Conservatives: Pre-Existing Conditions?

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by 108, Oct 5, 2013.

  1. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

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    Often times it doesn't. Many people are born with medical conditions. I had an uncle that was born with a heart condition that required surgeries every few years to keep him alive. By the time he died in his mid-40s, he was in massive medical debt (despite having taken responsibility, going to college, getting a good job, etc). I guess he should have taken the personal responsibility to develop a better heart in the womb.
  2. agigator

    agigator Active Member

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    The fact that something isn't their fault doesn't change the probabilities. No matter who's fault it is, insuring preexisting conditions is going to cost more money. It's not their fault that they have bad genes. Guess what, it's not my fault either. Since you're so worried about it why don't you make up the difference, out of your own pocket?
  3. g8orbill

    g8orbill Gators VIP Member

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    Hell he wants it free
  4. corpgator

    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    Yep, getting our healthcare at half the cost will be a huge mistake.
  5. JerseyGator01

    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    If we had a true free market healthcare system and a government that kept out of healthcare other than for those who really need it, this question would have been addressed decades ago.

    It's like asking how to swat an elephant-leaching fly with two elephants in the room.

    I was born with a cancer that essentially killed my dad after a long battle at age 61. I once approached Aetna about a treatment that would save me time and them a lot of money. They couldn't care less about it because it didn't favor doctors in their network. I ended up appealing to the state of PA and they agreed with me at every point.

    There are so many people getting government coverage for such basic stuff, while I have to jump through hoops just to save the system money. Unreal.

    CORRUPTION RULES!!!!!
  6. MichiGator2002

    MichiGator2002 VIP Member

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    Insurance spreads *risk*. Covering preexisting conditions isn't spreading risk, it is spreading the absolute metaphysical certainty of cost. Insurance is a business model of a company willing to wager their coverage vs. your premium that you won't get sick at all. That is what "spreading risk" means. Where is the "risk" in just trading less money for more money?
  7. g8orbill

    g8orbill Gators VIP Member

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    Somebody is going to pay for it corp
  8. diehardgator1

    diehardgator1 Well-Known Member

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    Do you thank someone can pay a small penalty get sick then run down and buy ins and let others pay his bill.

    Or why dont we make ins comp insure a house after it burns down or insure a car after it has a wreck or insure someones life after they die because the funeral is going to put a hardship on the family

    Now if you are asking should some one with preexisting conditions be able to change ins comp and get that cond covered by the new comp I agree with that
  9. agigator

    agigator Active Member

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    I understand this is an emotionally charged issue. Keep in mind, the libs on Gatorcountry are generally pretty decent, though misguided, people. Liberal politicians, on the other hand, are generally dishonest and cynical. To our resident libs on GC, Obamacare is a compassionate program to help those who can't help themselves. To Obama and the politicians it's a way to extend their influence and control over the population. It also sets up a nice apparatus for getting rid of political opposition.

    The thing about healthcare is that it's life and death so people have a tendency to forget that it's subject to the same economic realities as any other issue. In order to reduce the cost of healthcare one of two things must happen. The demand must go down or the supply must go up. Artificially changing the price won't do either of those things but it will allow people to delude themselves that prices are lower.
  10. corpgator

    corpgator Well-Known Member

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    We already are. That's the joke.
  11. g8orbill

    g8orbill Gators VIP Member

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    No where near as much as this bill will cost especially when 47% of you pay no iincome taxes
  12. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

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    Healthcare is subject to economics, no doubt. But it is different than most markets for a few reasons. First, the elasticity of demand is lower than in just about any other market for a huge number of procedures. Most people are willing to endure a medical bankruptcy for their emergency bypass surgery, for example. So prices are not controlled by an outside option, as is typical (for example, if the price of a television goes up, I will buy more books, computers, keep my current TV, etc.).

    The second aspect that is different is that hospitals, as very high fixed cost facilities, have relatively low levels of competition in local markets. The hospital market has an HHI (an economic measure of industry competition) that is double the threshold over which a market is considered "highly concentrated." 80% of MSAs are characterized by highly concentrated hospital markets. Therefore, in most cases, it appears that hospitals are somewhat of a natural monopoly/oligopoly. Without competition, that eliminates the other major mechanism that lowers cost.

    So healthcare is different from other markets in that there really aren't effective mechanisms in the free market system that reduce the cost of services.
  13. GatorGrowl

    GatorGrowl Forum Admin Staff Member GC Staff VIP Member

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    So that would include drinking, dipping, recreational drugs, smoking
  14. gatordowneast

    gatordowneast Well-Known Member

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    Simple, if you want to play in the game, you need to insure everyone. And you can charge higher rates to smokers, heavy drinkers, drug users, the grossly obese...those who choose risky habits, get to pay higher tolls. Just like in life insurance.
  15. MichaelJoeWilliamson

    MichaelJoeWilliamson Well-Known Member

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    I have no problem with providing welfare health care for those that can't afford it for themselves.
  16. billfisher65

    billfisher65 Premium Member

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    Ill answer the question if you will answer one for me. Do you believe in evolution?
  17. austingtr

    austingtr VIP Member

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    What is a pre-existing condition? Are you talking someone acquiring emphysema because they have been a smoker? Diabetes on someone obese?
    I believe health plans should not be able to kick you out of insurance just because you got cancer or ill, provided you had been paying your health insurance. if you are in the insurance business, then you have to pay up.

    Congenital diseases should be treated/covered their health care in teaching hospitals. Charity should/is part of doctors care. Kids born with diseases is a tragedy, and we should all pitch in and help. Government could help in that minuscule segment of the population.

    Adults getting sick? Shit happens. People should plan for their future misfortunes, they should have strong families and take care of each other. We are all going to die, we are all going to get sick or have an accident, and we should all plan accordingly.

    This culture in which we believe we have to have insurance for everything, like that is going to prevent you from tragedy is just a racket peddling on people's emotions. Insurance companies are there to make money, NOT to "cover your family in distress". People seem to not understand this. This is the problem.

    We go back to the times patients paid doctors with chicken, favors, and people took care of each other, and we are all much better off. Relying on government to take care of your needs is simply believing in fairy tales.
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  18. OB1

    OB1 Active Member

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    If lowering the cost healthcare was the goal, letting the industry have any input into this horrible law was probably a bad way write it. But hey, let's pass it so we will find out what's in it, which we really haven't found out totally yet!
  19. Tasselhoff

    Tasselhoff Well-Known Member

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    1. Selling insurance across state line.
    2. Tort reform
    3. king with the states to fins ways of LOWERING MEDICAL COST.
    4. Charging more for those that partake in risk increasing activities. Drugs, alcohol, tobacco, obese, etc..
    5. Any adult that does not have insurance but does have a condition from one of the above...tough luck. Engage in risky behavior... reap what you sow. If you had insurance and lost it (lost your job, moved etc...) then you can be covered.

    These are just off the top of my head.
  20. 108

    108 Well-Known Member

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    I know it's going to cost more, hence spreading the risk on behalf of the patient, and not reducing the risk on behalf of the insurer

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