Jillian Michaels: Hypocrite.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

I've had plenty of luck with it

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

And to read some of the testimonials, the cost also includes calorie-counting until the day they die and prodigious activity.

And some who do none of that. It depends on your personality.

[Dreamliner]

Good luck!

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

I've had plenty of luck with it



And some who do none of that. It depends on your personality.

Some lost their weight using Weight-Watchers (other people counting calories for you). Some with Jenny Craig (other people feeding you ... Moo!). Some even resorted to weight-loss surgery.*

*Stomach amputation is the rage these days. Sounds like something out of the mind of a five-year old. Picture the following conversation at a dinner party:

Billy: "Mommy, why is Uncle Herbert so fat ?"

Mother: "I think because he can't stop eating."

Billy: "Well, why don't they just take his stomach out ?"

Mother: "Oh, you silly goose!"

Doctor overhearing conversation: "No, wait a minute. It could work."

[Dreamliner]

Continuing: to maintain their weight-loss, they still count calories. They still impose food restrictions. They exercise over an hour every day. They don't cheat, even on weekends. And they appear to consume 50 to 300 calories less, per day, than the average American. They never don't think about their weight.

I'm taking some of this from a NYT article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/01/ma...trap.html?_r=0

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Some count calories, some don't. I don't and I've maintained my weight and fat levels.

It can be done. Not only is it not impossible, it gets easier over time.

But like I said, I'm glad you acknowledged it's no longer damned near impossible. It's progress.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

Some count calories, some don't. I don't and I've maintained my weight and fat levels.

It can be done. Not only is it not impossible, it gets easier over time.

But like I said, I'm glad you acknowledged it's no longer damned near impossible. It's progress.

I know, you're down twenty pounds from your bulking days. Me ? I weighed like 151.6 when I got married, nearly 25 years ago. Now, I'm around 145 and have been for years. I'm a damn hero!

And I said 'statistically damn near impossible.' Something like 10,000 out of tens of millions. I've got an idea. You should produce a movie. Call it:

The Ten-Thousand

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Or 16%

My movie will be called Statistically Unimpossible

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

Or 16%

My movie will be called Statistically Unimpossible

Well, the nice thing about a movie is that it causes people to suspend disbelief.

The War On Obesity: A Battle Worth Fighting ?

http://www.lindabacon.org/pdf/Excerp...WeightLoss.pdf

[gatorev12]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Continuing: to maintain their weight-loss, they still count calories. They still impose food restrictions. They exercise over an hour every day. They don't cheat, even on weekends. And they appear to consume 50 to 300 calories less, per day, than the average American. They never don't think about their weight.

I'm taking some of this from a NYT article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/01/ma...trap.html?_r=0

I've been catching up in this thread and your responses/links...thanks for posting.

Certainly a lot of new stuff in there that I hadn't really known about beforehand.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Well, the nice thing about a movie is that it causes people to suspend disbelief.

The War On Obesity: A Battle Worth Fighting ?

http://www.lindabacon.org/pdf/Excerp...WeightLoss.pdf

Absolutely. Obesity - unlike being slightly overweight - is overwhelmingly responsible for a host of serious, life-threatening health conditions.

Also, the first study I posted included obese individuals, 11% of whom maintained 10%+ bodyweight reductions over 5 years following a weight loss program. 19% maintained 5%-9% bodyweight reductions. 3% maintained 15%+

So is it worth it? That depends on how badly you wish to avoid diabetes, heart disease, pancreatic cancer, colon cancer, stroke and disease in general. It's your choice whether you want to be that 11 of 100 or that 3 of 100.

In other words, it's probably worth it.

[enviroGator]

Are you two done with this thread? And can it now be moved to the Health Forum where it belonged in the first place?

[enviroGator]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

More people wear jeans in 2013 than did in 1913.

We now live longer.

Therefore, jeans make us live longer.

Read this and more in the March edition of Poor Conclusions And Science Failures Monthly.

FTW! /thread

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

Absolutely. Obesity - unlike being slightly overweight - is overwhelmingly responsible for a host of serious, life-threatening health conditions.

Also, the first study I posted included obese individuals, 11% of whom maintained 10%+ bodyweight reductions over 5 years following a weight loss program. 19% maintained 5%-9% bodyweight reductions. 3% maintained 15%+

So is it worth it? That depends on how badly you wish to avoid diabetes, heart disease, pancreatic cancer, colon cancer, stroke and disease in general. It's your choice whether you want to be that 11 of 100 or that 3 of 100.

In other words, it's probably worth it.

Causal link between obesity and diseases remains hypothetical:

http://ije.oxfordjournals.com/content/35/1/55.full

Concerns about obesity and mortality remain daft:

http://www.obesitymyths.com/myth2.11.htm

But EVEN IF obesity was a primary cause of killer diseases, we STILL don't have a clue as to how to turn obese people into thin people, as myriad studies confirm.

To date, there are no clinical studies showing weight-loss decreasing mortality risk. However, there is evidence suggesting that it increases mortality risk.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by enviroGator

Are you two done with this thread? And can it now be moved to the Health Forum where it belonged in the first place?

What are you babbling about ? This is incendiary! There is a War On Fat People. And I'm their only friend.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Obesity wrongly assumed to be cause of host of medical conditions:

http://www.obesitymyths.com/myth2.11.htm

But EVEN IF i t were, STILL, we don't have a clue as to how to turn obese people into thin people, as myriad studies confirm.

To date, there are no clinical studies showing weight-loss decreasing mortality risk. However, there is evidence suggesting that it increases mortality risk.

The support for obesity and heart disease, stroke & cancer is overwhelming. It's been repeated in dozens of studies, refuted by none.

Turning obese people into "thin" people isn't necessarily the goal. The goal is to turn them into "non obese" people. So as to avoid those confirmed health risks.

And studies support that it can be done and can be maintained long-term.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

The support for obesity and heart disease, stroke & cancer is overwhelming. It's been repeated in dozens of studies, refuted by none.

Turning obese people into "thin" people isn't necessarily the goal. The goal is to turn them into "non obese" people. So as to avoid those confirmed health risks.

And studies support that it can be done and can be maintained long-term.

Causal links remain hypothetical (see:edited post). SPECULATION remains overwhelming.

Turning obese people into non-obese people isn't working either. And even if it did, there is no evidence that it would decrease mortality risk. And there is evidence it might increase it.

The good news is that fat people seem to survive serious medical conditions and episodes (heart attack, diabetes, etc.) more readily than lean people. I'd think this would make you happy.

Why do you hate fat people so much ?

[Dreamliner]

Meanwhile, heart disease is actually down. Many forms of cancer are down. Diabetes, for all the panic, is basically unchanged.

Don't worry. Be happy. And lay off fat people. Besides, they'll likely be carrying you out when you die!

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Meanwhile, heart disease is actually down. Many forms of cancer are down. Diabetes, for all the panic, is basically unchanged.

They sure are.

But your odds of getting each increases by being obese.

Two unrelated (correlatory, even) facts.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Turning obese people into non-obese people isn't working either. And even if it did, there is no evidence that it would decrease mortality risk. And there is evidence it might increase it.

This is untrue. The evidence shows that going from being overweight to lean might increase it, but that same evidence indicates that being obese is more dangerous than being overweight or lean.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

They sure are.

But your odds of getting each increases by being obese.

Two unrelated (correlatory, even) facts.

Causal links remain conjectural. Likely stem from sense of moral panic. Or possibly just hatred of fat people. Correlation Police themselves resorting to correlation:

http://www.nutritionj.com/content/10/1/9#861