Good news - happens ocassionally

[Row6]

[PSGator66]

Pretty sad that such a chart has to even exist in this day and age.

[scrappygator]

But it is progress. Can't criticize that. I would love to see those two lines diverge at 180 degrees.

[Lawdog88]

Not to wee-wee on the hopeful expectations, but what we've got here is a potentially superficial idea accompanied by meaningless graphs, actually.

Without knowing, these figures may include only first-time enrollees who wash out after a semester or two . . . and then become part of the incarcerated group. In other words, it is one thing to enroll in college - a good thing, usually, if you are suited to the task - and another thing to have the skills and tenacity to finish. I see no evidence from the "graph" that correlates the enrollees to those actually completing studies.

If the survey accounted for graduation / completion rates, to me, that would make it more meaningful. I mean, what happens to the enrolees who don't make it ? Do they become unemployed, do they take low-paying but honest jobs if they can find them, and / or do they join the African-American sub-culture and underground economy ?

I also have a lot of other sociological / economic background questions about both groups as well, but I will save those for the next round.

[Row6]

Originally Posted by Lawdog88

Not to wee-wee on the hopeful expectations, but what we've got here is a potentially superficial idea accompanied by meaningless graphs, actually.

Without knowing, these figures may include only first-time enrollees who wash out after a semester or two . . . and then become part of the incarcerated group. In other words, it is one thing to enroll in college - a good thing, usually, if you are suited to the task - and another thing to have the skills and tenacity to finish. I see no evidence from the "graph" that correlates the enrollees to those actually completing studies.

If the survey accounted for graduation / completion rates, to me, that would make it more meaningful. I mean, what happens to the enrolees who don't make it ? Do they become unemployed, do they take low-paying but honest jobs if they can find them, and / or do they join the African-American sub-culture and underground economy ?

I also have a lot of other sociological / economic background questions about both groups as well, but I will save those for the next round.

Maybe, but if your fear was actually occurring wouldn't the numbers entering prison rise rather than stay constant? There would be a lag of course but over a decade they would show up.

[LittleBlueLW]

I just hope we aren't wasting tax dollars paying for these useless studies. This stuff is just intuitive and should need to be studied.

And the incarceration rate is not constant over the 10 years.

[rivergator]

Good news and bad news:

Racial/ethnic disparities in U.S. incarceration remain substantial – In 2009, African Americans and Latinos constituted more than 60% of imprisoned offenders. African American males were incarcerated in state and federal prisons at 6.4 times the rate of non-Hispanic white males, and Hispanic males at 2.4 times the rate of non-Hispanic whites.
Declining rate of incarceration for African Americans – From 2000 to 2009 the rate of incarceration in state and federal prisons declined 9.8% for black men and 30.7% for black women.
Rates of incarceration for whites and Latinos generally rising – Incarceration rates for white men and women rose 8.5% and 47.1%, respectively from 2000 to 2009. For Hispanics the men’s rate declined by 2.2% while the women’s rate rose by 23.3%.
Dramatic shift in racial disparities among women – In 2000 black women were incarcerated in state and federal prisons at six times the rate of white women. By 2009 that ratio had declined by 53%, to 2.8:1. This shift was a result of both declining incarceration of African American women and rising incarceration of white women. The disparity between Hispanic and non-Hispanic white women declined by 16.7% during this period.

link

[Lawdog88]

Originally Posted by Row6

Maybe, but if your fear was actually occurring wouldn't the numbers entering prison rise rather than stay constant? There would be a lag of course but over a decade they would show up.

Don't get me wrong: in principle I applaud the apparent fact that more African-Americans are enrolling in college.

First, the information is very sketchy and not correlated to much, but I do agree that the AA prison population is more constant than the other phenomena said to be indicated on the enrollee graph.

There will always be a pool of applicants for the prison pool. Like you, I hope that it is not going to be augmented by the college drop outs.

[Row6]

Originally Posted by LittleBlueLW

I just hope we aren't wasting tax dollars paying for these useless studies. This stuff is just intuitive and should need to be studied.

And the incarceration rate is not constant over the 10 years.

Translation:

Their must be a blivet hidden in this free pony's saddle bag.

[Row6]

Originally Posted by Lawdog88

Don't get me wrong: in principle I applaud the apparent fact that more African-Americans are enrolling in college.

First, the information is very sketchy and not correlated to much, but I do agree that the AA prison population is more constant than the other phenomena said to be indicated on the enrollee graph.

There will always be a pool of applicants for the prison pool. Like you, I hope that it is not going to be augmented by the college drop outs.

We agree.

[LittleBlueLW]

Originally Posted by Row6

Translation:

Their must be a blivet hidden in this free pony's saddle bag.

I know what a blivet is, but what?

AFTR, college good - incarceration bad.

[Row6]

Originally Posted by LittleBlueLW

I know what a blivet is, but what?

AFTR, college good - incarceration bad.

I don't know what AFTR is.

A blivet is 10 pounds of ....... Rice Krispies in a 5 pound bag.

[Lawdog88]

Originally Posted by Row6

I don't know what AFTR is.

A blivet is 10 pounds of ....... Rice Krispies in a 5 pound bag.

Thank goodness blivets are not found deep in the kimchi.

We would be in serious doo-doo.

[gatorpa]

Originally Posted by Lawdog88

Not to wee-wee on the hopeful expectations, but what we've got here is a potentially superficial idea accompanied by meaningless graphs, actually.

Without knowing, these figures may include only first-time enrollees who wash out after a semester or two . . . and then become part of the incarcerated group. In other words, it is one thing to enroll in college - a good thing, usually, if you are suited to the task - and another thing to have the skills and tenacity to finish. I see no evidence from the "graph" that correlates the enrollees to those actually completing studies.

If the survey accounted for graduation / completion rates, to me, that would make it more meaningful. I mean, what happens to the enrolees who don't make it ? Do they become unemployed, do they take low-paying but honest jobs if they can find them, and / or do they join the African-American sub-culture and underground economy ?

I also have a lot of other sociological / economic background questions about both groups as well, but I will save those for the next round.

I think of the MASSIVE cost of college and the huge increase over the last 10 years in accrued student debt. What happens when they can't get jobs due to the crap economy or just can't/won't pay back the loan? Who is on the hook?

[LittleBlueLW]

Originally Posted by Row6

I don't know what AFTR is.

A blivet is 10 pounds of ....... Rice Krispies in a 5 pound bag.

And for the record

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...43148975,d.eWU