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When it comes to Rice and his QBs, the question could just as easily be whether he made them. And the same applies to John Taylor etc.
Exactly. All these claims about Rice being with HOF QB's his entire career---does it not cross their minds that without Rice, the QB stats and performance would likely be diminished quite a bit???
Again--it is youth which drives the support for Moss. Nothing more. In the real world, when the media--the league--the coaches and players--the VAST majority of fans who have actually watched the two, even opposing fans--agree that Rice is better.....it isn't even in the same breath to debate.
Rice IS the best. The facts back it up--not just opinions.
Any advantage Rice MAY have had with regard to QB's and supporting cast, surely is negated by the brand of flag football played most of Moss' career. Moss rarely had to worry about being hit, touched, or otherwise breathed on, while his QB could wait without fear for Moss to run his one route, 60 yards down field.
Wow, I went back and read through this thread. It's amazing that there are actually people making a case that Jerry Rice isn't the game's greatest receiver of all time. And saying that Moss is as a counter? I'm stunned.
Any statistic worth anything that counts would favor Rice in that discussion.
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"I can shoot threes now. I can finesse you. I can dunk on you. I can guard anything, and I'm rebounding better. When I block shots I catch the ball. I can post you up with my back to the basket and hit you with a post move. Or I can face you up and use my quickness to blow by you." - Chris Walker
Over 200 posts on a Randy Moss thread and no reference to "One Clap?"
Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS
That might be the most ridiculous video I've ever seen. Wow.
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"I can shoot threes now. I can finesse you. I can dunk on you. I can guard anything, and I'm rebounding better. When I block shots I catch the ball. I can post you up with my back to the basket and hit you with a post move. Or I can face you up and use my quickness to blow by you." - Chris Walker
There was more parity in the NFL during Moss' career than Rice's. There were more stacked teams and more really bad teams when Rice played.
Rice's '49er teams were ridiculously stacked. He played with hall of fame/MVP type QBs his entire career. Joe Montana, Steve Young, Rich Gannon. It wasn't just the QBs though. It was the whole package. Roger Craig, Dwight Clark, Terrel Owens, Tim Brown. Jerry was a weapon amongst many weapons his entire career and teams could not afford to focus much resources in defending him. They had to account for everything. Look at Young, that guy was a running threat on top of everything else. Culpepper was okay for a while (made by Moss, in my opinion, look what he did without Moss). Johnson was a game manager type QB, not a deep ball passer, not a high WR usage rate. At the tail end of Moss' prime he got to play with Brady and what happened? Single season TD record. Ya think maybe if Moss got to play with Brady from the start it might have been different? Or maybe, if Moss go to do the equivalent of Rice and played with Brett Farve and then Aaron Rodgers? Moss was head and shoulders better than Rice in my opinion.
You could say that Rice shouldn't have seen the ball as much with all that other talent around him. Isn't that what happened to Moss's numbers this year?
Agree 100%.
Rice was great, but just like Emmitt, he also benefited from having a GREAT team around him for the better part of his career. The offense that San Fran was running was taylor made for Rice's skillset and having John Taylor on the other side with Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing certainly didn't hurt.
As for pure talent, explosiveness and some of the greatest and most spectacular catches made by a receiver---Moss is/was better than Rice.
Moss could have played more years with great teams but he was not a team player interested in team goals. The Pats kicked him off the team. That's how valuable Moss was to a great team with a great coach and that why he played for bad teams and hasn't won anything.
-shrug- I think individual players get way too much credit and way too much blame for team results in a greatest ever conversation. Take Marino versus Montana. Most would say Montana was better. But, I watched both those guys play. Marino was way better. Montana had better teams. e smith has the nfl all time yardage stat. But he played behind those awesome cowboy lines for years with a great qb and great wrs. Smith was good but certainly not better than guys like Dickerson, Faulk, Sanders, Payton, A Peterson, Billy Sims, Oj Simpson, Etc. . ..
was rice great? Yeah. But there's lots of wrs out there with similar or better skills.
Since Emmitt was mentioned...true, there were/are many RBs with similar talent. BUT--Emmitt didn't have those same awesome OL's blocking for him at Escambua HS...at UF...and yet he still accomplished the feats he did at EVERY level. While there is no denying his line at Dallas was a big factor in getting him out of the gate so to speak, he did the vast majority of what he did--on his own. And while there may be many others with great juke moves--faster speed--quicker take off--etc, in the grand scheme of things, he was and still is...the best RB to play in the NFL, or possibly football in general. You are indeed selling him short.... in the big picture. Exactly the same as those advocating Rice not being the greatest WR. Exact same thing. You have to look at the entire body of work, and the overall accomplishments--along with the intangibles that can't be measured.
Opinions are just that, but the overall facts still bear out Rice IS the best. Moss is not even in the discussion....when viewing the big picture.
Rice is a gentleman and the best reciever we have seen,but I would pick another second by the name of Les Chandler,Moss only shooting off at the mouth because the media lets him.
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