do with Kentucky. I could care less what you guys do under Calipari or after him.. This entire conversion has nothing to do with your program, despite your best efforts to interject a good dose of Blue Blood narcissism. My initial response to BEH's sarcastic response was to explain why one and dones do not typically work out for our program.
  19. REM08
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    REM08 Well-Known Member

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    Now this isn't nearly as disagreeable from my perspective (other than my UK agenda I guess - or the narcissism I hope).
  20. rserina
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    rserina VIP Member

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    Sorry

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