Gator Country

wgbgator · 12-14-2012, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveFla

Yes... My mistake. I can't expect you to actually USE common sense.

My bad.

I'd be happy to consider some evidence or argument on this. You could be right Dave, but excuse me if I'm not going to flippently dismiss real data based only on what you think about gun owners who respond to Gallup polling. That seems like common sense to me.

SECund2nun · 12-14-2012, 04:41 PM

I posted this on the other thread, but it's more appropriate on this thread:

Gun control does not prevent people from getting guns and going on rampages. Weed is illegal, yet millions and millions still buy it. Guns are no different. Switzerland has the highest gun ownership rates on earth- and has a very low crime rate. This is because you won't mess with someone in Swizterland because the chances are there is a person there with a gun who will shoot you...unlike here where you have to wait 20 mins for the first gun to arrive (the police).

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rivergator

we don't see quite as many mass killings by cars though, do we

Are 20 individual killings less devastating than a single killing of 20 individuals? I would suggest not.

Over 32,000 people died from automobiles in 2010. A little under 9,000 firearm related deaths in 2010. There are more firearms in the U.S. than cars. Why do we put so much focus on guns when automobiles are far more dangerous?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

DaveFla · 12-14-2012, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

Are 20 individual killings less devastating than a single killing of 20 individuals? I would suggest not.

Over 32,000 people died from automobiles in 2010. A little under 9,000 firearm related deaths in 2010. There are more firearms in the U.S. than cars. Why do we put so much focus on guns when automobiles are far more dangerous?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

Ahhh... You beat me to it. I was just getting the death by automobile data together to post a very similar response.

rivergator · 12-14-2012, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

Are 20 individual killings less devastating than a single killing of 20 individuals? I would suggest not.

Over 32,000 people died from automobiles in 2010. A little under 9,000 firearm related deaths in 2010. There are more firearms in the U.S. than cars. Why do we put so much focus on guns when automobiles are far more dangerous?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

Oh, I see. Well that certainly makes it clear that cars are worse than automatic weapons.

dangolegators · 12-14-2012, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

Are 20 individual killings less devastating than a single killing of 20 individuals? I would suggest not.

Over 32,000 people died from automobiles in 2010. A little under 9,000 firearm related deaths in 2010. There are more firearms in the U.S. than cars. Why do we put so much focus on guns when automobiles are far more dangerous?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

Regarding auto accident deaths, the numbers used to be much higher, even with about half the population we have now. And then more regulations came, tighter safety standards, etc, and the death rate from auto accidents has plummeted from where it was 50 years ago. So comparing guns to cars might not be the best way to go for you, unless you want more gun regulations and not less.

wgbgator · 12-14-2012, 04:50 PM

Cars also used to kill a lot more people, then consumer advocates like Ralph Nader got the government to pass stricter safety regulations resulting in less deaths and safer cars.

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rivergator

Oh, I see. Well that certainly makes it clear that cars are worse than automatic weapons.

Indeed, cars are killing more people than automatic weapons.

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dangolegators

Regarding auto accident deaths, the numbers used to be much higher, even with about half the population we have now. And then more regulations came, tighter safety standards, etc, and the death rate from auto accidents has plummeted from where it was 50 years ago. So comparing guns to cars might not be the best way to go for you, unless you want more gun regulations and not less.

This is true. Safety has improved immensely with automobiles, but they're still much less respected by drivers than guns are by gun owners. Auto safety has a long way to go, but there's not much more in terms of regulations that can fix this. Enforcement of existing policy and driver education are the biggest problems...sound familiar?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

ArtVandelay · 12-14-2012, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

Are 20 individual killings less devastating than a single killing of 20 individuals? I would suggest not.

Over 32,000 people died from automobiles in 2010. A little under 9,000 firearm related deaths in 2010. There are more firearms in the U.S. than cars. Why do we put so much focus on guns when automobiles are far more dangerous?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

So wouldn't the best solution be to try to make both safer? Do you think there would be a lot of people against making cars safer?

Or should we just want to say cars are more dangerous, so we shouldn't worry about guns?

407Gator · 12-14-2012, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgbgator

Cars also used to kill a lot more people, then consumer advocates like Ralph Nader got the government to pass stricter safety regulations resulting in less deaths and safer cars.

Cars have never killed people and will not do so until we have cars that drive themselves.

Car crashed kills people and the increases in safety are due to:

1) Less crashes due to better handling cars

2) Less crashed due to less drunk driving

3) Safer cars due to legislation and due to safety selling.

So cars became safer products to use.

Guns have also become safer to use. If you do not pull the trigger, the gun does not shoot.

The problem is that the gun is doing what it was designed to do. It is the user that determines if it used for good or used for evil.

The increase in safety of cars has not been free. It has resulted in more expensive cars that get worse mileage (than they could have). Also the bar makers are required to design vehicles that perform when the user misuses the product (airbags for unbelted drivers).

Of course we could all adopt the Chicago or DC laws, they work so well.

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgbgator

Cars also used to kill a lot more people, then consumer advocates like Ralph Nader got the government to pass stricter safety regulations resulting in less deaths and safer cars.

There's only so much you can do to protect people from people behaving irresponsibly. With all the safety measures we have in place, we're still killing 32,000 people per year.

It's an improvement, but it's far from successful.

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

Allanon · 12-14-2012, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeesGator

I do believe we need tighter gun control laws, but I also believe we are losing morality in our society.

If you said we've lost morality in our society, I'd agree with you.

zoltanuf · 12-14-2012, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 407Gator

If you do not pull the trigger, the gun does not shoot.

Also, if you don't have a gun, it does not shoot.

Allanon · 12-14-2012, 05:06 PM

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2...ck-school.html

The National Knife Association is to blame for lobbying against knife control legislation.

dangolegators · 12-14-2012, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

This is true. Safety has improved immensely with automobiles, but they're still much less respected by drivers than guns are by gun owners. Auto safety has a long way to go, but there's not much more in terms of regulations that can fix this. Enforcement of existing policy and driver education are the biggest problems...sound familiar?

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

So do you have to pass a gun safety exam before you can own a gun? Because you have to do that before you can drive a car.

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtVandelay

So wouldn't the best solution be to try to make both safer? Do you think there would be a lot of people against making cars safer?

Or should we just want to say cars are more dangerous, so we shouldn't worry about guns?

I think the worry is healthy. But it's not the guns or the cars that are the problem, it's the people using them. Forget gun legislation, let's figure out how we can develop the members of our society to be more productive. That will be more beneficial than any additional restrictive legislation that makes for a good headline. Just my opinion.

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

WESGATORS · 12-14-2012, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dangolegators

So do you have to pass a gun safety exam before you can own a gun? Because you have to do that before you can drive a car.

Different animals here, but in my opinion, the safety standards you must prove that you have mastered with respect to driving an automobile are a complete joke. People should be pressed much, much harder on how to handle adverse situations. We could *easily* cut the number of deaths in half just by demanding that drivers are more skilled before they are licensed. You can't really do that with guns because the problems are not typically related to "accidents."

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

dangolegators · 12-14-2012, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WESGATORS

But it's not the guns or the cars that are the problem, it's the people using them.

Actually, it was the cars that were a big part of the problem. Then they started improving the safety features. Maybe one way to improve the safety features for guns is to not allow them to shoot a lot of rounds in a short period of time.

407Gator · 12-14-2012, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dangolegators

o do you have to pass a gun safety exam before you can own a gun? S Because you have to do that before you can drive a car.

Sorry but this is not true. A 14 year old can start up a car and drive around town. What you meant to say is before you can LEGALLY drive a car.

BIG difference!