Reasons You Should Eat Sugar

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by Sir_Gibby

Paleo

Here's the thing. On this brief thread we've learned that we are not to eat: sugar, dairy and now grains. This leaves meat and vegetables ... which is decidedly not yummy, but presumably will enable people to live as long as the cave men did!

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Obviously no food is inherently "better" than another, but your body needs certain things to survive and for the most part simple sugars is not one of them.

Could you get lean eating solely simple sugars, or utilizing them as most of your calories? Absolutely. Calories in, calories out. Might other parts of your overall health be hampered by this? Yeah, maybe.

Should people eat sugar if they want it? Yeah, no doubt. Is "go ahead enjoy sugar" good advice for everyone? Not so sure about that.

The problem with studies is the environments are typically tightly controlled. Human behavior is not.

Eating mostly Twinkies but getting only 1400 calories is going to work for weight loss and then subsequently cholesterol readings (would be interested, however, in hormonal changes over 10 weeks). But what about the people who won't or don't stop at 1400 calories? These are the folks to whom I would be careful in imparting said advice.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

The psychological component - which is probably the most overlooked part of fitness and training - is very important here.

[Sir_Gibby]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Here's the thing. On this brief thread we've learned that we are not to eat: sugar, dairy and now grains. This leaves meat and vegetables ... which is decidedly not yummy, but presumably will enable people to live as long as the cave men did!

What's your thoughts on it? I'm trying it out and seem to be enjoying it. I've never thought myself much of a veggie guy until I actually tried and it's pretty good, the obvious enjoyment coming from the fact that they are better for me more so than the actual taste.

I think it has some legs from the literature I've read but 'tis just my opinion.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

If you enjoy the paleo diet, it's fine. If you don't, there are a billion other dietary choices you can make that will work just as well.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

My contention isn't that LDL would go down and HDL would go up (or vice versa), it's that there are a host of other metabolic functions that would be impaired long-term without ample protein and quality fats.

Sugar is for short term energy ... that's its role.



Degree or will power, or call it what you will.

But here again, I would argue that since protein requirements are wildly exaggerated, Haub got plenty of it with his one protein shake, can of green beans, and whatever very small amount found in his various sugary treats. Bear in mind that although this was intended as a short-term experiment, the results shocked a nutrition professor.

And I regularly meet people who complain that when willpower was doled out that they got the short end of the stick. I tell them just to pretend that willpower doesn't exist and then we go from there.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

I would argue that since protein requirements are wildly exaggerated

I'm not arguing for protein requirements.

And I regularly meet people who complain that when willpower was doled out that they got the short end of the stick. I tell them just to pretend that willpower doesn't exist and then we go from there.

And I'm sure that will work for some people. And then for others it won't.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by Sir_Gibby

What's your thoughts on it? I'm trying it out and seem to be enjoying it. I've never thought myself much of a veggie guy until I actually tried and it's pretty good, the obvious enjoyment coming from the fact that they are better for me more so than the actual taste.

I think it has some legs from the literature I've read but 'tis just my opinion.

Gibby, if it's something you'd enjoy I'd say go for it. And in any case I recommend some folks moving in the direction of meat and veggies. I just don't agree with the argument that paleo in particular is necessary for health. I oppose 'nutritionism' which is the newly-minted term for people who are beset by a sort of cultish veneration of a particular diet.

My standard advice is to run from people who insist that they've found the diet for everyone and that all other diets are dangerous or sub-par.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

I'm not arguing for protein requirements.



And I'm sure that will work for some people. And then for others it won't.

I'll be sure and let you know when I've met the first person. I just think it's sad to imagine that, when human beings are born with a preference for sweets, that they are intended to wholly deny that preference. And sometimes I think that this notion that moderation is impossible for many is almost distinctly American. It reminds me of alcohol tabooism, sort of a learned helplessness.

[Sir_Gibby]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Gibby, if it's something you'd enjoy I'd say go for it. And in any case I recommend some folks moving in the direction of meat and veggies. I just don't agree with the argument that paleo in particular is necessary for health. I oppose 'nutritionism' which is the newly-minted term for people who are beset by a sort of cultish veneration of a particular diet.

My standard advice is to run from people who insist that they've found the diet for everyone and that all other diets are dangerous or sub-par.

Can't say I'm a nut about it (read: I just squashed a 50-count Dunkin Donut munchkin box over the past week) but I can't say that it's a BAD diet. I love me some bread but, after thinking about it, what am I really getting out of bread other than taste? I'd argue (perhaps in error) not much. No doubt it's lowered my calories, combine that with a 6+ mile bike ride everyday to and from work and playing an exuberant amount of sports, which I guess is the real benefit.

[Dreamliner]

I was having the sugar discussion with a fellow, just yesterday, who informed me that he had cut out sugar, lost 25 lbs. and feels much better. However, he quickly added that he replaced sugar with Splenda. So, now he's getting a lot of Splenda and will surely come under attack from the increasing hordes who insist that sweeteners are killing us.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

I just think it's sad to imagine that, when human beings are born with a preference for sweets, that they are intended to wholly deny that preference.

I think you've misconstrued what I'm saying. I'm saying if you are the type of person that cannot stop eating sweets once you start, you need to work on that before you can allow some to seep through.

That's all. Just that blanket advice like "enjoy sugar" enables some people.

As for encountering a person, you're relatively new to training, no? And people willing to pay for trainers are already fairly motivated people. So we're not exactly talking about the same population. That said, if you never have a failure to go with your success stories, you'll be the first to be able to say that.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by Sir_Gibby

Can't say I'm a nut about it (read: I just squashed a 50-count Dunkin Donut munchkin box over the past week) but I can't say that it's a BAD diet. I love me some bread but, after thinking about it, what am I really getting out of bread other than taste? I'd argue (perhaps in error) not much. No doubt it's lowered my calories, combine that with a 6+ mile bike ride everyday to and from work and playing an exuberant amount of sports, which I guess is the real benefit.

Well, I'd be among the first to admit that bread is probably overrated. It is certainly what I'd consider a calorie-dense food. It's nuts to think that, until recently, the FDA was recommending 7-9 servings of grains a day.

Paleo could be viewed as a sort of carb-restricted diet. Many people can eat meat and veggies ad libitum and lose weight ... because they are creating a calorie deficit. On the other hand, I'm training a woman who gained ten pounds while on a ketogenic diet. And I have a friend who gained weight on the Warrior Diet.

Hell, I've got a trainee who now tells me she wants to go back on Weight Watchers because she feels like she needs that sort of stringent calibration. I say more power to her. Let a thousand flowers bloom!

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

I think you've misconstrued what I'm saying. I'm saying if you are the type of person that cannot stop eating sweets once you start, you need to work on that before you can allow some to seep through.

That's all. Just that blanket advice like "enjoy sugar" enables some people.

As for encountering a person, you're relatively new to training, no? And people willing to pay for trainers are already fairly motivated people. So we're not exactly talking about the same population. That said, if you never have a failure to go with your success stories, you'll be the first to be able to say that.

Most of my trainees (and perhaps most Americans) fall into the category of people who must learn moderation. This is just in the warp and woof of the fabric as far as I'm concerned. Americans are almost by definition over-eaters.

As a trainer, I see myself in the role of a negotiator. I'm like the accountant who tells them, "If you want to get here, you're going to have to cut this much. So, where do you want to cut ?" and "You can have this much, but you can't have any more." And to date, they seem to be able to do it, provided that they have a clear 'budget plan' going in. To date, I haven't had to tell anyone to cut out an entire food group. Now, that does not preclude asking them to cut out a food item because they simply cannot fit everything they like into a tight budget.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

Most of my trainees (and perhaps most Americans) fall into the category of people who must learn moderation. This is just in the warp and woof of the fabric as far as I'm concerned. Americans are almost by definition over-eaters.

As a trainer, I see myself in the role of a negotiator. I'm like the accountant who tells them, "If you want to get here, you're going to have to cut this much. So, where do you want to cut ?" and "You can have this much, but you can't have any more." And to date, they seem to be able to do it, provided that they have a clear 'budget plan' going in. To date, I haven't had to tell anyone to cut out an entire food group. Now, that does not preclude asking them to cut out a food item because they simply cannot fit everything they like into a tight budget.

I'm sure you can understand my qualms about one-size-fits-all advice. "Go ahead, eat sugar" means something different to everyone. For some people, eating sugar can ruin a diet. People react differently to different things and are motivated by very disparate and distinct things.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

I'm sure you can understand my qualms about one-size-fits-all advice. "Go ahead, eat sugar" means something different to everyone. For some people, eating sugar can ruin a diet. People react differently to different things and are motivated by very disparate and distinct things.

And again, I'll let you know the first time I meet a person who cannot eat some sugar without ruining a diet. When I at long last meet that person, if I'm a trainer worth my salt I'll surely get behind them.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner

And again, I'll let you know the first time I meet a person who cannot eat some sugar without ruining a diet. When I at long last meet that person, if I'm a trainer worth my salt I'll surely get behind them.

You're lucky. I've probably met 5 in my life.

[Dreamliner]

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

You're lucky. I've probably met 5 in my life.

Maybe you wound up with my five.

[Dreamliner]

Just a further comment: I very quickly learned that as a trainer, I had to also be a bit of a psychologist. In other words, I have to be able to tap into how people tick and motivate them accordingly. But apparently I also have to be a bit of a sociologist. America is a country of fanatics, tabooists and prohibitionists. I'd rather not play into any of that ... even if it costs me some business.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

That's what I was hinting at here:

Originally Posted by orangeblueorangeblue

The psychological component - which is probably the most overlooked part of fitness and training - is very important here.

Fitness and motivation are so highly individualized that blanket advice is sometimes useless and why the industry is so often contradictory.