Randy Moss: "I'm the greatest receiver to ever play this game."

[tilly]

"I don't really live on numbers. I really live on impact and what you're able to do out on the field," he said Tuesday. "I really think I'm the greatest receiver to ever play this game."


Jerry Rice responded with:

"I impacted the game by winning Super Bowls... Randy is still trying to win his first one, and I wish him the best, but I was very surprised that he said he's the best receiver to ever play the game. I leave that up to my fans to make that statement."


http://espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/2012/story/_/id/8893843/super-bowl-2013-randy-moss-says-greatest-wr-ever-play

[GATORAZ]

I think Randy was the better player

[gatordee]

No one did it better than JR. When I read the comment by RM, JR was the first person that crossed my mind. And no way does RM end up with the receiving yards or td's Jerry has.

[GatorSean]

Its not even close. Rice >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Moss

[j7]

I think Randy was the better player

Agree

[ValdostaGatorFan]

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/14957_562181153800731_1589868745_n.jpg

[DawgFanFromAlabam]

Raymond Berry.

[GatorJeff]

Randy sent his daughter Sydney to play hoops for the Gators. That's enough for me. Moss. He's certainly the most dynamic, spectacular.

[GatorMets]

He must have spent the night at the Holiday Inn Express!

[Jaggator]

Raymond Berry.

A.J. Green :laugh:

[DawgFanFromAlabam]

A.J. Green :laugh:

I liked Unitas to Berry.

[gator2109]

If I am picking a WR in their prime to put on my team I am taking Moss every time. He can do spectacular things regardless of his QB and makes up for any shortcomings with his ability to dominate whoever was defending him. If I have an elite QB capable of picking defenses apart then Rice may be the play because he is a better all around WR. Rice played 20 seasons and his QB made the pro bowl 13 times with 5 MVP awards. He had a long career with consistently good QB play which is a large part of his monster stats. You have to give him the title as the best ever based on the rings and stats, but for my money Moss is the better player.

[ncg8or]

Moss in his prime >>>>>> Rice in his prime.

Sanders vs. Emitt, same deal.

[jagervol01]

If I am picking a WR in their prime to put on my team I am taking Moss every time. He can do spectacular things regardless of his QB and makes up for any shortcomings with his ability to dominate whoever was defending him. If I have an elite QB capable of picking defenses apart then Rice may be the play because he is a better all around WR. Rice played 20 seasons and his QB made the pro bowl 13 times with 5 MVP awards. He had a long career with consistently good QB play which is a large part of his monster stats. You have to give him the title as the best ever based on the rings and stats, but for my money Moss is the better player.
Moss was not a great receiver regardless of his qb. He was great with Cunningham, Culpepper and Brady. Not exactly Montana, Young and Gannon but all three Pro Bowl players. Randy's season with the Raiders and then the second go around with the Vikings and then the Titans were both disasters. He was also prone to disappearing in the playoffs.

[mikehev]

Are the individuals who think Moss is better joking?

This isn't even a comparison. Jerry Rice and its not even close.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

[gator2109]

Are the individuals who think Moss is better joking?

This isn't even a comparison. Jerry Rice and its not even close.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

I am simply saying the peak of Moss' arc is higher than the top of Rice's.

[gatordavisl]

Unbelievable the way this discussion has gone. There is much more than physical talent involved with being a football player. So Moss is taller and probably faster. Those who want Moss can have him. I'll take Rice, his work ethic, and what he's got between his ears EVERY time.

BTW - I wonder how many of you actually watched Jerry Rice play during his time.

[Jaggator]

Are the individuals who think Moss is better joking?

This isn't even a comparison. Jerry Rice and its not even close.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

Agreed! They are probably too young to remember Jerry Rice so they naturally think Moss because he's the player they've seen more of. Rice was drafted in the 1st round of the NFL in 1985 before a lot of posters were born.

[mikehev]

I am simply saying the peak of Moss' arc is higher than the top of Rice's.

Grant it, there were times that Moss seemed unstoppable, but there were also times that Marcus Dupree and Boobie Miles seemed unstoppable.

Potential and being the greatest of all time are two different things. I think I understand your point (though I probably can't agree with it), but for Randy to claim that he is the GOAT is crazy IMO.


In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

[sleeze]

Route Runner.....Rice
Hands................Push
Blocker'..............Rice
Deep Threat........Moss
Smarts................Rice

I could go on.....Rice just trumps moss all around.

[Minister_of_Information]

Jerry Rice is the greatest ever, Moss is the prototype.

[sleeze]

Oh yeah and for the sake of more argument.

Chris Carter had the Best Hands ..all time.

Discuss

[gatordee]

Jerrys awards:
1995
- Pro Bowl MVP
1993
- AP Offensive Player of the Year
1988
- Super Bowl MVP
1987
- AP Offensive Player of the Year
- Bert Bell MVP Trophy (Maxwell Club)
- PFWA MVP
- UPI NFC Offensive Player of the Year
1985
- UPI NFL-NFC Rookie of the Year

[gatordee]

Randy Mosses awards:
Randy Moss Awards

Profile
Famous as :
Football player
Birth Name :
Randall Gene Moss
Birth Date :
February 13, 1977
Birth Place :
Rand, West Virginia, USA
Claim to fame :
Parade All-American (1994)

NFL Anual Awards

1998
Won NFL Anual Award
category Associated Press Offensive Rookie of the Year

Quarter Awards

2002
Won Quarter Award
category Most Disappointing Player


Read more: http://www.aceshowbiz.com/celebrity/randy_moss/awards.html#ixzz2JQ8v7wgg

[Juggernautz]

I think Fitzgerald will surpass them both.

[RayUF07]

Just Google "Jerry Rice Records"


That should tell you all you need to know.

[corpgator]

Guess who holds the single season record for receiving yards?

[GatorJeff]

Grant it, there were times that Moss seemed unstoppable, but there were also times that Marcus Dupree and Boobie Miles seemed unstoppable.

Potential and being the greatest of all time are two different things. I think I understand your point (though I probably can't agree with it), but for Randy to claim that he is the GOAT is crazy IMO.


In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

Mike,

Isn't it "granted" (meaning "admittedly") rather than "grant it"? They both make sense in your usage context, I suppose. Perhaps they are both commonly used.

Back to the discussion.......if it's a lifetime achievement award, it goes to Rice. If it's for sheer talent and physical prowess, it goes to Moss.

[rounds]

Only thing Moss wins is "Most Sullen".

[RayUF07]

Guess who holds the single season record for receiving yards?

And?

Rice has about 100 others.

Rice also didn't play in an era where QB's can't be hit and WR can't be touched. Just about every top QB is throwing for 5,000 these days.

This really isn't an argument. Moss was a great player, Rice is the greatest ever.

PERHAPS Moss could have been, had he applied himself. We'll never know. I'd say if Moss had 1/2 the drive and work ethic of Rice, he would have been the best...

[statesborogator]

T.O. And Moss are a better comparison. Rice trumps them all.

[RayUF07]

Rice is one of if not the best player at any position to play the game. In fact, NFL Network ran a special 2 years ago where a panel picked the 100 best players ever to play.

Rice came in at #1. I don't think I can argue against that.

[GATORAZ]

I think Fitzgerald will surpass them both.

Nobody was better than Prime Moss

[Sylez_G_Koolaid]

I think Fitzgerald will surpass them both.

Fitz don't got a QB to throw it to him, bro.

[Sylez_G_Koolaid]

http://i45.tinypic.com/oti7n9.png

Randy Moss was the greatest of all time at running over police women!

[RayUF07]

Nobody was better than Prime Moss

You might change that to "Nobody was better than Moss when he wanted to play," and I might agree. But that doesn't make one the best ever. Moss was a 1 trick pony...granted he was very good at that trick. But he also could get taken out of games more easily, either by himself or by teams by simply taking away the go route. Obviously, he could still beat it at times, but he also took plays off often and gave up when things weren't going his way. For as good as Moss was, he could have been MUCH better had he had the work ethic and drive of a guy like Rice. I might put Moss at #2, but no way he passes Rice...it's not even really that close.

Rice reached 1,000 yards receiving 14 times. Moss did it 10 times. Rice scored at least nine touchdowns in a season 12 times. Moss did it nine times. Each had nine seasons with at least 10 touchdowns. Rice had four seasons with at least 1,500 yards. Moss had one. Rice had six seasons with at least 1,400 yards. Moss had four. And yes, Rice played longer, but let's be honest those extra years are far from glory years...and hell, look at Moss now...he could play 10 more years and still NEVER catch Rice. Moss was VERY good, for about 6-8 years, when he wanted to be. That's not greatest ever.

[corpgator]

And?

Rice has about 100 others.

Rice also didn't play in an era where QB's can't be hit and WR can't be touched. Just about every top QB is throwing for 5,000 these days.

This really isn't an argument. Moss was a great player, Rice is the greatest ever.

PERHAPS Moss could have been, had he applied himself. We'll never know. I'd say if Moss had 1/2 the drive and work ethic of Rice, he would have been the best...

I wasn't talking about Moss; it's Calvin Johnson. He has Moss's height, speed, and leap with more strength. He's also more disciplined with his routes, doesn't give up on plays, always goes all out and isn't a head case.

He's basically the best of both Rice and Moss. If he ever actually gets a great QB, he'll break all the records.

[gatordavisl]

Guess who holds the single season record for receiving yards? Has very little to do with it. Is Eric Dickerson even considered in the top five backs all time? I would put at least six above him.

Emmitt Smith
Barry Sanders
Adrian Peterson
Jim Brown
Walter Payton
Earl Campbell
OJ

[RayUF07]

I wasn't talking about Moss; it's Calvin Johnson. He has Moss's height, speed, and leap with more strength. He's also more disciplined with his routes, doesn't give up on plays, always goes all out and isn't a head case.

He's basically the best of both Rice and Moss. If he ever actually gets a great QB, he'll break all the records.

I know you were talking about Calvin....but he has one record, in an era where passers and receivers are allowed free reign.

A great QB? How many 5,000 yard passers did Rice ever have? Just goes to show, the difference in eras.

I'd agree, Calvin should be able to top some of Rice's records if he stays healthy and productive like Rice did late in his career. But don't toss around the QB and ignore the fact that Calvin is playing in the most prolific era ever for a WR...and for a losing team who can afford to just throw it to him every play late to pad stats.


I love Calvin, great player and wish he could've been a Buc...but he has a LONG way to catch Rice...but certainly has the potential.

[GATORAZ]

RayUF07 please stop with all the career stats you have eyes you know who the better player was. One guy was Cunnigham and Brad Johnson and Aron Brooks Andrew Walter Dante Culpepper throwing him the football the other has Young and Montana

Moss did have a great time with Brady though

[geauxgator1]

Rice was the consumnate reciever in every aspect. Moss was a beast in his day, but Rice could do it all. DId you ever see Moss throw a block?
I would take Rice if I was putting a team together and had to chose between the two.

[mikehev]

Mike,

Isn't it "granted" (meaning "admittedly") rather than "grant it"? They both make sense in your usage context, I suppose. Perhaps they are both commonly used.

Back to the discussion.......if it's a lifetime achievement award, it goes to Rice. If it's for sheer talent and physical prowess, it goes to Moss.

Thanks for the grammar tip :). "Granted" is the correct word. Changed it in the original post.

There are plenty of talents with sheer physical prowess that do not come close to greatest of all time status. In this case, Randy Moss is a prime example.

It takes more than talent to be the best.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

[gatorev12]

I'm surprised this is much of a discussion--and I didn't really live in the era when Rice was in his prime.

Rice holds almost every receiving record there is--and he did it in an era when teams were still allowed to play defense and hit WRs/QBs.

[RayUF07]

RayUF07 please stop with all the career stats you have eyes you know who the better player was. One guy was Cunnigham and Brad Johnson and Aron Brooks Andrew Walter Dante Culpepper throwing him the football the other has Young and Montana

Moss did have a great time with Brady though

Yes, i do, and it is Rice. Most complete WR ever, arguably the best player at any position ever.

[RayUF07]

Rice holds almost every receiving record there is--and he did it in an era when teams were still allowed to play defense and hit WRs/QBs.

This is the point I have been trying to get across.

Look, if GATORAZ or anyone else wants to say Moss was more athletically gifted, I will tend to agree. But a better player? No way. Rice had more than just measurables...put Rice's brain and heart in Moss' body, you have a machine. Moss alone was just a great WR who could have been more had he chose to be.

[GATORAZ]

This is the point I have been trying to get across.

Look, if GATORAZ or anyone else wants to say Moss was more athletically gifted, I will tend to agree. But a better player? No way. Rice had more than just measurables...put Rice's brain and heart in Moss' body, you have a machine. Moss alone was just a great WR who could have been more had he chose to be.

I am saying Moss was the better player and thats the guy I want. You can say he could have been better. I am saying what he was, was still better than Rice.

[gatorr4life]

Both greats. but for my money, Rice. Look out though, because Calvin Johnson is going to break some records before its all said and dome. And what about Andre Johnson? Another beast...

My personal favorite, art monk.

[No1GatorFreak]

I'm going with Willie Jackson. How can u guys sell out like that!?

[1984Gator]

RayUF07 please stop with all the career stats you have eyes you know who the better player was. One guy was Cunnigham and Brad Johnson and Aron Brooks Andrew Walter Dante Culpepper throwing him the football the other has Young and Montana

Moss did have a great time with Brady though

Moss was among the best but Rice towers above all. And then there's this thing about winning. Don't get me started on character. Moss may not make the hall of fame!

[1984Gator]

I am saying Moss was the better player and thats the guy I want. You can say he could have been better. I am saying what he was, was still better than Rice.

You can say that all day long but it doesn seem like you've watched Rice play. There is no comparison. Rice was a complete player in every way and Moss was a deep threat with the right QB.

[1984Gator]

Both greats. but for my money, Rice. Look out though, because Calvin Johnson is going to break some records before its all said and dome. And what about Andre Johnson? Another beast...

My personal favorite, art monk.

If he lasts. He takes a lot more impact than the all time leaders.

[Tebowism0823]

Are the individuals who think Moss is better joking?

This isn't even a comparison. Jerry Rice and its not even close.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

Agreed. It's crazy to even think its close. Hell ill take Fitzgerald over Moss.

[Tebowism0823]

Guess who holds the single season record for receiving yards?

Calvin Johnson but he hasn't played enough to be in the conversation. I agree he could surpass them all.

[Tebowism0823]

Nobody was better than Prime Moss

Maybe to you but the masses would disagree; and disagree a lot.

[Tebowism0823]

RayUF07 please stop with all the career stats you have eyes you know who the better player was. One guy was Cunnigham and Brad Johnson and Aron Brooks Andrew Walter Dante Culpepper throwing him the football the other has Young and Montana

Moss did have a great time with Brady though

Why must you try and act like you know more then others? You aren't a talent scout and coming on here and spewing off at others doesn't make you one. It's time to come down from the pedestal you made for yourself. You can have Moss but don't pretend for a second that you're always correct. The numbers and fans say differently. Hell the colleagues would say differently.

[Spurffelbow833]

If Moss is the best, he still should have been better. A guy who admits to taking plays off fails his own potential. Jerry Rice never took a play off. He grew up busting his tail working for his father as a bricklayer, and he trained himself in the discipline of concentration by catching bricks thrown up to him rapid fire, one after another on rooftops.

[GATORAZ]

Moss was among the best but Rice towers above all. And then there's this thing about winning. Don't get me started on character. Moss may not make the hall of fame!

Football is a team sport look at the teams Rice was on and look at the teams Moss was on. What does character have to do with who was the better football player?

[tommyvee]

Route Runner.....Rice
Hands................Push
Blocker'..............Rice
Deep Threat........Moss
Smarts................Rice

I could go on.....Rice just trumps moss all around.

This sums it up nicely. I would add:

Teammate...........Rice

[CHFG8R]

I am saying Moss was the better player and thats the guy I want. You can say he could have been better. I am saying what he was, was still better than Rice.

And you would be wrong. And anyone with any sembelance of knowledge about the NFL, from ex and current coaches, ex and current players, ex and current journalists, etc. would agree. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but there is no debate here. You are wrong. Plain and simple.

[mikehev]

Football is a team sport look at the teams Rice was on and look at the teams Moss was on. What does character have to do with who was the better football player?

Character is the difference between taking plays off and giving 100 percent, 100 percent of the time in practice, the game, and the 4th quarter. Moss admittedly took plays off. Rice never did. Don't forget "leadership" when making comparisons.

The comparison of QBs throwing them the ball breaks down. Rice never had Chris Carter opposite side, and also did not have the luxury of the new rules that protect quarterbacks and receivers, etc. etc. At the end of the day both experienced variables that helped their impact as players, and both could have benefited from some of the other's variables.

Did Moss have more talent than any receiver to ever come into the league. Probably. Does that make him the best? Not by a long shot (see Jemarcus Russell, Marcus Dupree, etc.). The title of "best receiver of all time" belongs to Rice hands down, not because of his talent, but because of what he did with it.

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

[oxymoron]

Moss is one of the biggest prima donna jerks of all time. Rice is the greatest football player of all times.

[secgator]

Rather amusing that the opinion of Moss being better is a better indication of....youth. For anyone outside of Ray Charles or Stevie Wonder, the choice should be glaring--Rice.

In addition to taking Rice over Moss, I would take another one from the older era ANY day of the week over Moss---Lynn Swann. At his prime, he was....just MHO....a better WR than Moss.

[gymgator]

What makes Rice even more impressive (aside from being a 1st class individual) is that he didn't have dominating tools. As in, he was tall like Moss, strong like Megatron or super fast like Tim Brown.

He was just the best. Period.

[CHFG8R]

Rather amusing that the opinion of Moss being better is a better indication of....youth. For anyone outside of Ray Charles or Stevie Wonder, the choice should be glaring--Rice.

In addition to taking Rice over Moss, I would take another one from the older era ANY day of the week over Moss---Lynn Swann. At his prime, he was....just MHO....a better WR than Moss.

Personally, I'll take Stalworth over Swann. Just sayin'.

[nawlinsgator]

Unbelievable the way this discussion has gone. There is much more than physical talent involved with being a football player. So Moss is taller and probably faster. Those who want Moss can have him. I'll take Rice, his work ethic, and what he's got between his ears EVERY time.

BTW - I wonder how many of you actually watched Jerry Rice play during his time.

100% agree.
All these young bucks probably have never seen Jerry Rice play.
Moss may have a slight edge on speed and reach. But if Moss is a 10 in these categoreis, Rice was a 9.
But Rice was much better at route running, creating separation, and had hands of glue.
Plus he never takes a play off. Works his ass of during the offseason. And that's why he was so consistently productive throughout most of his career. I'll take Jerry Rice every time.

[nawlinsgator]

Nobody was better than Prime Moss

You better quit while you're behind. People will start questioning your recruiting acumen next.

[qwghlmgator]

Considering that:

1. Moss tried to be a Gator and failed, and
2. Moss is actually an ex-Nole, and
3. Moss is actually an ex-Domer, therefore

Moss sucks. Rice is awesome.

[RayUF07]

I am saying Moss was the better player and thats the guy I want. You can say he could have been better. I am saying what he was, was still better than Rice.

I am saying you are wrong. You will be very alone in your world of Randy being better than Rice.

Perhaps you should head back to recruiting...you appear to be much better at that. I'm starting to see why. Recruiting is more about potential and measurables; playing football and being judged on your place in history is about what you have actually done. You definitely fall for the former.

[Welshgator]

I really have respect for Rice's work ethic. He really was a 'professional' football player unlike some of the guys like Marcedes Lewis, who think they are great for just being employed in the NFL. I have no doubt that Rice was better and achieved more than Moss.

[CHFG8R]

Considering that:

1. Moss tried to be a Gator and failed, and
2. Moss is actually an ex-Nole, and
3. Moss is actually an ex-Domer, therefore

Moss sucks. Rice is awesome.

Though I heard today on the radio that is daughter currently plays hoops for UF. Wonder if that has anything to do with his relationship with Billy (through JWil and I think Moss may have even played for Billy for a bit at Marshall. . . though I'm not sure).

[CHFG8R]

100% agree.
All these young bucks probably have never seen Jerry Rice play.
Moss may have a slight edge on speed and reach. But if Moss is a 10 in these categoreis, Rice was a 9.
But Rice was much better at route running, creating separation, and had hands of glue.
Plus he never takes a play off. Works his ass of during the offseason. And that's why he was so consistently productive throughout most of his career. I'll take Jerry Rice every time.


I remember watching an interview with Rice about 15 years ago (Tom Jackson) where they were talking while throwing the ball back and forth. What was remarkable, IMO, was the way Rice, even in that casual setting, watched every ball all the way into his hands. Sorta like Pete Rose watching the ball into the catcher's glove (there's another one you younger guys probably don't remember).

That, my friends, is dedication to the craft and something any young receiver could learn a lot from.

[gatorcal]

I think people are arguing semantics here. What's Greatest mean? Moss was a better athlete and probably had more talent than Rice. But, there's more to it than physical talent. Anyone want to argue that Manning is better than Brady, Montana, etc? He probably has more pure QB skills/ability than anyone who ever lived and he would be in the conversation, but I certainly wouldn't call him the GOAT. Seems like a similar situation to me. You can have this argument at nearly every skill position. Is it about numbers? Wins? Tools?

[j7]

To clearfy what I meant by saying Moss was a better player than Rice is that if given the choice for one game I would want Moss in his prime over Rice in his prime. Very limited criteria I know and I should have made that clear.

[lurkingator1]

To clearfy what I meant by saying Moss was a better player than Rice is that if given the choice for one game I would want Moss in his prime over Rice in his prime. Very limited criteria I know and I should have made that clear.


Espn Mike and Mike did a break down of both guys in the prime of their careers, broken down by number of yards, Number of catches, number of touchdowns Rice won in every category. Taking that into account and the facts the Moss admits he played hard only when he wanted to and his over all demeanor I would say Rice will be remember as the better player. Moss is a better at tooting his own horn :yes:

[CHFG8R]

I think people are arguing semantics here. What's Greatest mean? Moss was a better athlete and probably had more talent than Rice. But, there's more to it than physical talent. Anyone want to argue that Manning is better than Brady, Montana, etc? He probably has more pure QB skills/ability than anyone who ever lived and he would be in the conversation, but I certainly wouldn't call him the GOAT. Seems like a similar situation to me. You can have this argument at nearly every skill position. Is it about numbers? Wins? Tools?

Every NFL expert and player I have ever heard on the topic of "the greatest" seems to go with the same mantra. That being, there is room for debate re. "the greatest" at all but two positions in NFL history: Wide Receiver (Rice) and Defensive End (Reggie White).

Those two are slam dunks for the vast majority, most of whom know a hell of a lot more about the game than I do.

[tec68]

Moss is the greatest DEEP THREAT of all time.

He is in NO WAY the greatest receiver.

Jerry Rice is the greatest receiver and will be until Calvin Johnson retires.

[tec68]

Football is a team sport look at the teams Rice was on and look at the teams Moss was on. What does character have to do with who was the better football player?

Is this a serious question?(I am asking a serious question)

[IndianaStew]

I agree that Moss is the better athlete.

But that is not what this is about.

Rice is the better football player, harder worker, better leader, and better winner. Oh, and he also had WAY better numbers in a league that was not as WR friendly as it is today.

Its not even CLOSE who's the better WR. Rice by FAR. Moss could have been and was the better athlete, but his attitude precluded that.

[CHFG8R]

I agree that Moss is the better athlete.

But that is not what this is about.

Rice is the better football player, harder worker, better leader, and better winner. Oh, and he also had WAY better numbers in a league that was not as WR friendly as it is today.

Its not even CLOSE who's the better WR. Rice by FAR. Moss could have been and was the better athlete, but his attitude precluded that.

I might even debate this. Faster, yes. Stronger, perhaps. But who collapses first on "The Hill" that Jerry made so famous?

[ACmann]

Jerry never mailed it in, nuff said.

[RepubliGator84]

Rice>Moss

[whitelakegator]

And?

Rice has about 100 others.

Rice also didn't play in an era where QB's can't be hit and WR can't be touched. Just about every top QB is throwing for 5,000 these days.

This really isn't an argument. Moss was a great player, Rice is the greatest ever.

PERHAPS Moss could have been, had he applied himself. We'll never know. I'd say if Moss had 1/2 the drive and work ethic of Rice, he would have been the best...

Ding, ding, ding...winner.

Imagine Rice playing under these new rules...my god...those of you voting for Moss should have to put their age down as well. It would be interesting to see.

It reminds me of a recent ESPN poll on the greatest defensive player of all-time. The kids all voted for Ray Lewis over White, Taylor, Butkus, etc.

I get it though...I don't remember anything prior to 1979 or so. So I tend to give more weight to players I have seen and can relate to.

[nawlinsgator]

Ding, ding, ding...winner.

Imagine Rice playing under these new rules...my god...those of you voting for Moss should have to put their age down as well. It would be interesting to see.

It reminds me of a recent ESPN poll on the greatest defensive player of all-time. The kids all voted for Ray Lewis over White, Taylor, Butkus, etc.

I get it though...I don't remember anything prior to 1979 or so. So I tend to give more weight to players I have seen and can relate to.

That's really the crux of this. A lot of the younger folks never got to see Rice play in a live televised game. Highlights don't have the same impact.
You can count on Rice to get open all the time.
And those of you who are saying Montana and Young helped Rice look good....it's most likely the other way around. Rice made their jobs a whole lot easier.

[GATORAZ]

I am saying you are wrong. You will be very alone in your world of Randy being better than Rice.

.

How am I alone in the world saying Randy is better than Jerry?

I saw what both of them did I am saying Moss is better than Jerry. People here want Jerry to be better than Moss and I get it. One guy worked his but off and gave it his all. While the other guy was just born with an incredible amount of talent and worked when he felt like like it. You still cant deny Moss's greatness.

Somebody in this thread tried to say "Moss might ow get into the Hall of fame". If Moss didn't get into the hall of fame what would it say about that process? You can take Rice all you want I am taking prime Moss. Just like last year people were saying Tebow I am taking Manning. Some might take Fred Taylor (I am a huge fan) but I would say OJ Simpson was better. I am talking on the field not off it. Some people cant separate the two.

[RayUF07]

How am I alone in the world saying Randy is better than Jerry?

I saw what both of them did I am saying Moss is better than Jerry. People here want Jerry to be better than Moss and I get it. One guy worked his but off and gave it his all. While the other guy was just born with an incredible amount of talent and worked when he felt like like it. You still cant deny Moss's greatness.

Somebody in this thread tried to say "Moss might ow get into the Hall of fame". If Moss didn't get into the hall of fame what would it say about that process? You can take Rice all you want I am taking prime Moss. Just like last year people were saying Tebow I am taking Manning. Some might take Fred Taylor (I am a huge fan) but I would say OJ Simpson was better. I am talking on the field not off it. Some people cant separate the two.

How are you alone? I would venture less than 1% agree with you. Every poll of players, coaches, writers, former players, etc. Names Rice #1. Some have Rice #1 OVERALL.

But I guess we're all wrong and you're right? LOL!

Nothing Moss ever accomplished on the field trumps Rice. Nothing. Yet you think Moss is better? There's really no point in even arguing with you about it anymore. You seem hell bent on taking the other side just to argue.

Oh, and nobody is denying Moss being great. You can't seem to grasp that. You seem to think somehow since everyone else on the planet thinks Rice is better, that denigrates what Moss accomplished. Moss was great in his own right, I love Moss always have from day one. But no way by any measure was he a better FOOTBALL PLAYER than Rice.

[Minister_of_Information]

What do we mean when we say great?

[GATORAZ]

How are you alone? I would venture less than 1% agree with you. Every poll of players, coaches, writers, former players, etc. Names Rice #1. Some have Rice #1 OVERALL.

But I guess we're all wrong and you're right? LOL!

Nothing Moss ever accomplished on the field trumps Rice. Nothing. Yet you think Moss is better? There's really no point in even arguing with you about it anymore. You seem hell bent on taking the other side just to argue.

Oh, and nobody is denying Moss being great. You can't seem to grasp that. You seem to think somehow since everyone else on the planet thinks Rice is better, that denigrates what Moss accomplished. Moss was great in his own right, I love Moss always have from day one. But no way by any measure was he a better FOOTBALL PLAYER than Rice.
There are post in this thread that agree with me so clearly not everybody thinks Rice is better than Moss. I am not sure what you were trying to accomplish. I am not trying to argue with you. I just dont agree that Rice is better than Moss. IMO Moss was greater that Rice. IYO Rice is greater than Moss. Many people just dont like Moss so they will give it to Jerry no matter what. That is how society works. I def grasp that you think Moss is great that is a given.

[RayUF07]

There are post in this thread that agree with me so clearly not everybody thinks Rice is better than Moss. I am not sure what you were trying to accomplish. I am not trying to argue with you. I just dont agree that Rice is better than Moss. IMO Moss was greater that Rice. IYO Rice is greater than Moss. Many people just dont like Moss so they will give it to Jerry no matter what. That is how society works. I def grasp that you think Moss is great that is a given.

A prime Rice would gain 2000 a year in today's NFL. People who have seen both play, watched football then and now, see Rice #1. I would guess those giving Moss the nod only have watched Moss' era. It's a completely different NFL, one that caters to QB and WR. Moss wouldn't have lasted in Rice's era....he'd get crushed or pout because teams didn't throw 50 times a game and DB's could hit WR.

[AzCatFan]

Many players have amazing athletic abilities. What separates the greats from the also-rans is the ability to make the players around them even better. Having Jerry Rice on the 49ers made an average John Taylor into a Pro-Bowler. Just like Michael Irvin made Alvin Harper into a threat. And just like when Harper didn't have Irvin opposite him, remove Rice from the 49ers, and Taylor just doesn't put up the numbers. Moss had Carter (already established) opposite him early in his career, but since then, whose game did Moss elevate? What's the best #2 receiver Moss played with?

Great receivers often come in tandems. Rice/Taylor, Irvin/Harper, Duper/Clayton, Swan/Stallworth. Moss is and always has been about himself. Rice, on the other hand, was the best receiver ever to play football, and a guy I would take in a heartbeat over any other receiver who has ever played the game. Again, Rice made Taylor a great receiver, and Roger Craig the first guy ever to rush for 1,000 yards and receive 1,000 yards. Put Moss on that 49ers team, and I doubt that happens.

[GATORAZ]

A prime Rice would gain 2000 a year in today's NFL. People who have seen both play, watched football then and now, see Rice #1. I would guess those giving Moss the nod only have watched Moss' era. It's a completely different NFL, one that caters to QB and WR. Moss wouldn't have lasted in Rice's era....he'd get crushed or pout because teams didn't throw 50 times a game and DB's could hit WR.

Now you are making baseless assumptions

[Minister_of_Information]

I don't think Moss has ever been greater than Rice. More dangerous at times, perhaps, but never greater. Greatness is defined by more than ability and a single game or season. It is defined by consistency and performance year in and year out. And there will never be a greater football player than Jerry Rice.

[GATORAZ]

What do we mean when we say great?

this question was http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36BvyC_ODRM

[RayUF07]

Now you are making baseless assumptions

No, they make perfect sense.

Put Rice combination of speed, route running, instincts, brains, hands in an NFL where they throw for 5000 a year, where WR can run free and QB's can't get hit....Rice would dominate this NFL.

Moss would not have similar success where the NFL isn't flag football.

Hell, Rice at 39 and 40 in his 17/18 seasons in the NFL put up 2400 yards.

[OaktownGator]

I can see a good argument for Moss as the most impressive deep threat receiver ever.

But best receiver? No way.

He took way too many plays off. He was worthless as a blocker. Was no where near as tough or reliable as Rice (and many other receivers), in just making plays for first downs.

Rice was a far better receiver.

[RayUF07]

Now you are making baseless assumptions

Speaking of base less assumptions....what are you using to support your claim that Moss was greater? I have yet to se one shred of evidence supporting.

I'll wait.

Or do you just expect the world to bow down because you say so?

[Matthanuf06]

Rice is #1, but Moss was great himself. Moss' peak may be the highest for a WR ever. However it's close enough that it makes sense for a competitive person to believe it.

I think if you asked any of the top 5 guys at any position, in any sport, they'd say they were the best.

[GATORAZ]

Speaking of base less assumptions....what are you using to support your claim that Moss was greater? I have yet to se one shred of evidence supporting.

I'll wait.

Or do you just expect the world to bow down because you say so?
This is simple he was 6'4 and ran a 4.3 and had great hands. The man could not be covered. You already agree moss was great you just dont agree Moss was greater than Jerry.

[tilly]

"I play when I want to play" - R. Moss

The best would never say that.

[CHFG8R]

Holocaust deniers are entitled to their opinions too.

Just sayin'

[RayUF07]

This is simple he was 6'4 and ran a 4.3 and had great hands. The man could not be covered. You already agree moss was great you just dont agree Moss was greater than Jerry.

Jeff George could throw a ball out of a stadium, what's your point? Ryan Leaf was bigger, faster, and stronger than Manning. How'd that work out?

It's not all about size and speed and strength. Otherwise the NFL would be Olympic sprinters and weight lifters.

[RayUF07]

Usain Bolt is tall and fast. He'd be the best NFL WR ever if he played.

Signed,

GATORAZ

[GATORAZ]

Jeff George could throw a ball out of a stadium, what's your point? Ryan Leaf was bigger, faster, and stronger than Manning. How'd that work out?

It's not all about size and speed and strength. Otherwise the NFL would be Olympic sprinters and weight lifters.

I would take Manning over Leaf and George.

[GATORAZ]

Usain Bolt is tall and fast. He'd be the best NFL WR ever if he played.

Signed,

GATORAZ

lol what?

[Jaggator]

Some of you might want to brush up your knowledge about Rice and read why he was the greatest...He definitely was the more "complete" player of the two which helps explain greatness.

What made Jerry Rice so good?

http://myhigherdrive.com/what-made-jerry-rice-so-good/

[GATORAZ]

"I play when I want to play" - R. Moss

The best would never say that.

Thank you for this post Tilly. This is what I was talking about earlier some people just dont like Moss.

[nawlinsgator]

This is simple he was 6'4 and ran a 4.3 and had great hands. The man could not be covered. You already agree moss was great you just dont agree Moss was greater than Jerry.

You're a measurables, kind of guy. Maybe you should stick to recruiting where nobody has proven anything and a guys measurables are the kit and kaboodle.

Rice has all the records and all the rings to back up his claim to GOAT. Moss has his mouth and yours.

[RayUF07]

I would take Manning over Leaf and George.

Of course....anyone would.

But if you go on sheer arm strength, size and strength Manning is probably 3rd. Brady is behind them too. Jamarcus Russel trumps them all.

The point us you use Moss' advantages of size and speed as what he's greater than Rice. I'm trying to explain to you why it isn't all about those measurables...

But using your standards in the Moss example, Russell should be the greatest QB ever and Bolt would dominate the NFL.

[GATORAZ]

You're a measurables, kind of guy. Maybe you should stick to recruiting where nobody has proven anything and a guys measurables are the kit and kaboodle.

Rice has all the records and all the rings to back up his claim to GOAT. Moss has his mouth and yours.
smh at you trying to tell me what kind of person I am.

[RayUF07]

smh at you trying to tell me what kind of person I am.

I think you are Al Davis, reincarnated.

Lol.

[Jaggator]

Thank you for this post Tilly. This is what I was talking about earlier some people just dont like Moss.

Tilly stated a fact. It has nothing to do with whether he liked him or not. Most posters have given kudos to Moss but to say he was greater than Rice is quite a reach.

[johngun]

Rice is the greatest receiver who ever played without question, but Moss is the most talented receiver to play.

[GATORAZ]

Of course....anyone would.

But if you go on sheer arm strength, size and strength Manning is probably 3rd. Brady is behind them too. Jamarcus Russel trumps them all.

The point us you use Moss' advantages of size and speed as what he's greater than Rice. I'm trying to explain to you why it isn't all about those measurables...

But using your standards in the Moss example, Russell should be the greatest QB ever and Bolt would dominate the NFL.
Nobody actually thinks Russell is the greatest QB or Bolt would be the best WR. We are not comparing a great to a bum. We are comparing two greats. People here are saying things like "Rice had the better Brain".

[GATORAZ]

Tilly stated a fact. It has nothing to do with whether he liked him or not. Most posters have given kudos to Moss but to say he was greater than Rice is quite a reach.
So IYO saying one top 5 WR of all time is greater than another top 5 WR of all time is a "quite a reach" ?

[RayUF07]

This is pointless. I'm out.

Good talk.

[nawlinsgator]

smh at you trying to tell me what kind of person I am.

You're the one who quoted the size and speed of Moss when asked why you would pick him over Rice. You really don't have anything else to lean on, so I can see why.

[theologator]

I remember that after Randy Moss had his brief stay in Tallahassee, Bobby Bowden said he was the greatest athlete he had seen, including Deion Sanders. From a pure talent standpoint, I think Moss belongs in a discussion about top WR 's. He did dazzling things at the highest level.

But greatness is much more than talent. It's dedication, consistency, perseverance and focus. Jerry Rice is clearly the greatest WR of all time, all things considered, and I think there are others who would edge Moss on that score.

It's like comparing Dominique Wilkins and Michael Jordan. I think you could probably find measurable evidence that Dominique was the better athlete, and he did dazzling things. But Michael was the harder worker and won championships.

How many RB's were bigger and faster than Emmitt, yet there are very few that approach him in the "greatest" discussion.

[ufgator4ever]

'And Lebron is greater than kobe who is better than mj who is greater than magic who is greater than doc j who is greater than chamberlain; because im too young, have a short memory or am too lazy to do the research or watch tape and its easiest to go with the now crowd.'

Sorry. It is a message board and open to opinions, but posters who think Moss is greater than Rice deserve to be shamed for their ignorance. Rice to many NFL pundits is actually the greatest Player to have played, not just receiver.

[AzCatFan]

Moss is the better athlete than Rice. Moss has/had a higher upside. But Rice has better numbers, more Super Bowl rings, and elevated his teammates' play to another level. Moss? He has his own mouth claiming he's the best. How anyone would choose Moss in his prime over Rice in his prime is beyond my comprehension. Rice, hands down, is simply the better football player.

[Jaggator]

So IYO saying one top 5 WR of all time is greater than another top 5 WR of all time is a "quite a reach" ?

I'm saying "the top WR" Rice is greater than WR Moss hands down and it is a stretch and/or reach to think otherwise. However, you're entitled to your wrong opinion. :grin:

I presented evidence in an article above to point out just how dedicated Rice was to being the best.

[GATORAZ]

I'm saying "the top WR" Rice is greater than WR Moss hands down and it is a stretch and/or reach to think otherwise. However, you're entitled to your wrong opinion. :grin:

I presented evidence in an article above to point out just how dedicated Rice was to being the best.

Jagg that is what you call evidence some kid talking about what Moss did on the days we didnt see him play?

Thanks for letting me be entitled to my opinion

[rounds]

Moss is going to talk his way back out of the league if he is not careful.
?er-What are u gonna do after football, Randy?
RM-whadda u mean?
?-you know, after ur career is over.
RM-live life, enjoy life, spend money...
?-anything else?
RM-hmmm, aaah, you no, yea..me & my homies we goin fishin'.
yea...bass fishin' u no artificial lures...top water or deep...
yea, we gone gettem, high or low...

[Tebowism0823]

Usain Bolt is tall and fast. He'd be the best NFL WR ever if he played.

Signed,

GATORAZ

lol....Perfect :)

[Tebowism0823]

You're a measurables, kind of guy. Maybe you should stick to recruiting where nobody has proven anything and a guys measurables are the kit and kaboodle.

Rice has all the records and all the rings to back up his claim to GOAT. Moss has his mouth and yours.

This is exactly it. You have pinned him perfectly.

[tec68]

Usain Bolt is tall and fast. He'd be the best NFL WR ever if he played.

Signed,

GATORAZ

Beat me to it lol. He would probably run a sub 4.2 and he is like 6'6.

[tec68]

Nobody actually thinks Russell is the greatest QB or Bolt would be the best WR. We are not comparing a great to a bum. We are comparing two greats. People here are saying things like "Rice had the better Brain".

Yes because you do actually have to think in football. You have to be motivated. You have to work hard every single play to be the best. You have to want it every second of the game not just when you want to want it or when you get the ball.

As you said earlier it is a team sport. The best do not only play only for themselves, they play for their team. To help their team win.

[GATORAZ]

Yes because you do actually have to think in football. You have to be motivated. You have to work hard every single play to be the best. You have to want it every second of the game not just when you want to want it or when you get the ball.

As you said earlier it is a team sport. The best do not only play only for themselves, they play for their team. To help their team win.

You do have to think to play the game people are acting like Moss didnt when we all know he did else he would not have done the things he did. The other things are just BS. We know Moss didnt work hard every second of his life at football but nobody here is denying he is not top 5 WR of all time. Do you think Moss was top 5 WR ever?

[GATORAZ]

Beat me to it lol. He would probably run a sub 4.2 and he is like 6'6.

and you also know I would never say that :wave:

[RayUF07]

“I’m very surprised Randy Moss used that in those words, that he’s the greatest,” Rice said on ESPN’s NFL Live, via Yahoo Sports. “You’d never hear me say I’m the greatest football player to ever play the game. I let my body of work speak for itself, and I think I was able to be very productive on the football field.”

[Gatorphenom]

and you also know I would never say that :wave:

But you already did when giving your reasons for why Moss is better.

This happens every time you venture out of Awesome Recruiting, all you are doing in this thread is showing your age. Moss is in no way better than Jerry, was he faster.....yep.....and that's about it. By the way I've never seen a receiver run a straight route untouched in the NFL yet....so Moss's 4.2 and Jerry's 4.3 is pointless comparison.

[GatorSean]

Rice got OPEN, far, far more often than Moss did.

So who cares who is faster, bigger, stronger? Rice did his job better than Moss did, and I really don't even see how its debatable.

I mean their job wasn't to be an 'athlete in their prime'. Their job was to get open, catch the ball, and block when needed. Rice did all of those things better than Moss. Everything else is just a side-show.

[secgator]

Rice got OPEN, far, far more often than Moss did.

So who cares who is faster, bigger, stronger? Rice did his job better than Moss did, and I really don't even see how its debatable.

I mean their job wasn't to be an 'athlete in their prime'. Their job was to get open, catch the ball, and block when needed. Rice did all of those things better than Moss. Everything else is just a side-show.

The only reason it is being debated at all is due to someone who never actually saw Rice play, or appreciates the "big picture" of what it takes to be considered the greatest. Simple numbers game and the intangibles don't factor in.

In other words--youth. Plain and simple. THAT is the major reason there is any debate at all. Obvious to everyone what the vast majority thinks--not to mention the media, the league, players and coaches, EVERYONE else.

[UFreak]

This is a really long thread. One of the things that I haven't seen in this thread I don't think is just how deadly Rice was with the short pass. He was just though to tackle. Great balance, almost like an upper tier running back with his balance. No one did more with the short pass and turning it into long gains and long touchdowns than Rice did. That guy was hard to tackle from a physical standpoint.

And for those who say Rice was good because of Montana and Young, I say Montana and Young benefitted more from having Rice as their receiver. Hell, Montana sometimes never had to throw the ball further than 20 yards downfield in a game and still have huge numbers because Rice would take 10-yard slants to the house so often.

[CHFG8R]

So IYO saying one top 5 WR of all time is greater than another top 5 WR of all time is a "quite a reach" ?

In the opinion of EVERYONE I have ever heard on the subject who has an ounce of credibility, yes. In this case (and White's), there is no debate among those who know what they're talking about.

If you disagree, please find me one player or coach who backs up Moss on this.

[CHFG8R]

I remember that after Randy Moss had his brief stay in Tallahassee, Bobby Bowden said he was the greatest athlete he had seen, including Deion Sanders. From a pure talent standpoint, I think Moss belongs in a discussion about top WR 's. He did dazzling things at the highest level.

But greatness is much more than talent. It's dedication, consistency, perseverance and focus. Jerry Rice is clearly the greatest WR of all time, all things considered, and I think there are others who would edge Moss on that score.

It's like comparing Dominique Wilkins and Michael Jordan. I think you could probably find measurable evidence that Dominique was the better athlete, and he did dazzling things. But Michael was the harder worker and won championships.

How many RB's were bigger and faster than Emmitt, yet there are very few that approach him in the "greatest" discussion.

Fred Taylor is a good example for many reasons. And while I like Fred and there is no doubt he possessed all-world talent, he isn't in Emmitt's league.

[CHFG8R]

Moss is the better athlete than Rice. Moss has/had a higher upside. But Rice has better numbers, more Super Bowl rings, and elevated his teammates' play to another level. Moss? He has his own mouth claiming he's the best. How anyone would choose Moss in his prime over Rice in his prime is beyond my comprehension. Rice, hands down, is simply the better football player.

Moss has more athletic "potential" but like anything, greatness is more than just potential. Again, how long would Randy last under Jerry's off-season program? Longer than Rice?

Me thinks not. And, the last time I checked, endurance is just as much a part of someone's athletic ability as their 40 time and vertical.

[GATORAZ]

“I’m very surprised Randy Moss used that in those words, that he’s the greatest,” Rice said on ESPN’s NFL Live, via Yahoo Sports. “You’d never hear me say I’m the greatest football player to ever play the game. I let my body of work speak for itself, and I think I was able to be very productive on the football field.”

smart man

[UFreak]

Great receiver too

[GATORAZ]

Great receiver too

I think everybody agrees with that

[Tebowism0823]

Great receiver too

Greatest receiver :)

[UFreak]

Greatest receiver :)

I'm not convinced Moss is No. 2. He's in the top 3-4 though. He's probably my No. 2.

[CHFG8R]

The 2nd best I ever saw will never make the Hall for the simple fact that he didn't play long enough. But I'll say this right now, Randy would have a hard time holding Sterling Sharpe's jock as a WR.

[Tebowism0823]

I'm not convinced Moss is No. 2. He's in the top 3-4 though. He's probably my No. 2.

Like I stated previously, I'd take Fitzgerald over Moss. Hell give me Johnson as well. I say he's top 10 for sure but I'm not so sure I'd put him in the top 5 for overall receivers.

[UFreak]

What!!!!???
Moss is definitely Top 5.

[tec68]

You do have to think to play the game people are acting like Moss didnt when we all know he did else he would not have done the things he did. The other things are just BS. We know Moss didnt work hard every second of his life at football but nobody here is denying he is not top 5 WR of all time. Do you think Moss was top 5 WR ever?

Yes but that is not what we are talking about here.

[UFreak]

This debate is similar to the Lebron and Jordan debate. Jordan just knew how to win better. He was just "better." Lebron is perhaps the best athlete to ever play basketball. But if we are picking sides and I want to win, I'll take that MJ guy.

[Tebowism0823]

What!!!!???
Moss is definitely Top 5.

I believe there's definitely cases out there for 5 other better receivers but that's a different issue. The fact still remains that Rice was heads and shoulders better then Moss.

[NoahBeanBizzel]

If we're going off of pure talent, Moss is actually right...behind Calvin Johnson. Johnson is the most talented player I've ever seen at the position. Mr. "I play when I want to play" actually was the most unstoppable receiver the game has ever seen in his prime. He just didn't do it every game.

So, he wasn't the receiver Jerry Rice was. I'd take a focused Moss, with Steve Young or Joe Montana any day over Jerry Rice. But Rice had a better career. And while Moss did catch passes from Tom Brady for a couple of seasons, he was well past his prime by that point.

[socraticsilence]

Rice was a much better overall WR, and most QBs would take him over Moss in a heart beat (its better to have a surefire first down than the far lower % deep ball). That said I seen anything like young Moss and prime Moss- the only players close in terms of just sheer athletic brilliance was Vick (watch the Sugar Bowl vs. FSU highlights and realize that FSU team had like 4 first round DL and LB players) and healthy Percy (if he was physically able to play a full college season he would have been the best player of the Meyer era but as with the Rice v. Moss comparison- consistent dominance is more valuable than jaw dropping but unreliable genius).

Seriously watch Moss's college highlights (particularly the TD on the screen vs. Army), the one thing that might put Randy on the level of Rice is the QB disparity-- Montana, Young and then late career Gannon- all three are better than anyone Moss had outside of the 3 years with Brady (one of which he had an alltime great WR season), the only guy close is Culpepper and you could argue that he never looked all that great without Randy (Cunningham was awesome, but was old he had literally been laying tile for a year before taking the Vikes job).

[NoahBeanBizzel]

Rice was a much better overall WR, and most QBs would take him over Moss in a heart beat (its better to have a surefire first down than the far lower % deep ball). That said I seen anything like young Moss and prime Moss- the only players close in terms of just sheer athletic brilliance was Vick (watch the Sugar Bowl vs. FSU highlights and realize that FSU team had like 4 first round DL and LB players) and healthy Percy (if he was physically able to play a full college season he would have been the best player of the Meyer era but as with the Rice v. Moss comparison- consistent dominance is more valuable than jaw dropping but unreliable genius).

Seriously watch Moss's college highlights (particularly the TD on the screen vs. Army), the one thing that might put Randy on the level of Rice is the QB disparity-- Montana, Young and then late career Gannon- all three are better than anyone Moss had outside of the 3 years with Brady (one of which he had an alltime great WR season), the only guy close is Culpepper and you could argue that he never looked all that great without Randy (Cunningham was awesome, but was old he had literally been laying tile for a year before taking the Vikes job).

I know a lot of people on this board don't get to see the guy play, but watch Calvin Johnson when/if you have a chance to. I think he retires as the GOAT at the wide receiver position.

[socraticsilence]

Considering that:

1. Moss tried to be a Gator and failed, and
2. Moss is actually an ex-Nole, and
3. Moss is actually an ex-Domer, therefore

Moss sucks. Rice is awesome.

So happy Bowden actually cut Moss loose, that would be at least 1 if not 2 National Titles for the Noles.

[socraticsilence]

I know a lot of people on this board don't get to see the guy play, but watch Calvin Johnson when/if you have a chance to. I think he retires as the GOAT at the wide receiver position.

Johnson is close, he has better physical measurables- but I think Moss was more explosive- he got up to speed faster whereas CJ is like a lot of big guys with fast 40s-- he doesn't hit high gear until 20 yards downfield.

[RayUF07]

smart man

Because those with the proof don't need to beg for recognition by making outrageous claims.

/thread

[RayUF07]

Johnson is close, he has better physical measurables- but I think Moss was more explosive- he got up to speed faster whereas CJ is like a lot of big guys with fast 40s-- he doesn't hit high gear until 20 yards downfield.

First, everyone sees Calvin he's featured every week...he's not some unheard of guy. He has a transformer nick name and graced madden!

That being said, Calvin was timed at the combine 4.32, with no prep. He ran on a whim and had to borrow shoes. I believe he was injured and didn't plan on running but was challenged. Point being, I'm not sure you run that fast only hitting gear after 20 yards....he's pretty explosive in his own right. Calvin is a physical freak at his size and speed....he's not a string bean like Moss.

Calvin, if he continues his pace, may perhaps challenge Rice and others for the top WR ever. But IMO you need more than 6 years. You need to do it and do it well for a long time. Rice was 39/40 years old and a top 10 WR those years! Now I'm not saying one needs to do THAT, but Calvin hasn't been around long enough to warrant mention yet....but he's on his way.

[NoahBeanBizzel]

First, everyone sees Calvin he's featured every week...he's not some unheard of guy. He has a transformer nick name and graced madden!

That being said, Calvin was timed at the combine 4.32, with no prep. He ran on a whim and had to borrow shoes. I believe he was injured and didn't plan on running but was challenged. Point being, I'm not sure you run that fast only hitting gear after 20 yards....he's pretty explosive in his own right. Calvin is a physical freak at his size and speed....he's not a string bean like Moss.

Calvin, if he continues his pace, may perhaps challenge Rice and others for the top WR ever. But IMO you need more than 6 years. You need to do it and do it well for a long time. Rice was 39/40 years old and a top 10 WR those years! Now I'm not saying one needs to do THAT, but Calvin hasn't been around long enough to warrant mention yet....but he's on his way.

Right. But have you seen him for four full quarters? I'm not talking about the big plays you see late at night on ESPN, but watching him for sixty minutes. The gameplanning that goes into trying to stop him, watching two-sometimes three-players covering him on almost every second/third and long, the amount of preparartion involved in having to account for him on every play, what he opens up for the rest of the offense.

And you're right: he's far from just a big man, who merely hits top speed twenty yards down the field. His speed is ridiculous for a man who isn't 6'5. He plays extremely fast.

[OaktownGator]

Nobody who regularly takes plays off, never blocks, and disappears in playoff games deserves top 5 all time accolades, even if he has top five stats.

My .02.

[mikehev]

This is in no way meant as a slight to a particular age demographic, I'm just curious...

Everyone list their age and who they think is the better receiver Moss or Rice...

I'll start:

I'm 32
Rice, hands down and not even close


In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

[RayUF07]

Right. But have you seen him for four full quarters? I'm not talking about the big plays you see late at night on ESPN, but watching him for sixty minutes. The gameplanning that goes into trying to stop him, watching two-sometimes three-players covering him on almost every second/third and long, the amount of preparartion involved in having to account for him on every play, what he opens up for the rest of the offense.

And you're right: he's far from just a big man, who merely hits top speed twenty yards down the field. His speed is ridiculous for a man who isn't 6'5. He plays extremely fast.

Yes, I have on a regular basis. This day and age of Sunday ticket and condensed replays of games work wonders. I can watch an entire game in about 30 minutes.

Anyway, that's why I say if Calvin keeps his pace he has a shot. But Moss started off great and hit a wall overnight. That's what makes Rice's accomplishments even more staggering....he was 40 years old and still ballin!

Calvin has had 2 amazing seasons in a row, after being somewhat of an enigma his first few. (It took Calvin his 5th season to do more than what Rice did at 39 and 40) If he can string together 4-5 more he'll be in the conversation. I still do think it's difficult to compare the eras, but if he keeps it up he'll be there.

[1984Gator]

Football is a team sport look at the teams Rice was on and look at the teams Moss was on. What does character have to do with who was the better football player?

The best team Moss was ever on threw him off as did most of the others....

[Minister_of_Information]

This debate is similar to the Lebron and Jordan debate. Jordan just knew how to win better. He was just "better." Lebron is perhaps the best athlete to ever play basketball. But if we are picking sides and I want to win, I'll take that MJ guy.

Exactly right

[NoahBeanBizzel]

This is in no way meant as a slight to a particular age demographic, I'm just curious...

Everyone list their age and who they think is the better receiver Moss or Rice...

I'll start:

I'm 32
Rice, hands down and not even close


In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

I'm 28
Rice was a better receiver

I think that Moss had more physical talent, though, and could do things Rice couldn't. He just didn't do it every game.

[Tebowism0823]

This is in no way meant as a slight to a particular age demographic, I'm just curious...

Everyone list their age and who they think is the better receiver Moss or Rice...

I'll start:

I'm 32
Rice, hands down and not even close

In Christ forever,
Mike
John 3:16

I'm 31 and its Rice hands down. Moss isn't even in the picture IMO.

[JohnC1908]

Lol, yes Moss is taller and runs faster so that makes him better. Who cares about all that pesky data on the field?

[RayUF07]

Lol, yes Moss is taller and runs faster so that makes him better. Who cares about all that pesky data on the field?

QFT

[NoahBeanBizzel]

Lol, yes Moss is taller and runs faster so that makes him better. Who cares about all that pesky data on the field?

No, it made him entertaining to watch in his prime. Moss did things that put your jaw on the floor. He was unstoppable when he wanted to be.

But Jerry Rice was a better receiver.

[Tebowism0823]

Lol, yes Moss is taller and runs faster so that makes him better. Who cares about all that pesky data on the field?

John you know the rules. Any sign of common sense is forbidden here. Tighten up :)

[Tebowism0823]

No, it made him entertaining to watch in his prime. Moss did things that put your jaw on the floor. He was unstoppable when he wanted to be.

But Jerry Rice was a better receiver.

I keep hearing the unstoppable when he wanted to be but that's just an excuse to me. If you jammed him off the line he was stoppable. If you let him sprint by then he was hard to stop but that can be said about any decent receiver.

Of course that's just my opinion.

[Minister_of_Information]

Jerry Rice paid the cost to be the boss.

[1984Gator]

NEW ORLEANS – Randy Moss spiced up Wednesday's Super Bowl media session by expounding upon his Media Day declaration that he's the greatest receiver of all time, causing some of us to react as though we'd just ingested an undue amount of jambalaya.

"What I think, is what I think," Moss said Wednesday. "I changed the game."

As someone who did a book with Jerry Rice – and spent many years watching the unparalleled wideout hone his craft on a daily basis – I want to go all Lloyd Bentsen on the man affectionately known as 'Superfreak.'

I covered Jerry Rice as a beat writer. I knew Jerry Rice. I watched Jerry Rice defy medical science and embarrass defensive backs. Randy, you're no Jerry Rice.

However, as tempting as it is to spend the next 20 paragraphs explaining precisely why I believe the current San Francisco 49ers wideout's career pales in comparison to that of the retired ex-Niners superstar, among others, I decided to reach out to some folks who are uniquely qualified to assess the claim on its own merits. And in talking to some of the two receivers' most esteemed contemporaries, I got reactions ranging from respectful quibbling with Moss' choice of words to outright indignation.

"First of all, Randy Moss is held in contempt," said former Atlanta Falcons and Indianapolis Colts cornerback Ray Buchanan, who played against both Rice and Moss on multiple occasions during his 12-year career. "He has not at all obeyed protocol for wide receivers. And with all due respect to Randy Moss, I had to do a lot more film study to get ready for Jerry because I had to get ready for every route. He ran every route available, to perfection, and he ran them all the same, so it was almost impossible to stop. With Randy, I didn't even have to watch film, because it was all about the 'Go' route."

In NFL circles, there is little debate about Rice's greatness. "Jerry is like MJ – the greatest ever," says former Pittsburgh Steelers star Hines Ward, comparing his fellow Super Bowl MVP-winning receiver to basketball legend Michael Jordan. "There will never be another one like him."

[Related: Complete coverage of Randy Moss as a 49er]

When I asked Hall of Fame running back Marshall Faulk about the Rice vs. Moss debate, he answered, "What debate? Why do I need to comment on something that doesn't even merit discussion?"

Suffice it to say he shares my views regarding Rice's superiority.

Yet, somewhat surprisingly, I found several of Moss' and Rice's peers who believe that the former could make a legitimate case for being the most dangerous receiving threat the sport has known.


Jerry Rice caught 197 touchdown passes, compared to Randy Moss' 156. (Getty Images)"Randy Moss is 'The Guillotine' because he'll chop your head off with one play," said future Hall of Fame defensive tackle Warren Sapp, who was Moss' teammate with the Oakland Raiders in 2005 and '06. "You remember when they used to put two people on him and he'd still catch it? Even when the safety was over the top, Randall Cunningham would still throw it? And Brad Johnson couldn't throw it far enough to reach him?

"What's the scariest thing to defensive coordinators and players? The 'chunk' play. Randy Moss is the ultimate chunk play. And as a defensive player, that's the one thing you didn't want to face. So if Jerry was the greatest, maybe Moss is the scariest."

Eight-time Pro Bowl receiver Cris Carter, a mentor to Moss when they were Minnesota Vikings teammates from 1998-2001, also believes there is room for nuance in the argument.

"I wish Randy had said 'greatest deep threat' instead of 'greatest receiver,' " Carter said. "Jerry struck a lot of fear in defenders, but there was a whole different set of fear with Randy. He could gut you right now. He could score from anywhere on the field. And from an athletic standpoint, there is nothing I would take Jerry Rice over Randy on.

"Jerry is more complete. When it came to route running and yards after the catch, a term they invented because of Jerry, he was the greatest. Most of all, when Jerry stands before God, he'll have gotten everything possible out of his ability. When Randy stands before God, he'll still have some left."

Former NFL cornerback Eric Davis, a teammate of Rice's in San Francisco from 1990-95 and a man who covered both receivers during his 13-year career, agrees that work ethic, drive and attention to detail helped set Rice apart.

"Jerry is the greatest receiver, period," Davis said. "You had to defend the entire field, because he ran every route. Randy, with his size and speed and hands, is the greatest deep threat we've ever seen. There's a reason we called him a 'freak.' There are very few that have ever had that type of impact. But he would still fall short of Jerry Rice, the greatest impact player the game has ever seen."

[Related: Video: Why are they called 'Ravens' and '49ers'?]

To Davis, Moss' uneven effort and unwillingness to go across the middle were other areas that kept him from reaching Rice's level.

"He could have gotten more out of his ability," Davis said. "How many big plays did he leave on the field by not going across the middle? You played Randy outside-in, so you would be in position to see the deep ball. You knew he wasn't going to run in-routes and run away from you. With Jerry, it was a chess match, because he ran every route – curl, deep dig, slant, go, post, out, you name it – and they all looked the same."

Buchanan gave a similar assessment, saying, "With Moss, it was like checkers. With Rice, it was like chess. It was a totally different ballgame. I'm gonna be honest with you – a lot of defensive backs don't want to mention that we're nervous or intimidated at our position. We've got our egos that are strong. But me coming from Indy and coming to [the Falcons in] that division [with the 49ers], I honestly had tornado storms in my stomach."

Sapp, however, said he and his fellow Tampa Bay Buccaneers defenders were petrified of Moss.

"All we're arguing about is words," Sapp said. "Because Randy could have said, 'I am the greatest, shiniest weapon that's ever played,' and he'd be right. Jerry Rice was like Zorro's sword, slicing you up with precision and skill and making you die a slow death. Randy Moss is Excalibur. When nothing else works, you pull out that sword and it's instant death."

As I suggested earlier, I could talk a great deal about Rice's maniacal drive and hypercompetitive nature – the way he constantly focused on the smallest details, pushed himself and his teammates and viewed every play (even those on which he was a decoy) as a chance to set up an opponent for a potential advantage later in the game, or even in the next game. To me, it felt right that he was the one who enjoyed unprecedented success on Sundays, because everything I'd witnessed from Monday through Saturday suggested he'd prepared the hardest and cared the most.

[Related: U2's powerful NFL halftime shows almost never happened]

We could spend a long time talking about Rice's numbers; he owns virtually every meaningful NFL receiving record, and Carter basically pointed to his statistical superiority Tuesday when questioned about Moss' comments. Even Moss's claim to fame, breaking Rice's single-season touchdown reception record in 2007, should come with an asterisk: Moss caught 23 TDs in 16 games; Rice, during the strike-shortened 1987 season, had 22 TD receptions in 12 games.

"Randy Moss says he's not worried about statistics," Buchanan says. "Well, statistics do matter."

I also saw Rice dominate numerous postseason games (and Super Bowls), while Moss flat-out quit in the Vikings' 41-0 defeat to the New York Giants in the 2000 NFC championship game, among other postseason indignities. Remember the infamous water-squirting incident?

Perhaps Moss' absurd antics, such as his notorious dressing down of a caterer during his second stint with the Minnesota Vikings, have caused me to underestimate his impact as a player. On Super Sunday, the soon-to-be-36-year-old receiver won't likely strike much fear in the Ravens' secondary, but there absolutely was a time when his presence raised the pulse rates of opposing defenders and coaches.

To Davis, because of Moss' body of work, the man who once said "I play when I want to play" can say what he wants to say.

"If he wants to say 'greatest wide receiver ever,' because of his effect on the game? He's a Hall of Famer, so that's his right," Davis said. "But Jerry Rice? We're talking about the greatest football player of all time, pick your position. He's the greatest, end of story."

[tilly]

Thank you for this post Tilly. This is what I was talking about earlier some people just dont like Moss.

I think you missed my point. The best never dog it at the expense of their team. Thus Moss is not the best...and I love Moss' game.

[RayUF07]

NEW ORLEANS – Randy Moss spiced up Wednesday's Super Bowl media session by expounding upon his Media Day declaration that he's the greatest receiver of all time, causing some of us to react as though we'd just ingested an undue amount of jambalaya.

"What I think, is what I think," Moss said Wednesday. "I changed the game."

As someone who did a book with Jerry Rice – and spent many years watching the unparalleled wideout hone his craft on a daily basis – I want to go all Lloyd Bentsen on the man affectionately known as 'Superfreak.'

I covered Jerry Rice as a beat writer. I knew Jerry Rice. I watched Jerry Rice defy medical science and embarrass defensive backs. Randy, you're no Jerry Rice.

However, as tempting as it is to spend the next 20 paragraphs explaining precisely why I believe the current San Francisco 49ers wideout's career pales in comparison to that of the retired ex-Niners superstar, among others, I decided to reach out to some folks who are uniquely qualified to assess the claim on its own merits. And in talking to some of the two receivers' most esteemed contemporaries, I got reactions ranging from respectful quibbling with Moss' choice of words to outright indignation.

"First of all, Randy Moss is held in contempt," said former Atlanta Falcons and Indianapolis Colts cornerback Ray Buchanan, who played against both Rice and Moss on multiple occasions during his 12-year career. "He has not at all obeyed protocol for wide receivers. And with all due respect to Randy Moss, I had to do a lot more film study to get ready for Jerry because I had to get ready for every route. He ran every route available, to perfection, and he ran them all the same, so it was almost impossible to stop. With Randy, I didn't even have to watch film, because it was all about the 'Go' route."

In NFL circles, there is little debate about Rice's greatness. "Jerry is like MJ – the greatest ever," says former Pittsburgh Steelers star Hines Ward, comparing his fellow Super Bowl MVP-winning receiver to basketball legend Michael Jordan. "There will never be another one like him."

[Related: Complete coverage of Randy Moss as a 49er]

When I asked Hall of Fame running back Marshall Faulk about the Rice vs. Moss debate, he answered, "What debate? Why do I need to comment on something that doesn't even merit discussion?"

Suffice it to say he shares my views regarding Rice's superiority.

Yet, somewhat surprisingly, I found several of Moss' and Rice's peers who believe that the former could make a legitimate case for being the most dangerous receiving threat the sport has known.

Jerry Rice caught 197 touchdown passes, compared to Randy Moss' 156. (Getty Images)"Randy Moss is 'The Guillotine' because he'll chop your head off with one play," said future Hall of Fame defensive tackle Warren Sapp, who was Moss' teammate with the Oakland Raiders in 2005 and '06. "You remember when they used to put two people on him and he'd still catch it? Even when the safety was over the top, Randall Cunningham would still throw it? And Brad Johnson couldn't throw it far enough to reach him?

"What's the scariest thing to defensive coordinators and players? The 'chunk' play. Randy Moss is the ultimate chunk play. And as a defensive player, that's the one thing you didn't want to face. So if Jerry was the greatest, maybe Moss is the scariest."

Eight-time Pro Bowl receiver Cris Carter, a mentor to Moss when they were Minnesota Vikings teammates from 1998-2001, also believes there is room for nuance in the argument.

"I wish Randy had said 'greatest deep threat' instead of 'greatest receiver,' " Carter said. "Jerry struck a lot of fear in defenders, but there was a whole different set of fear with Randy. He could gut you right now. He could score from anywhere on the field. And from an athletic standpoint, there is nothing I would take Jerry Rice over Randy on.

"Jerry is more complete. When it came to route running and yards after the catch, a term they invented because of Jerry, he was the greatest. Most of all, when Jerry stands before God, he'll have gotten everything possible out of his ability. When Randy stands before God, he'll still have some left."

Former NFL cornerback Eric Davis, a teammate of Rice's in San Francisco from 1990-95 and a man who covered both receivers during his 13-year career, agrees that work ethic, drive and attention to detail helped set Rice apart.

"Jerry is the greatest receiver, period," Davis said. "You had to defend the entire field, because he ran every route. Randy, with his size and speed and hands, is the greatest deep threat we've ever seen. There's a reason we called him a 'freak.' There are very few that have ever had that type of impact. But he would still fall short of Jerry Rice, the greatest impact player the game has ever seen."

[Related: Video: Why are they called 'Ravens' and '49ers'?]

To Davis, Moss' uneven effort and unwillingness to go across the middle were other areas that kept him from reaching Rice's level.

"He could have gotten more out of his ability," Davis said. "How many big plays did he leave on the field by not going across the middle? You played Randy outside-in, so you would be in position to see the deep ball. You knew he wasn't going to run in-routes and run away from you. With Jerry, it was a chess match, because he ran every route – curl, deep dig, slant, go, post, out, you name it – and they all looked the same."

Buchanan gave a similar assessment, saying, "With Moss, it was like checkers. With Rice, it was like chess. It was a totally different ballgame. I'm gonna be honest with you – a lot of defensive backs don't want to mention that we're nervous or intimidated at our position. We've got our egos that are strong. But me coming from Indy and coming to [the Falcons in] that division [with the 49ers], I honestly had tornado storms in my stomach."

Sapp, however, said he and his fellow Tampa Bay Buccaneers defenders were petrified of Moss.

"All we're arguing about is words," Sapp said. "Because Randy could have said, 'I am the greatest, shiniest weapon that's ever played,' and he'd be right. Jerry Rice was like Zorro's sword, slicing you up with precision and skill and making you die a slow death. Randy Moss is Excalibur. When nothing else works, you pull out that sword and it's instant death."

As I suggested earlier, I could talk a great deal about Rice's maniacal drive and hypercompetitive nature – the way he constantly focused on the smallest details, pushed himself and his teammates and viewed every play (even those on which he was a decoy) as a chance to set up an opponent for a potential advantage later in the game, or even in the next game. To me, it felt right that he was the one who enjoyed unprecedented success on Sundays, because everything I'd witnessed from Monday through Saturday suggested he'd prepared the hardest and cared the most.

[Related: U2's powerful NFL halftime shows almost never happened]

We could spend a long time talking about Rice's numbers; he owns virtually every meaningful NFL receiving record, and Carter basically pointed to his statistical superiority Tuesday when questioned about Moss' comments. Even Moss's claim to fame, breaking Rice's single-season touchdown reception record in 2007, should come with an asterisk: Moss caught 23 TDs in 16 games; Rice, during the strike-shortened 1987 season, had 22 TD receptions in 12 games.

"Randy Moss says he's not worried about statistics," Buchanan says. "Well, statistics do matter."

I also saw Rice dominate numerous postseason games (and Super Bowls), while Moss flat-out quit in the Vikings' 41-0 defeat to the New York Giants in the 2000 NFC championship game, among other postseason indignities. Remember the infamous water-squirting incident?

Perhaps Moss' absurd antics, such as his notorious dressing down of a caterer during his second stint with the Minnesota Vikings, have caused me to underestimate his impact as a player. On Super Sunday, the soon-to-be-36-year-old receiver won't likely strike much fear in the Ravens' secondary, but there absolutely was a time when his presence raised the pulse rates of opposing defenders and coaches.

To Davis, because of Moss' body of work, the man who once said "I play when I want to play" can say what he wants to say.

"If he wants to say 'greatest wide receiver ever,' because of his effect on the game? He's a Hall of Famer, so that's his right," Davis said. "But Jerry Rice? We're talking about the greatest football player of all time, pick your position. He's the greatest, end of story."

It's funny to me because, everything said in that article is what I have said. Agree completely.

[MtownGator]

Moss Career 218 982 632 15,292 15.6 82 156 704 13 7

Rice Career 303 1549 0 22,895 14.8 96 197 742 16 11

Owens Career 219 1078 685 15,934 14.8 98 153 742 10 6

Bruce Career 223 1024 383 15,208 14.9 80 91 716 15 10

Come on --- Rice is the man for sure

[atlantagator86]

I actually think Moss might be the most physically gifted receiver of all time, but as far as I'm concerned, his effort and leadership left a bit to be desired. I actually think he underachieved his potential. In Minnesota they would just chuck the ball downfield and rely of the mismatches.

Jerry Rice was a great talent with an unmatched work ethic and leadership skills. He completely overachieved for his talent level. I would probably take Rice over just about anybody.

If Moss had Rice's work ethic, I believe, without question, that Moss would have been the best of all time.

[Gatorrick22]

Can you qualify those numbers please. I got most of them but what's with the (0) on rice's stat sheet.

[secgator]

Can you qualify those numbers please. I got most of them but what's with the (0) on rice's stat sheet.

Number of plays where he didn't give a 110%.

As compared to Moss number of 632. :joecool:

[Gatorrick22]

Number of plays where he didn't give a 110%.

As compared to Moss number of 632. :joecool:


:laugh:

[MtownGator]

I'd say as in the number of times a receiver has been thrown to. best I can figure.
May be an error on my copy paste skills for the zero.

[G8R92]

Randy sent his daughter Sydney to play hoops for the Gators. That's enough for me. Moss. He's certainly the most dynamic, spectacular.

You do realize that Moss was a one time Seminole? If Ray Lewis sent his kid to play at Florida, would he then be forgiven of his sins?

[Gat0r]

Why not just remain silent and let the world assume you're a fool.

[tilly]

You do realize that Moss was a one time Seminole? If Ray Lewis sent his kid to play at Florida, would he then be forgiven of his sins?

Truth...but I hope Moss' team crushes RayRay

[OaktownGator]

Guys I'd take over Randy Moss if I was building a team (assuming they're all in their prime): Jerry Rice, Isaac Bruce, Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson, Andre Johnson, Wes Chandler, Chris Carter, Michael Irvin, Sterling Sharpe, Anquan Boldin, Steve Largent... Probably more that I can't think of right now.

Moss has better stats than most of them, but those are all great receivers you can rely on to make plays, week in and week out, come up big in the big moments when you need them most, and make their team better. And they don't need baby sitters.

[Ash]

There was more parity in the NFL during Moss' career than Rice's. There were more stacked teams and more really bad teams when Rice played.

Rice's '49er teams were ridiculously stacked. He played with hall of fame/MVP type QBs his entire career. Joe Montana, Steve Young, Rich Gannon. It wasn't just the QBs though. It was the whole package. Roger Craig, Dwight Clark, Terrel Owens, Tim Brown. Jerry was a weapon amongst many weapons his entire career and teams could not afford to focus much resources in defending him. They had to account for everything. Look at Young, that guy was a running threat on top of everything else. Culpepper was okay for a while (made by Moss, in my opinion, look what he did without Moss). Johnson was a game manager type QB, not a deep ball passer, not a high WR usage rate. At the tail end of Moss' prime he got to play with Brady and what happened? Single season TD record. Ya think maybe if Moss got to play with Brady from the start it might have been different? Or maybe, if Moss go to do the equivalent of Rice and played with Brett Farve and then Aaron Rodgers? Moss was head and shoulders better than Rice in my opinion.

[JohnC1908]

There was more parity in the NFL during Moss' career than Rice's.

Rice's '49er teams were ridiculously stacked. He played with hall of fame/MVP type QBs his entire career. Joe Montana, Steve Young, Rich Gannon. It wasn't just the QBs though. It was the whole package. Roger Craig, Dwight Clark, Terrel Owens, Tim Brown. Jerry was a weapon amongst many weapons his entire career and teams could not afford to focus much resources in defending him. They had to account for everything. Look at Young, that guy was a running threat on top of everything else. Culpepper was okay for a while (made by Moss, in my opinion, look what he did without Moss). Johnson was a game manager type QB, not a deep ball passer, not a high WR usage rate. At the tail end of Moss' prime he got to play with Brady and what happened? Single season TD record. Ya think maybe if Moss got to play with Brady from the start it might have been different? Or maybe, if Moss go to do the equivalent of Rice and played with Brett Farve and then Aaron Rodgers? Moss was head and shoulders better than Rice in my opinion.

Dwight Clark and Rich Gannon...really?

[CHFG8R]

There was more parity in the NFL during Moss' career than Rice's.

Rice's '49er teams were ridiculously stacked. He played with hall of fame/MVP type QBs his entire career. Joe Montana, Steve Young, Rich Gannon. It wasn't just the QBs though. It was the whole package. Roger Craig, Dwight Clark, Terrel Owens, Tim Brown. Jerry was a weapon amongst many weapons his entire career and teams could not afford to focus much resources in defending him. They had to account for everything. Look at Young, that guy was a running threat on top of everything else. Culpepper was okay for a while (made by Moss, in my opinion, look what he did without Moss). Johnson was a game manager type QB, not a deep ball passer, not a high WR usage rate. At the tail end of Moss' prime he got to play with Brady and what happened? Single season TD record. Ya think maybe if Moss got to play with Brady from the start it might have been different? Or maybe, if Moss go to do the equivalent of Rice and played with Brett Farve and then Aaron Rodgers? Moss was head and shoulders better than Rice in my opinion.

One could easily make the argument that this meant less touches for Jerry. Also, Moss broke the record with 4 additional games. And please don't try to push that teams did not scheme for Jerry.

[Ash]

Dwight Clark and Rich Gannon...really?

Rich Gannon won the MVP of the league. He was no slouch, he also played on many bad teams. I think the proof in this is when Moss had an equivalent QB (Brady) he blew up.

[GatorAvatar]

I would have a million receiving yards too if I played 31 years in the NFL and had two HOF QBs tossing me dimes. Randy Moss is the GOAT.

[GatorAvatar]

Maybe to you but the masses would disagree; and disagree a lot.

Masses are blinded by those three rings courtesy of two HOF QBs. Look at Larry Fitzgerald when he had a QB vs when he doesn't. Moss was great without any notable QBs.

[JohnC1908]

Rich Gannon won the MVP of the league. He was no slouch, he also played on many bad teams. I think the proof in this is when Moss had an equivalent QB (Brady) he blew up.

So what? Rich Gannon played on bad teams because he was bad most of his career. I mean Rich Gannon? He's no better than Cunningham, Johnson, or Culpepper. I guess we could argue who is slightly better but there isn't much difference between them.
Who was diverting all the attention from Jerry when he won the Super Bowl with Steve Young? Rice seemed to excel and make others around him better no matter where he was. He seems to be the X factor. Granted, I do think he and Montana are the best QB/WR duo ever. To imply he was lucky to play with Craig and Dwight Clark (I mean c'mon...Dwight Clark) is absurd. They were lucky to play under Walsh and with he and Montana. Since Moss has better measurables that just makes him better...okay. And of course he still has zero Super Bowls and has little to do with the outcome of Sunday's game.

[OaktownGator]

The fact people are even considering Moss in the same breath as Rice is an indictment on the state of football knowledge of those fans.

At the end of the day, it's about winning. Doing what it takes to make yourself better, your team better and to rise to the occasion when your team needs you.

Some people argue that Moss' time with the Patriots is the proof. I argue they are exactly right. With Brady he torched every chitty defense they played.... and completely disappeared in the big games and especially the playoff games.

The Pats won three of the prior four Super Bowls before adding Moss. Then they add Moss and go in the dumper two years in a row in spite of setting a bunch of passing records.

Who gives two chits about setting passing records? It's about winning. A guy that regularly takes plays off, doesn't block and disappears in big games is not a winner, and deserves no part of this conversation.

[GATORQUEDOG]

I think Randy was the better player


Agree 100%.
Rice was great, but just like Emmitt, he also benefited from having a GREAT team around him for the better part of his career. The offense that San Fran was running was taylor made for Rice's skillset and having John Taylor on the other side with Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing certainly didn't hurt.

As for pure talent, explosiveness and some of the greatest and most spectacular catches made by a receiver---Moss is/was better than Rice.

[Ash]

At the end of the day, it's about winning.


It's a team game or do you really think Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino? The Cowboys and 49ers were dominant teams for much of the 80s and 90s. Stacked. Fact: Rice played with two hall of fame QBs for the majority of his career. Without those Qbs, his stats dropped. Now, we has older, yes, but they dropped nonetheless. Moss, as an older player, went to the Patriots and dominated immediately.

ut just like Emmitt, he also benefited from having a GREAT team around him for the better part of his career.


Exactly. Who is better? Smith or Sanders? I think, Sanders is obviously the better back. But, he played for Detroit so no rings and no supporting cast.

[GatorAvatar]

It's a team game or do you really think Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino? The Cowboys and 49ers were dominant teams for much of the 80s and 90s. Stacked. Fact: Rice played with two hall of fame QBs for the majority of his career. Without those Qbs, his stats dropped. Now, we has older, yes, but they dropped nonetheless. Moss, as an older player, went to the Patriots and dominated immediately.

Exactly. Who is better? Smith or Sanders? I think, Sanders is obviously the better back. But, he played for Detroit so no rings and no supporting cast.

This!

[Minister_of_Information]

When it comes to Rice and his QBs, the question could just as easily be whether he made them. And the same applies to John Taylor etc.

[CHFG8R]

As I said before, holocaust deniers are entitled to their opinions too and if Ash, Avatar and the rest want to stand with the .01%, so be it.

Just like 1935-45, the rest of us know the real truth.

[CHFG8R]

My guess is these assumptions about Moss as GOAT are based on something other than actual witness to their real-life, on-field accomplishments.

[OaktownGator]

It's a team game or do you really think Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino? The Cowboys and 49ers were dominant teams for much of the 80s and 90s. Stacked. Fact: Rice played with two hall of fame QBs for the majority of his career. Without those Qbs, his stats dropped. Now, we has older, yes, but they dropped nonetheless. Moss, as an older player, went to the Patriots and dominated immediately.

Exactly. Who is better? Smith or Sanders? I think, Sanders is obviously the better back. But, he played for Detroit so no rings and no supporting cast.
Moss with the Patriots: 4 Playoff games. 12 catches. 142 yards, 1 TD.

Really lit it up. GOAT! GOAT! GOAT!

Or maybe not... Rice beat that all to hell in just one of his Super Bowl performances.

BTW - in years prior to Brady, Culpepper went to three pro bowls and passed well over 3,000 yards four times, including one year over 4700 yards. There was no shortage of passing yards to be had with him. Moss was hardly hurting for someone to throw him the ball.

Next, as far as football being a team game..... YES, YES, YES!

It is a team game. You don't get to just skip out on a huge part of your job - blocking. You don't get to just jog because you're not the primary receiver. That's the kind of cancerous behavior that keeps very good, very talented teams from being great teams. It is the behavior of a loser.

In an earlier post, I listed probably 10 receivers I'd rather have, and in terms of building a winning team, no doubt that's a short list.

[nawlinsgator]

Masses are blinded by those three rings courtesy of two HOF QBs. Look at Larry Fitzgerald when he had a QB vs when he doesn't. Moss was great without any notable QBs.

Your age is showing. There was football before you could watch players highlights on youtube, you know.

[Minister_of_Information]

Is greatness achievement or potential?

[j7]

There are comments in the following article on the subject from corners who faced both Rice and Moss -

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--best-wide-receiver-ever--jerry-rice-vs--randy-moss-233828619.html

[Minister_of_Information]

Already linked upthread

[j7]

Already linked upthread

My bad, missed it.

[secgator]

When it comes to Rice and his QBs, the question could just as easily be whether he made them. And the same applies to John Taylor etc.

Exactly. All these claims about Rice being with HOF QB's his entire career---does it not cross their minds that without Rice, the QB stats and performance would likely be diminished quite a bit???

Again--it is youth which drives the support for Moss. Nothing more. In the real world, when the media--the league--the coaches and players--the VAST majority of fans who have actually watched the two, even opposing fans--agree that Rice is better.....it isn't even in the same breath to debate.

Rice IS the best. The facts back it up--not just opinions.

[WESGATORS]

Over 200 posts on a Randy Moss thread and no reference to "One Clap?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmJcUlrkMNg

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

[UFreak]

I will say this, the Randy Moss mooning incident was the most overblown thing ever. Joe Buck soooooooooooo over reacted on that.

[GATORQUEDOG]

I will say this, the Randy Moss mooning incident was the most overblown thing ever. Joe Buck soooooooooooo over reacted on that.

Agree. Typical Joe Buck a lot lately.

[RayUF07]

Any advantage Rice MAY have had with regard to QB's and supporting cast, surely is negated by the brand of flag football played most of Moss' career. Moss rarely had to worry about being hit, touched, or otherwise breathed on, while his QB could wait without fear for Moss to run his one route, 60 yards down field.

[NoahBeanBizzel]

Wow, I went back and read through this thread. It's amazing that there are actually people making a case that Jerry Rice isn't the game's greatest receiver of all time. And saying that Moss is as a counter? I'm stunned.

Any statistic worth anything that counts would favor Rice in that discussion.

[Sylez_G_Koolaid]

Glitter, glisten, gloss, floss
I catch a beat runnin like Randy Moss

[UFreak]

Glitter, glisten, gloss, floss
I catch a beat runnin like Randy Moss

Ride dat ----- off like a brand new horse

[NoahBeanBizzel]

Over 200 posts on a Randy Moss thread and no reference to "One Clap?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmJcUlrkMNg

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

That might be the most ridiculous video I've ever seen. Wow.

[orangeblueorangeblue]

That's not even close to Steve Porter's most ridiculous video either.

[UFreak]

Straight cash homie.

I love Moss. He's just not better than Rice. But I love him.

[mulegator]

Randy .. Randy .. Randy ...

Just when I was beginning to kinda like you again .. you go and say some stupid sh!t like that.

It's ok though .. I still like you more than Terrell (Catch the Damn Ball!) Owens.

Feel free to argue amongst yourselves ..

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/390780-the-top-25-wide-receivers-in-the-history-of-the-nfl#/articles/390780-the-top-25-wide-receivers-in-the-history-of-the-nfl/page/26

[1984Gator]

There was more parity in the NFL during Moss' career than Rice's. There were more stacked teams and more really bad teams when Rice played.

Rice's '49er teams were ridiculously stacked. He played with hall of fame/MVP type QBs his entire career. Joe Montana, Steve Young, Rich Gannon. It wasn't just the QBs though. It was the whole package. Roger Craig, Dwight Clark, Terrel Owens, Tim Brown. Jerry was a weapon amongst many weapons his entire career and teams could not afford to focus much resources in defending him. They had to account for everything. Look at Young, that guy was a running threat on top of everything else. Culpepper was okay for a while (made by Moss, in my opinion, look what he did without Moss). Johnson was a game manager type QB, not a deep ball passer, not a high WR usage rate. At the tail end of Moss' prime he got to play with Brady and what happened? Single season TD record. Ya think maybe if Moss got to play with Brady from the start it might have been different? Or maybe, if Moss go to do the equivalent of Rice and played with Brett Farve and then Aaron Rodgers? Moss was head and shoulders better than Rice in my opinion.

You could say that Rice shouldn't have seen the ball as much with all that other talent around him. Isn't that what happened to Moss's numbers this year?

[1984Gator]

Agree 100%.
Rice was great, but just like Emmitt, he also benefited from having a GREAT team around him for the better part of his career. The offense that San Fran was running was taylor made for Rice's skillset and having John Taylor on the other side with Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing certainly didn't hurt.

As for pure talent, explosiveness and some of the greatest and most spectacular catches made by a receiver---Moss is/was better than Rice.

Moss could have played more years with great teams but he was not a team player interested in team goals. The Pats kicked him off the team. That's how valuable Moss was to a great team with a great coach and that why he played for bad teams and hasn't won anything.

[Ash]

-shrug- I think individual players get way too much credit and way too much blame for team results in a greatest ever conversation. Take Marino versus Montana. Most would say Montana was better. But, I watched both those guys play. Marino was way better. Montana had better teams. e smith has the nfl all time yardage stat. But he played behind those awesome cowboy lines for years with a great qb and great wrs. Smith was good but certainly not better than guys like Dickerson, Faulk, Sanders, Payton, A Peterson, Billy Sims, Oj Simpson, Etc. . ..

was rice great? Yeah. But there's lots of wrs out there with similar or better skills.

[Minister_of_Information]

You cannot say that while claiming to understand which skills matter most.

And I think you're giving Emmitt short shift.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvEXqWcouBg

[secgator]

Since Emmitt was mentioned...true, there were/are many RBs with similar talent. BUT--Emmitt didn't have those same awesome OL's blocking for him at Escambua HS...at UF...and yet he still accomplished the feats he did at EVERY level. While there is no denying his line at Dallas was a big factor in getting him out of the gate so to speak, he did the vast majority of what he did--on his own. And while there may be many others with great juke moves--faster speed--quicker take off--etc, in the grand scheme of things, he was and still is...the best RB to play in the NFL, or possibly football in general. You are indeed selling him short.... in the big picture. Exactly the same as those advocating Rice not being the greatest WR. Exact same thing. You have to look at the entire body of work, and the overall accomplishments--along with the intangibles that can't be measured.

Opinions are just that, but the overall facts still bear out Rice IS the best. Moss is not even in the discussion....when viewing the big picture.

[RayUF07]

It's funny because, if you're going to talk Moss up you SHOULD talk TO up also, but someone listed 20 WR no mention of TO.

[ovillegator]

Jerry Rice was the greatest receiver anywhere on the field. Watch his catches -- he pulled in anything in the vicinity.

[dawny]

Rice is a gentleman and the best reciever we have seen,but I would pick another second by the name of Les Chandler,Moss only shooting off at the mouth because the media lets him.

[Tebowism0823]

Masses are blinded by those three rings courtesy of two HOF QBs. Look at Larry Fitzgerald when he had a QB vs when he doesn't. Moss was great without any notable QBs.

What? Culpepper was a good QB in Minnesota. He had Brady on NE. Try again!

[Sylez_G_Koolaid]

It's funny because, if you're going to talk Moss up you SHOULD talk TO up also, but someone listed 20 WR no mention of TO.

T.O. and Ocho were the best at the TD celebrations, bruh.

Some of the best: T.O. posing on the Dallas star, T.O. pulling out a sharpie to sign a ball, T.O. grabbing a cheerleader's pom poms, Ocho doing the riverdance, Ocho doing the Tiger Woods putt using the end zone pylon, Ocho throwing a flag on himself. So alpha.

[GatorPrincess8]

Randy Moss is nothing but an egomaniac.

[GatorBen]

Randy Moss is nothing but an egomaniac.

But he's an egomaniac that has a legitimate argument at being the most talented WR ever to play in the NFL.

Best? Depends on your criteria, probably not in my book, but I have no problem with someone at Randy Moss's level thinking that he's the best.

[secgator]

T.O. and Ocho were the best at the TD celebrations, bruh.

Some of the best: T.O. posing on the Dallas star, T.O. pulling out a sharpie to sign a ball, T.O. grabbing a cheerleader's pom poms, Ocho doing the riverdance, Ocho doing the Tiger Woods putt using the end zone pylon, Ocho throwing a flag on himself. So alpha.

Exactly why neither of those attention whores will be known for anything more than their egos. Garbage players who only care about "me-me-me"....couldn't give a rat's ass about their 'teams'.

These two are the perfect pair to illustrate what NOT to be as their careers flame out. They deserve each other. Certainly no team deserves them.

[Matthanuf06]

I'm just wondering why this is even a discussion. One of the greatest WR ever to play actually thinks he's the best. Isn't that what you'd expect?

I bet Brady, Marino, Montana, Manning, etc all believe they are the best. That's a job requirement

[gatorr4life]

Since Emmitt was mentioned...true, there were/are many RBs with similar talent. BUT--Emmitt didn't have those same awesome OL's blocking for him at Escambua HS...at UF...and yet he still accomplished the feats he did at EVERY level. While there is no denying his line at Dallas was a big factor in getting him out of the gate so to speak, he did the vast majority of what he did--on his own. And while there may be many others with great juke moves--faster speed--quicker take off--etc, in the grand scheme of things, he was and still is...the best RB to play in the NFL, or possibly football in general. You are indeed selling him short.... in the big picture. Exactly the same as those advocating Rice not being the greatest WR. Exact same thing. You have to look at the entire body of work, and the overall accomplishments--along with the intangibles that can't be measured.

Opinions are just that, but the overall facts still bear out Rice IS the best. Moss is not even in the discussion....when viewing the big picture.

Barry sanders is the best running back of all time, imo. Sorry, but like you said, Smith had a great line AND a great blocking full back. (Moose) I'd take Barry, sweetness and Jim brown over smith. Smith would be in my top 5 though. And let's not forget AP of this era. Guy is a monster.

Carry on...

[GATORAZ]

I'm just wondering why this is even a discussion. One of the greatest WR ever to play actually thinks he's the best. Isn't that what you'd expect?

I bet Brady, Marino, Montana, Manning, etc all believe they are the best. That's a job requirement
this.....

[demosthenes]

I'm just wondering why this is even a discussion. One of the greatest WR ever to play actually thinks he's the best. Isn't that what you'd expect?

I bet Brady, Marino, Montana, Manning, etc all believe they are the best. That's a job requirement

Agreed.

[JohnC1908]

I'm just wondering why this is even a discussion. One of the greatest WR ever to play actually thinks he's the best. Isn't that what you'd expect?

I bet Brady, Marino, Montana, Manning, etc all believe they are the best. That's a job requirement

Doesn't make it true. Rice doesn't say it, he showed it.

[1984Gator]

Barry sanders is the best running back of all time, imo. Sorry, but like you said, Smith had a great line AND a great blocking full back. (Moose) I'd take Barry, sweetness and Jim brown over smith. Smith would be in my top 5 though. And let's not forget AP of this era. Guy is a monster.

Carry on...

Not to take away from barry Sanders HOF career but he was prone to break a long run here and there than to move the ball consistently and score TD's often enough to win ball games. He walked away from his team and a management he disliked and kept the bonus money for signing a new contract and that was a scumbag thing to do even if management were schmucks. Smith on the other hand was all class and did the things necessary to win games and championships. His character towers above Sanders and his style of play was more conducive to winning. He also kept going when Sanders walked away! No contest here either!

[Ash]

Not to take away from barry Sanders HOF career but he was prone to break a long run here and there than to move the ball consistently and score TD's often enough to win ball games. He walked away from his team and a management he disliked and kept the bonus money for signing a new contract and that was a scumbag thing to do even if management were schmucks. Smith on the other hand was all class and did the things necessary to win games and championships. His character towers above Sanders and his style of play was more conducive to winning. He also kept going when Sanders walked away! No contest here either!

1) Sanders averaged 5 yards a carry
2) Sanders often broke big runs when the play was busted
3) Sanders played on mostly terrible to mediocre teams throughout. He gave Detroit a really good show for a long time. He didn't owe them anything. He walked away with is health, or what was left of it.


I forgot about Jim Brown. Yeah, he's got to be in the discussion. Gayle Sayers too. Marcus Allen had some unique skills as a rb.

[demosthenes]

Nobody has mentioned Bo Jackson when he was clearly one of the best ever, injury shortened career or not.

[antny]

Ash claims several receivers have the same skills if not better than rice? You lose all credibility from there on. You have pro bowl corners that lined up across the guy who vehemently disagree but yes.....you are right.

Also note the hypocrisy for those that say Montana and young made rice but moss made culpepper.

[corpgator]

Not to take away from barry Sanders HOF career but he was prone to break a long run here and there than to move the ball consistently and score TD's often enough to win ball games. He walked away from his team and a management he disliked and kept the bonus money for signing a new contract and that was a scumbag thing to do even if management were schmucks. Smith on the other hand was all class and did the things necessary to win games and championships. His character towers above Sanders and his style of play was more conducive to winning. He also kept going when Sanders walked away! No contest here either!

5 ypc while playing in a single back formation.

[AzCatFan]

The Sanders versus Emmitt is another interesting debate. If you are asking who was the best pure runner, that's easy, Sanders. He was the human pinball and did things out on the field that just left you in jaw-dropped amazement. But ask who was the better football player and who I'd rather build a team around, that was Emmitt. Need a back to pick up a blitzing linebacker, Emmitt was one of the best. Need a release valve on passing plays that can not only catch, but pick up needed yards? Again, who better than Emmitt? Sanders? He'd have runs that only he could have turned into a positive, but Emmitt was the more complete player.

Moss has more athletic potential than perhaps anyone who has ever played wide receiver. But if I'm building a team from scratch, I'd take Rice (and several others) over Moss in a heartbeat. Rice is just a more complete football player. Hands down, no contest.

[tilly]

Masses are blinded by those three rings courtesy of two HOF QBs. Look at Larry Fitzgerald when he had a QB vs when he doesn't. Moss was great without any notable QBs.

To bad Steve Young says it was the opposite. He says Jerry made him great.

[antny]

The Sanders versus Emmitt is another interesting debate. If you are asking who was the best pure runner, that's easy, Sanders. He was the human pinball and did things out on the field that just left you in jaw-dropped amazement. But ask who was the better football player and who I'd rather build a team around, that was Emmitt. Need a back to pick up a blitzing linebacker, Emmitt was one of the best. Need a release valve on passing plays that can not only catch, but pick up needed yards? Again, who better than Emmitt? Sanders? He'd have runs that only he could have turned into a positive, but Emmitt was the more complete player.

Moss has more athletic potential than perhaps anyone who has ever played wide receiver. But if I'm building a team from scratch, I'd take Rice (and several others) over Moss in a heartbeat. Rice is just a more complete football player. Hands down, no contest.

Emmitts abilities get marginalized because of his great lines but jimmy Johnson as well as others who played with him said he always found the holes whereas others in practice often wouldn't.

They were 0 and 2 without him to start their 2nd title year to show some of his value

[sleeze]

If you HAVE to tell the public you are the best......it usually means your not.

[tilly]

If you HAVE to tell the public you are the best......it usually means your not.

Winner. Thread over.

[sleeze]

If the Moss guys would take the time to read the article a poster put up a few posts back....then you would get the players opinion. Guys that played against both.

[CHFG8R]

The Sanders versus Emmitt is another interesting debate. If you are asking who was the best pure runner, that's easy, Sanders. He was the human pinball and did things out on the field that just left you in jaw-dropped amazement. But ask who was the better football player and who I'd rather build a team around, that was Emmitt. Need a back to pick up a blitzing linebacker, Emmitt was one of the best. Need a release valve on passing plays that can not only catch, but pick up needed yards? Again, who better than Emmitt? Sanders? He'd have runs that only he could have turned into a positive, but Emmitt was the more complete player.

Moss has more athletic potential than perhaps anyone who has ever played wide receiver. But if I'm building a team from scratch, I'd take Rice (and several others) over Moss in a heartbeat. Rice is just a more complete football player. Hands down, no contest.

Thing that always struck me about Emmitt (like Payton) is that he ALWAYS GAINED POSITIVE YARDAGE. Always.

[RayUF07]

This still going?

[Jaggator]

Tilly tried to end it with post #240 but it lives on. Just think we have 7 more months of this.

[tilly]

Tilly tried to end it with post #240 but it lives on. Just think we have 7 more months of this.

Good news is....Its the longest running thread in two years not to be aimed at any of our former coaches. :bored:

[WESGATORS]

So we all agree then:

(1) Moss
(2) Owens
...
(X) Rice

(such that X > 2)

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

[GATORAZ]

If you HAVE to tell the public you are the best......it usually means your not.

this makes absolutely no sense

[tilly]

this makes absolutely no sense

It makes total sense. Wayne Gretzky says hello.:wave:

[secgator]

this makes absolutely no sense

You ARE joking, right? Seriously?

It typifies Moss spot on. Makes perfect sense.

[GATORAZ]

You ARE joking, right? Seriously?

It typifies Moss spot on. Makes perfect sense.

see what you just did?:wave: