Bianchi: If Spurrier wins SEC at Carolina, it would eclipse what he did at UF

Discussion in 'RayGator's Swamp Gas' started by Bianchi, Jul 16, 2014.

  1. fphingator

    fphingator New Member

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    Spurrier wins the Sec I'll go out on a limb and actually read a Bianchi article.Heck I'll even click on Dooley article and read his iPod list.
  2. lurkingator1

    lurkingator1 -,~--~,< … Go Gators, Living among the savages Premium Member

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    Kyle Morris
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  3. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    The team was still struggling under sanctions, and just coming out of it in 1989 by having two great recruiting classes in 1987 and 1988. It was coming back alive by 1989, when the accusations derailed Galen, followed by a gambling scandal that took out two quarterbacks.

    How did we do the three seasons before sanctions crippled us? 9-2-1, 9-1-1, and 9-1-1. How could THAT happen without Steve or Urban?

    I really learned something here. A team gets more wins if they score a lot of points. My, I wonder how many times Bear Bryant's Alabama teams scored 40 or more points from 1977 through 1979?

    Year----------Alabama W/L-----Opponent---------------Opponent W/L--------Points Scored

    1977.................11-1-0........................Louisville (mid-major)...........7-4-1...............................55
    1077.................11-1-0........................Auburn....................................5-6-0..............................48
    1978.................11-1-0.........................Vandy.....................................2-9-0...............................51
    1979.................12-0-0........................Baylor.....................................8-4-0...............................45
    1979.................12-0-0........................Vandy.....................................1-10-0..............................66
    1979.................12-0-0........................Florida....................................0-10-1..............................40

    By golly, good thing Ol' Beah died in 1982. How in the world could he have survived the offensive onslaught of the University of Florida in 1990? To think that all those coaches, from Woody Hayes in the past to Frank Beamer and -- yes -- Steve Spurrier today, would believe that it isn't necessary for a team to score 40 points a game in order to win games. How well did SOS learn his lessons?

    Year-----------USCe W/L---------Opponent------------------Opponent W/L--------------Points Scored

    2005....................7-5...........................Troy State (mid-major)........4-7................................................45
    2005....................7-5...........................Kentucky................................3-8................................................44
    2006....................8-5...........................FAU (mid-major)..................5-7................................................45
    2006....................8-5...........................MTSU (mid-major)...............7-6................................................52
    2006....................8-5...........................Houston (mid-major).........10-4................................................44
    2007....................6-6...........................None
    2008....................7-6...........................None
    2009....................7-6...........................None
    2010....................9-5...........................Southern Miss (mid-major)..8-5................................................41
    2010....................9-5...........................Troy State (mid-major).........8-5................................................69
    2011..................11-2............................East Carolina (mid-major)...5-7................................................56
    2011..................11-2............................Georgia.................................10-4...............................................45
    2011..................11-2.............................Kentucky...............................5-7................................................54
    2011..................11-2.............................Citadel...................................FCS...............................................41
    2012..................11-2.............................East Carolina (mid-major)..8-5................................................48
    2012..................11-2.............................UAB (mid-major)................3-9................................................49
    2013..................11-2.............................Arkansas...............................3-9.................................................52
    2013..................11-2.............................Coastal Carolina...................FCS................................................70

    Fifteen 40+ point games in nine years. Hall had 9 such games (not six) in six years.

    SOS average: 1.7 per year
    Hall avereage: 1.5 per year

    And no, Hall didn't have ten times the talent SOS had at USCe. Hall did have tougher schedules.

    Heck, if we cherry pick Florida during the Zook years, Meyer's first and last year and Muschamp's years (8 years total)

    2002: 2
    2003: 2
    2004: 4
    2005: 3
    2010: 3
    2011: 3
    2012: 1 (against USCe)
    2013: 0

    Total: Eighteen 40+ point games in eight years, with our dysfunctional non-SOS run offenses...

    OTOH, you have teams like, say, Oklahoma State, who finished 8-5 in 2012 in spite of AVERAGING 45 points per game, or their 2008 season where they finished 9-4 while averaging 41 points per game.

    The moral is that Spurrier produced excitement with winning, and with this excitement, captured the imagination of the public, the media and his opponents. But that 1990 team would have been mauled by Hall's 1984 and 1985 teams. that 9-2 record was masked by a weak schedule. The 1991 team would have fared better against The Great Wall, Kerwin and our stable of NFL running backs -- not to mention some of the best defenses Florida ever had.
  4. JerseyGator01

    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    Bear cheated. Spurrier didn't.
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  5. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    You're right about Pell, of course. His adventures at Clemson is why the NCAA was focusing on him.

    But frankly, I do. If I was the head coach at Florida, and I was trained by Bear Bryant, the master of the trade, and watched so many of his acolytes and peers play by Southern football rules, I would do the same. Why should Dooley, Majors, Vaught, Jordan, Bowden, Schellenberger and the rest bend the rules with impunity while we don't? That was how the game was played at the time. Adapt or perish.

    One thing I learned as an historian is that throughout history, if you want to win, you have to play by the same rules everyone else plays by. Do you think the Allies played by the rules prior to and during World War Two? If we applied our nation's principles to alliances and rules of warfare, it would have resulted in a far different scenario. We lied and cheated our way into the war and then chose to ally ourselves with a government that was every bit as evil as Hitler's. We then turned our backs on hundreds of millions of people in order to appease a Soviet Union at war's end. But that's another topic altogether.

    Machiavelli's odious dictum, The Ends Justify The Means, is a reality, not an ideal. It was this reality that spawned the governments of the USSR, Nazi Germany and Red China, among all the other communist and fascist dictatorships. As Arthur Koestler explained, "The Commissar believes that the end justifies ANY means, while the Yogi belives that while the end is uncertain, the means means everything." This is true in life as well.

    Absolutely. He did it with innovation, a passing offense in a run-dominant game. No argument there. If SOS was NOT winning and his FnG was not effective, would he have resorted to "playing by the Southern rules," as everyone else did? As scrupulously honest as he is, I doubt it. But he wouldn't have had the career he attained.

    Personally, I would rather win Spurrier's honest way than Pell's (and the rest) dishonest ways, but if I was in the chair, how long would I keep my job if I said, "I'd rather go 0-11 every year and not cheat than go 11-0 playing the same way everyone else does?" I would be able to look at myself in the mirror before gooing to my 9-5 job at the hardware store with my integrity intact.
  6. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    You know this how? Faith or love?
  7. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    Would he have done that if he went to LSU or Alabama? Saban went to both and may do that as well.
  8. JerseyGator01

    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    The problem with late 80s teams is that they had little depth, especially on offense. This would show in the second half of the year. I can't even imagine what the team would have been like without Emmitt. The QBs in 1988 threw 3 TD passes and 17 Ints. Talk about one dimensional!
  9. lurkingator1

    lurkingator1 -,~--~,< … Go Gators, Living among the savages Premium Member

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    You do realize that Dating back to the 1960s, Alabama icon Bear Bryant called UF "a sleeping giant" However still no titles until Spurrier was hired in the 90s.
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  10. regator

    regator Active Member

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    Who cares what Bear said. Just because he suppsedly said something doesn't make it gospil.

    The reason Florida, miami and FSU became good was air conditioniing whick allowed the migration to Florida. Population is what woke the sleeping giant. In 1960 florida had just over 4 million people. In 1990 when Spurrier took over we had just under 15 million
    Population and a great coach in Spurrier
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2014
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  11. fphingator

    fphingator New Member

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    Had Galen not been removed we would of been fine and Spurrier would've of never been Ufs coach.Hall had us on the right path,everywhere he's coached he was successful.More than coaching I attribute Floridas emergence to air conditioning,which allowed the State to grow.Allowing 12 months of outdoor athletics and an increase in population.With or without Spurrier it was only a matter of time until the program woke up.
  12. regator

    regator Active Member

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    Yeah and there would have been a heavy weight champion with or witout Mahomid ALi.
    But there still is no fighter like him.
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  13. JerseyGator01

    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    For four consecutive years (1986 thru 1989), our QBs threw more INTS than TDs. We were a good first half of the year team but a lousy second half team. I like Galen Hall, but he inherited a full cupboard thanks to our cheating.
  14. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    There was a reason for it. Sanctions.
  15. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    Dead on about the AC. Population was the biggest reason by far, as:

    Year----------W/L Record---------Head Coach

    Miami:

    1983.....................11-1-0.........................Schnellenberger
    1986.....................11-1-0.........................Johnson
    1991.....................12-0-0.........................Erickson
    2000......................11-1-0........................Davis
    2001.......................12-1-0........................Coker

    Florida:

    1983.......................9-2-1.........................Pell
    1985.......................9-1-1..........................Hall
    1991.......................11-1-0.........................Spurrier
    2006.....................13-1-0.........................Meyer
    2012......................11-2-0.........................Muschamp

    Florida State:

    1987.......................11-1-0........................Bowden (and Florida sanctions)
    1991........................11-1-0........................Bowden
    2013.......................14-0-0.......................Fisher
  16. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    Gawd, you can't be serious. When he had the loaded cupboard, he went 9-1-1 and 9-1-1! When that ran out, he had the 7-5 records. It is a towering testament to him that although we were crippled by sanctions, we STILL didn't have a losing season.

    Spurrier inherited a loaded cupboard, thanks to the efforts of Galen Hall and staff. Spurrier inherited a far better situation than his successor did, who had to replace 38 starters in three years. No school in the nation had three years straight of 12-13 lost starters per year. SOS knew that when he left.
    • Boring Boring x 1
  17. ces1948

    ces1948 Well-Known Member

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    It would be quite an accomplishment.
  18. JerseyGator01

    JerseyGator01 Well-Known Member

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    People forget the impact of probation. I remember watching those "loaded" late 80s teams. Thin as thin gets.

    Here is a 2002 forecast for the team which predicted them to be #6. Yes, they lost a lot of people from the year before but that's what happens with great teams like 2001.

    http://www.nationalchamps.net/NCAA/2002Preseason/florida.htm
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2014
  19. mulegator

    mulegator VIP Member

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    Does Bianchi actually say that ONE SEC championship at South Carolina would eclipse all those SEC championships AND a national championship that Spurrier won at Florida?
    REALLY ???
    Pass that √ over here will ya Mike.
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  20. Wormwood56

    Wormwood56 VIP Member

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    The teams from 1986-88 were indeed paper thin, but they were just coming into their own in 1989 when off field issues (Hall dismissal, gambling scandal, etc) dominated the events. The 1990 was absolutely loaded.

    Of course, it doesn't help to have quarterback call Spurrier plays behind the OC's back when the rest of the offense isn't on the same page. Zook could have put Brock Berlin in after the Ole Miss giveaway, but he was already gone to Miami.

    We lost some very key starters from the 2001 team as well, including two starting WRs, three starting OL'men Mike Pearson, Alex Brown, Andra Davis, Lito Sheppard, and many others. It was a shell of the 2001 team. Any notion that Zook inherited the #3 team in the nation is patently absurd. Meyer "inherited" the #2 team in the nation in 2010 (with his own players, mind you), and also went 8-5.

    Stassen's preseason consensus for the 2002 Gators was 6th, and they finished 26th (also receiving votes). The preseason consensus for the 2010 Gators was 4th and they finished 29th (also receiving votes). This is why many blamed Addazio, because after all, a GOOD coach would never underperform like that.
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2014

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