Prather and Rosario out so...

[UFG8rGuy3283]

Originally Posted by rserina

Nice to see Tupac show up with his typical moderation. So, should we renew the kid's scholarship or not?

There is a reason BO isn't playing. Doesn't mean he won't improve and earn PT, but I don't see where Tupac is off base this time

[tupacbiff]

Originally Posted by rserina

Nice to see Tupac show up with his typical moderation. So, should we renew the kid's scholarship or not?

Never said he wasn't scholly worthy or could improve. Said from what u see he shouldn't get min this yr. he likely won't get min next yr. if we land a recruit he won't play much jr yr.

No need to be moderate when being truthful. I could see this playing out three ways 1) like I said 2) he gets upset and works his butt off to improve and force tge staff to give him min or 3) something I don't comment on in season

[gatorbogey]

the implication is braxton won't improve, though. that seems over the top that you assume he's not going to improve and lose out to some recruit. we all assume the recruit will out-perform someone that has a year or two in the system. that's a stretch. given that braxton was once 'that' recruit too.

[rserina]

Originally Posted by gatorbogey

the implication is braxton won't improve, though. that seems over the top that you assume he's not going to improve and lose out to some recruit. we all assume the recruit will out-perform someone that has a year or two in the system. that's a stretch. given that braxton was once 'that' recruit too.

Exactly. He is a combo guard whose minutes are being chewed up by three upperclassmen in front of him (Boynton, Rosario, Wilbekin). He doesn't have the size to defend the three like Frazier and Graham and he can't effectively run the point right now, which is the most difficult position to master in Donovan's system (hell, maybe in all of college basketball). We have more than enough off guards in front of him and so he has been unable to get a rhythm on the floor.

But for our resident savant, the three or four games he has seen him play are reason enough to take a rather innocuous comment from another poster and turn it into an unnecessarily pessimistic account of the kid's prospects. In all honesty, I have no clue whether or not Ogbueze will make it in the end. But neither does Tupac. Yet that has never stopped him from pontificating with little substantiation of his points. Why others don't have him ignored I will never know. It astonishes me how many here fawn over him.

[tupacbiff]

Originally Posted by gatorbogey

the implication is braxton won't improve, though. that seems over the top that you assume he's not going to improve and lose out to some recruit. we all assume the recruit will out-perform someone that has a year or two in the system. that's a stretch. given that braxton was once 'that' recruit too.

Incorrect. The implication is he won't improve enough to beat out hill and Scottie (99% certainty). Hill is an nba pg and Scottie has size and experience plus def on him by a lot. The further implication is berry will be better than him despite his experience in his jr yr (75% certainty). How can I say that? I've seen all 3 play. Braxton was never that level of recruit, sorry but you are wrong on that point.

Look I hope he becomes and all American and best guard in the country but I just haven't seen anything in him to indicate he will be more than what I previously stated.

[UFG8rGuy3283]

Originally Posted by rserina

Exactly. He is a combo guard whose minutes are being chewed up by three upperclassmen in front of him (Boynton, Rosario, Wilbekin). He doesn't have the size to defend the three like Frazier and Graham and he can't effectively run the point right now, which is the most difficult position to master in Donovan's system (hell, maybe in all of college basketball). We have more than enough off guards in front of him and so he has been unable to get a rhythm on the floor.

But for our resident savant, the three or four games he has seen him play are reason enough to take a rather innocuous comment from another poster and turn it into an unnecessarily pessimistic account of the kid's prospects. In all honesty, I have no clue whether or not Ogbueze will make it in the end. But neither does Tupac. Yet that has never stopped him from pontificating with little substantiation of his points. Why others don't have him ignored I will never know. It astonishes me how many here fawn over him.

I get your point. I didn't, however, take Tupac's post as being negative toward Brax.

I don't think it's unfair to say that both Hill and Berry both have a higher skill set than Brax.

I think Brax can be a solid combo guard for us but don't see him playing a lot of meaningful minutes until he is a Jr.

I think this is a fair and honest outlook for his future at UF. Now, he may very well improve enough with hard work and may surprise. I hope he does, as all indication is he is a fine young man and a good ball player.

I also want to say that I disagree with Tupac more than I agree, but believe he does bring up points at times that others wouldn't which at least deserve discussion.

No fawning on my end. Simply think he is more on point than being given credit for on this one.

[gatorbogey]

Originally Posted by tupacbiff

Incorrect. The implication is he won't improve enough to beat out hill and Scottie (99% certainty). Hill is an nba pg and Scottie has size and experience plus def on him by a lot. The further implication is berry will be better than him despite his experience in his jr yr (75% certainty). How can I say that? I've seen all 3 play. Braxton was never that level of recruit, sorry but you are wrong on that point.

Look I hope he becomes and all American and best guard in the country but I just haven't seen anything in him to indicate he will be more than what I previously stated.

let me say this: you're basing your appraisal on brax vs college teams/talent and experience and hill etc on playing against h.s. talent.
when brax was coming in, i swear, sounded like, from the folks on the boards, that he would immediately take over pg duties. [some hyperbole involved in that statement, but it's like the typical attitude/opinion that most here have on the star recruits]. [it's one given/one constant that seems to never change whether it's football or basketball].

a suggestion: wait until hill goes up against experience college talent and then make the appraisal.

[UFG8rGuy3283]

Originally Posted by gatorbogey

let me say this: you're basing your appraisal on brax vs college teams/talent and experience and hill etc on playing against h.s. talent.
when brax was coming in, i swear, sounded like, from the folks on the boards, that he would immediately take over pg duties. [some hyperbole involved in that statement, but it's like the typical attitude/opinion that most here have on the star recruits]. [it's one given/one constant that seems to never change whether it's football or basketball].

a suggestion: wait until hill goes up against experience college talent and then make the appraisal.

I respectfully disagree. I think most who have seen Kasey Hill play on several different instances agree he is a special talent who will be playing in the NBA 1-2 years from high school graduation. It's not a knock on Brax. Hill is just special.

[gatorbogey]

i state hill in the rebuttal because he's the only known in the arguement. hill's indeed special, but "we're" benching brax 2 years from now in favor of an unknown theoretical recruit that's not even committed or signed. someone has 75% confidence in the absolute unknown. that's alot of faith. and it's a big time slap in the face of braxton, imo.

[tupacbiff]

Originally Posted by gatorbogey

i state hill in the rebuttal because he's the only known in the arguement. hill's indeed special, but "we're" benching brax 2 years from now in favor of an unknown theoretical recruit that's not even committed or signed. someone has 75% confidence in the absolute unknown. that's alot of faith. and it's a big time slap in the face of braxton, imo.

Or just a realistic assessment of the situation as it stands today.

[oneatatime]

Billy has said many times that the biggest improvement he sees in a player is between his freshman and sophomore season.

With the loss of Boynton and Rosario, I expect that Frazier could move into a starting job or as the 6th man. As for the other 3 freshmen, the jury is still out about the longer term impact they can make as Gators.

[tupacbiff]

Originally Posted by oneatatime

Billy has said many times that the biggest improvement he sees in a player is between his freshman and sophomore season.

With the loss of Boynton and Rosario, I expect that Frazier could move into a starting job or as the 6th man. As for the other 3 freshmen, the jury is still out about the longer term impact they can make as Gators.

Yes but often that improvement is largely dependent on a physical improvement. In terms of physical improvement:

Walker- obviously needs to get stronger
Graham- strength and quickness
Frazier- no specific area
Brax- where is he going to improve? Seems to be near his physical ceiling with only a slight room in all aspects.

[InstiGATOR1]

Originally Posted by oneatatime

Billy has said many times that the biggest improvement he sees in a player is between his freshman and sophomore season.

With the loss of Boynton and Rosario, I expect that Frazier could move into a starting job or as the 6th man. As for the other 3 freshmen, the jury is still out about the longer term impact they can make as Gators.

I expect next years two deep to be:

PG: Wilbekin, Hill
SG: Frazier, Graham
SF: Finney-Smith, Prather
PF: Yeguete, C. Walker
C: Harris,

This is pretty much the same mix UF has this year with one extra guard.

[lean_gator]

Originally Posted by gator7gh

Donovan is keeping alot of the startes in at the end of the game. Really need to get these players kurtz, graham and walker some playing time.

Not this sh*t AGAIN.....

[rserina]

Originally Posted by UFG8rGuy3283

No fawning on my end.

I wasn't addressing that at you. Sorry if it came off that way.

[UFG8rGuy3283]

Originally Posted by rserina

I wasn't addressing that at you. Sorry if it came off that way.

No worries. I'm way too over sensitive these day!

[609gjk]

A and M's stud is a 6'5" guard. Scottie and Kenny will probably be the ones to guard him. Will Yeguette will be rotating with the big men.

The reason Scottie played a lot his freshman year was because of his defense and the fact that we had no depth at guard. Not so now, Braxton is 5th option. It will be interesting to see how much he develops over the summer. I never thought Scottie would be a guard that could penetrate lane but he is beginning to do so. He has improved a lot every year.

[InstiGATOR1]

Originally Posted by 609gjk

The reason Scottie played a lot his freshman year was because of his defense and the fact that we had no depth at guard.

Nimrod Tishman called in and ask me to point out that no depth at a position does not necessarily get one off Donovan's bench if one is not ready to play at the UF level.

[NorthCaptivaGator]

If Scotty doesn't figure out how to beat the press pretty quick Braxton may get a shot. I can't believe the teams don't press us from the start we have been awful against it.

[InstiGATOR1]

Originally Posted by NorthCaptivaGator

If Scotty doesn't figure out how to beat the press pretty quick Braxton may get a shot. I can't believe the teams don't press us from the start we have been awful against it.

Like UF's play against the press, you too are suffering from a E.Walker hangover apparently. It is not the job of the PG to beat the press. It is the job of the team and staff to beat the press.

Actually the way UF is attacking the press is pretty sound. UF is not moving the ball quite as quickly as it should though against presses. That is you throw the pass when the double team is coming at you, not after it gets to you.