02-14-2013, 03:54 PM
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#21
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wgbgator
If Dorner wanted to put the LAPD on trial, he was an extremely poor strategist.
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He didn't want to go to trial--he wanted to go out in a flame of glory--Hollywood movie style.
I'm just saying the the LAPD could not even risk the possibility of capturing him alive, and an ensuing trial.
__________________
 "Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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02-14-2013, 03:57 PM
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#22
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Sub-optimal Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 16,578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92gator
He didn't want to go to trial--he wanted to go out in a flame of glory--Hollywood movie style.
I'm just saying the the LAPD could not even risk the possibility of capturing him alive, and an ensuing trial.
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If he was determined to die, then there was no risk. No different than any other "suicide by cop."
__________________
"The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openess, honesty, understanding and feeling, are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meaness, egotism and self-interest, are the traits of success." 
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02-14-2013, 03:58 PM
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#23
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Gator Country Diamond
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Inside the War Room, No Name City, FL
Posts: 26,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorman_07732
I think I hear some fully auto noise in this feed, but I can't tell whether its a 50 cal or not.
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Well the only .50 cal. autos I know about are mounted on Bradleys, Hum Vees, Abrams tanks, and are securely in the hands of the government. Collectors and museums may have some, but they are usually mounted. The rest are semi-auto sniper configured rifles and can be carried. Heavy rascals, but portable.
__________________
On the third day he rose again in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.
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02-14-2013, 04:02 PM
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#24
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Sub-optimal Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 16,578
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Besides, I'm not sure what "risk" was invovled in a trial. He ambushed two civilians in a parking garage in an act of vengence against a former employer. That doesnt give him a forum to air his grievances.
The "risk" at best would be him becoming a Mumia-like figure rotting in prison or on death row. Even then, he'd have very little credibility.
__________________
"The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openess, honesty, understanding and feeling, are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meaness, egotism and self-interest, are the traits of success."
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02-14-2013, 04:03 PM
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#25
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Heisman Finalist
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,284
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If he had anything on the LAPD why did he resort to killing innocent people instead of taking his case to court?
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02-14-2013, 04:05 PM
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#26
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Premium Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The Irish Riviera
Posts: 23,842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawdog88
Well the only .50 cal. autos I know about are mounted on Bradleys, Hum Vees, Abrams tanks, and are securely in the hands of the government. Collectors and museums may have some, but they are usually mounted. The rest are semi-auto sniper configured rifles and can be carried. Heavy rascals, but portable.
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He's the one that claimed to have a Barrett 50 cal. I'm shot them and machine gun shoots and he could have certainly carried it with him.
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02-14-2013, 04:06 PM
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#27
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,692
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A very reasonable question. I know few will agree, but I have the same question on Bin Laden. I am not comparing the two people, but I don't see the legal justificatiion for execution.
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02-14-2013, 04:06 PM
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#28
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wgbgator
If he was determined to die, then there was no risk. No different than any other "suicide by cop."
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Really? No risk of getting cold feet, in the face of death? No risk of his firearm failing him? No risk of being hit, or otherwise disarmed/disabled, but not killed? No risk of him surrendering, after several hours of stand off? No 'risk' at all?
Nonsense. Those risks were so great, that when they had him cornered, in a cabin, surrounded from every side....they SWIFITLY torched the place down.
Nah...no risk there at all...
__________________
"Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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02-14-2013, 04:07 PM
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#29
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Gator Country Diamond
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Inside the War Room, No Name City, FL
Posts: 26,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorman_07732
He's the one that claimed to have a Barrett 50 cal. I'm shot them and machine gun shoots and he could have certainly carried it with him.
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The Fish and Wildlife guys got into a firefight with him as Dorner abandoned the truck and fled to the cabin. They would have seen what he was carrying.
__________________
On the third day he rose again in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.
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02-14-2013, 04:07 PM
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#30
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalSFGator
A very reasonable question. I know few will agree, but I have the same question on Bin Laden. I am not comparing the two people, but I don't see the legal justificatiion for execution.
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We couldn't risk him going to trial either.
__________________
"Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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02-14-2013, 04:08 PM
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#31
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Sub-optimal Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 16,578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92gator
Really? No risk of getting cold feet, in the face of death? No risk of his firearm failing him? No risk of being hit, or otherwise disarmed/disabled, but not killed? No risk of him surrendering, after several hours of stand off? No 'risk' at all?
Nonsense. Those risks were so great, that when they had him cornered, in a cabin, surrounded from every side....they SWIFITLY torched the place down.
Nah...no risk there at all...
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Geting cold feet or surrendering kinda means you are not determined to die. See my other post why a trial wasnt really a risk either.
__________________
"The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openess, honesty, understanding and feeling, are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meaness, egotism and self-interest, are the traits of success."
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02-14-2013, 04:10 PM
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#32
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Premium Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The Irish Riviera
Posts: 23,842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawdog88
The Fish and Wildlife guys got into a firefight with him as Dorner abandoned the truck and fled to the cabin. They would have seen what he was carrying.
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That's is a good point, but what has been said from the F&W guys?
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02-14-2013, 04:22 PM
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#33
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Gator Country Diamond
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Inside the War Room, No Name City, FL
Posts: 26,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorman_07732
That's is a good point, but what has been said from the F&W guys?
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Haven't heard from them yet. Perhaps they are still preparing the script, er, report.
While I totally understand the motivation of what happened, it would be refreshing to hear them just come out and say, "Hey, we looked at it and we decided not to risk anymore law enforcement folks to get this guy. We did what we did.", instead of trying to justify it with invented facts.
Like the .50 cal. thing if he really didn't have one (you know, the announced justification to keep the firetrucks away). He might have said he had one earlier in his announcements, and maybe he actually ran from the F&W guys carrying one . . . and maybe not.
__________________
On the third day he rose again in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.
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02-14-2013, 04:23 PM
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#34
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Premium Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,074
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by 92gator
That's what your government is counting on--you (and everyone else)--not carrying.
Did you know (let alone care) that your government used chemical weaponry that is banned under UN treaty--IOW--the kind of stuff we condemned Saddam Hussien for using on his own people--and the kind of stuff we would never use on our worst enemy--on a bunch of rednecks in Waco Texas?
(no matter it seems, that those 'rednecks' happened to be US citizens).
...yeah...who cares....
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Everyone knows America does things, then turns around and tells others not to do it. That's why were the land of hypocrites, and I wasn't saying who cares about slaying thousands of people? I was talking about one rogue cop, who was going to die regardless.
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02-14-2013, 04:23 PM
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#35
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wgbgator
Besides, I'm not sure what "risk" was invovled in a trial. He ambushed two civilians in a parking garage in an act of vengence against a former employer. That doesnt give him a forum to air his grievances.
The "risk" at best would be him becoming a Mumia-like figure rotting in prison or on death row. Even then, he'd have very little credibility.
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OJ Simpson killed 2 civilians. Rodney King had quite a record, and arguably posed a threat of imminent danger (believed to be high on PCP). Those things were largely looked past, as the focus came on LAPD's integrity in discharging its duties.
Already, this guy had develeoped a facebook following, and even some apparent sympathy of hollywood elites.
__________________
"Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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02-14-2013, 04:29 PM
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#36
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gator1986
Everyone knows America does things, then turns around and tells others not to do it. That's why were the land of hypocrites, and I wasn't saying who cares about slaying thousands of people? I was talking about one rogue cop, who was going to die regardless. And I guess your calling me a redneck? So your a liberal hippy douche? Lol name calling... I'm not a redneck, I just don't care about one guy... Sorry...
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I didn't call you redneck--that was a reference to the cult members in Waco--not to you. And it was in the sense of what the goverment viewed them as--not me.
btw: "LOL @ name calling"...and then swiftly resort to same. 
FYI: I'm not a liberal (nor a douche, or a hippy).
__________________
"Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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02-14-2013, 04:33 PM
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#37
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Heisman Finalist
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,094
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92gator
We couldn't risk him going to trial either.
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Nonsense.
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02-14-2013, 04:41 PM
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#38
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Sub-optimal Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 16,578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92gator
OJ Simpson killed 2 civilians. Rodney King had quite a record, and arguably posed a threat of imminent danger (believed to be high on PCP). Those things were largely looked past, as the focus came on LAPD's integrity in discharging its duties.
Already, this guy had develeoped a facebook following, and even some apparent sympathy of hollywood elites.
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OJ was a rich, likeable celebrity. Dorner was an unpopular crank who didnt work well with others. Given the OJ debacle, I doubt they' let the trial get out of hand or bungle the investigation like they did back then. The LAPD while still terrible, was arguably even more f'd up back in the 90s.
__________________
"The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openess, honesty, understanding and feeling, are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meaness, egotism and self-interest, are the traits of success."
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02-14-2013, 04:42 PM
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#39
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Heisman Finalist
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 305, USA
Posts: 4,607
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"Burner" is police slang for tear gas canisters, it doesn't necessarily mean they were incendiary grenades. But with that said I agree that from the radio transmissions it sounds like they did it intentionally.
That was a historic, 100 year-old cabin. No need to burn it down. It was a wood cabin, not a concrete-reinforced bunker. They could've snaked a camera line in there, found his location within the cabin and shot him through a window. With armor piercing rounds they probably could've shot him right through the wall. They didn't need to burn that Jimmy Lee Dykes guy out in Alabama a couple weeks ago and they didn't need to burn this guy either.
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02-14-2013, 05:00 PM
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#40
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Heisman Candidate
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MastaG8r
"Burner" is police slang for tear gas canisters, it doesn't necessarily mean they were incendiary grenades. But with that said I agree that from the radio transmissions it sounds like they did it intentionally.
That was a historic, 100 year-old cabin. No need to burn it down. It was a wood cabin, not a concrete-reinforced bunker. They could've snaked a camera line in there, found his location within the cabin and shot him through a window. With armor piercing rounds they probably could've shot him right through the wall. They didn't need to burn that Jimmy Lee Dykes guy out in Alabama a couple weeks ago and they didn't need to burn this guy either.
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Excellent points.
__________________
"Too much sanity may be the greatest maddness of all--to see life as it is rather than as it should be.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, via Don Quixote
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