Cry me a river...

[ArtVandelay]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a #$%^ Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

[g8orbill]

I don't blame him at all and would move to a no state income tax state if I were living in cally

[wgbgator]

Why on earth is he living in California and not Florida like almost every golfer on the planet?

[wgbgator]

If he's in the top 1%, federal tax-wise it probably amounts to 6-9% reduction in post tax money. Can't imagine state rates would alter that all that much further.

[gator996]

wgb
I was wondering the same thing...not sure how he got to 60%+

[ncbullgator]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a pu$$y Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

Most people can't earn 1% and would rather steal his money than work and risk for it.

ENVY: A debilitating disease affecting most liberals. Makes them lose their minds.

:joecool:

[wgbgator]

wgb
I was wondering the same thing...not sure how he got to 60%+

I mean, its no small hit when you've got that kind of dough. But I think its entirely possible a pro athlete doesnt know all that much about taxes. :grin:

[dangolegators]

If he's paying 63% in taxes, he needs to fire his accountant. Still, I think he can scrape by on the 15 million per year or so he takes home even after paying 63%.

[gatorman_07732]

If he's in the top 1%, federal tax-wise it probably amounts to 6-9% reduction in post tax money. Can't imagine state rates would alter that all that much further.

Add in payroll taxes and state local and property taxes

[oaklandroadie]

If he's paying 63% in taxes, he needs to fire his accountant. Still, I think he can scrape by on the 15 million per year or so he takes home even after paying 63%.

Good if you to determine when someone has "enough."

[Gatoragman]

Don't know why anyone would critisize him, he has the means to be able to move and increase net income by 10% or so, not sure anyone would pass that up!!!!

[ArtVandelay]

Don't know why anyone would critisize him, he has the means to be able to move and increase net income by 10% or so, not sure anyone would pass that up!!!!

Not criticizing him if he decides to move. Talk of retiring because they are taking too much taxes is pathetic. Most pro athletes don't appreciate how great of a life they have...

[dangolegators]

Don't know why anyone would critisize him, he has the means to be able to move and increase net income by 10% or so, not sure anyone would pass that up!!!!

I certainly would. I like where I live and I chose to live here for a reason. Increasing my net income by 10% would certainly not be enough to prompt me to move.

[Gatoragman]

Not criticizing him if he decides to move. Talk of retiring because they are taking too much taxes is pathetic. Most pro athletes don't appreciate how great of a life they have...

Read more: http://www.gatorcountry.com/swampgas/showthread.php?t=254956#ixzz2IeH7yX1n

Most have no idea what it takes to be a pro athlete.....

[Gatoragman]

I certainly would. I like where I live and I chose to live here for a reason. Increasing my net income by 10% would certainly not be enough to prompt me to move.

Read more: http://www.gatorcountry.com/swampgas/showthread.php?t=254956#ixzz2IeHT7CUw

That's the difference in you liberals, you like the fact that you can choose to live where you do but critisize someone else for their decision....

[ArtDeco]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a pu$$y Phil!!!...

Tell you what, Mr. I'm-not-a-pussy-and-pay-my-share-so-should-you.
Post your last 1040 on here, and we'll see how much leeway you have to call out other people's tax payments. To make it fair, I'll post my last ESTIMATED QUARTERLY tax payment. Easy for you to criticize other people when I bet your "skin in the game" is negligible at best. It's not like he's complaining about paying $20 for Bull Gator seats. If anything, it's more akin to paying thousands for the Sunshine Seats while chaps like you pay nothing for Champions Club seats. If you don't have to cut five-digit checks to the IRS every 3 months, I don't really see how you have the right to tell someone who does that he needs to pay more.
Or you could reflect on your error and apologize for calling real taxpayers the p-word.

[dangolegators]

That's the difference in you liberals, you like the fact that you can choose to live where you do but critisize someone else for their decision....

Where did I criticize anyone for moving where ever they want to live? If you want to live where you can make 10% more net income, have at it.

[gator996]

Add in payroll taxes and state local and property taxes


How many people does Phil have on payroll?

Tell you what, if its that many make some of them independent contractors and make them pay their own taxes.

State & local taxes increased enough to make him retire rather earn income?

Like many said...move next door to Tiger & Greg Norman or quit yer bitchin'

There are plenty of people who are as rich as Phil and find a way to live where they want...even California.


Property Taxes?

Go buy a house you can afford...problem solved.

[g8orbill]

class envy once again rares its ugly head on too hot

[gator996]

What???
Phil can't afford his home and is crying about it in the public and I'm exhibiting class envy?

Bitch if you can't afford the house....

Get the "F" out...what makez Mickelson any different than anyone else in America?



We need a new term here...something that defines a tendency to "suck up" to wealthy people even though the person in question has nothing in common with that person's wealth...

"Class suck up-ism"???

:laugh:

[gatorman_07732]

How many people does Phil have on payroll?

Tell you what, if its that many make some of them independent contractors and make them pay their own taxes.

State & local taxes increased enough to make him retire rather earn income?

Like many said...move next door to Tiger & Greg Norman or quit yer bitchin'

There are plenty of people who are as rich as Phil and find a way to live where they want...even California.


Property Taxes?

Go buy a house you can afford...problem solved.

I complain about my property taxes to but doesn't mean I can't afford it. By your standard, it you can afford it you should be taxed it.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a pu$$y Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

The post of a true socialist!

"Hey, you didn't earn you money! You should feel lucky to have all that money! Why should you complain when you are being asked to give up over 60% of your money to the government. It doesn't belong to you!"

[gator996]

I complain about all taxes too....

Phil is talking about retiring because of his tax load....


Well, fix the tax load...


Need lower property taxes?
Move.


"F" Mickelson...I smell a political agenda when you get irrational solutions to common everyday problems.

And then go public...

Political pot shot or like it was mentioned before Phil needs better financial managers

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

..

Phil is talking about retiring because of his tax load....

This is called going John Galt.

And for you to criticize another for something you do does not make you a pussy, like the original poster threw at Phil. But it does make you a hypocrite.

[gator996]

The post of a true socialist!

"Hey, you didn't earn you money! You should feel lucky to have all that money! Why should you complain when you are being asked to give up over 60% of your money to the government. It doesn't belong to you!"


U obviously believe that 60% figure....

...and that financially stupid people deserve some level of protection.

:no:

Whatever

[gatorman_07732]

I complain about all taxes too....

Phil is talking about retiring because of his tax load....


Well, fix the tax load...


Need lower property taxes?
Move.


"F" Mickelson...I smell a political agenda when you get irrational solutions to common everyday problems.

And then go public...

Political pot shot or like it was mentioned before Phil needs better financial managers

Why does this upset you? The guy is free to complain, after all you say you do as well.

[g8orbill]

We need a new term here...something that defines a tendency to "suck up" to wealthy people even though the person in question has nothing in common with that person's wealth...

"Class suck up-ism"???

:laugh:

:laugh: :laugh:

[dangolegators]

This is called going John Galt.

And for you to criticize another for something you do does not make you a pussy, like the original poster threw at Phil. But it does make you a hypocrite.

I sure wish all the folks who are threatening 'going Galt' would go ahead and do it. But I'm afraid most of them are prima donnas who just want attention. Too bad. I'd really like to get rid of them and have them do their whining in some other country.

[gatorman_07732]

Well since we are talking fictional characters, I'm gonna go Jack Ryan

[CalSFGator]

He clearly needs a better tax accountant, or is just lying about the total tax burden.

[gator996]

Why does this upset you? The guy is free to complain, after all you say you do as well.


I'm only criticising his conclusion....

Retirement?


R U kidding?

:laugh:

This is a BS political comment...

In this case...Phil.... "Be like Mike" (and Tiger) and move to Florida for your tax base

Don't go crying about how taxes are going to cause you to go and retire.


As a matter of fact, dividend taxes went up by more than income right?

So Phil should be looking to work more and get less of his wealth from passive investments.

Not retiring...his statements are total BS and there are people here defending him.


(Phil wants to quit work and become a "taker" when he makes $15M+ a year ....really? :laugh: )


That's what conservatives here are defending?
:crazy:

[gatorman_07732]

How exactly is Phil going to be a taker?

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

U obviously believe that 60% figure....

...and that financially stupid people deserve some level of protection.

:no:

Whatever

I doubt very seriously the Phil is a "financially stupid" person.

I think people that ridicule other high earners have a whole host of issue themselves.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

I sure wish all the folks who are threatening 'going Galt' would go ahead and do it. But I'm afraid most of them are prima donnas who just want attention. Too bad. I'd really like to get rid of them and have them do their whining in some other country.

I think you are already seeing it happen.

And we gotta love the "love it or leave it" attitude by the resident socialists. Especially since they are the ones that were so critical of it coming from the right a few years ago,

Going forward, I think we are going to see a lot of "bad luck," in the Heinlein sense.

[gator996]

I doubt very seriously the Phil is a "financially stupid" person.

I think people that ridicule other high earners have a whole host of issue themselves.



Based on what?

Being a high profile athlete somehow assures being financially savy?


I work with plenty of people that make Phil look poor

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

Based on what?

Being a high profile athlete somehow assures being financially savy?

No, I think he has a whole host of very competent accountants and financial advisers.


I work with plenty of people that make Phil look poor


And this furthers your argument...how? Is it supposed to impress us?

[gator996]

No, I think he has a whole host of very competent accountants and financial advisers.





And this furthers your argument...how? Is it supposed to impress us?



Obviously not that competent if they are advising that they can't get him below 60% taxes... :rolleyes:


Not posted to impress...but when you claim those who criticize him have "issues"...

I ain't got no issues...

I don't believe the 60% number and even if it is true I know people who earn a lot more and they aren't paying 60%....


This reeks of BS....

[dangolegators]

I think you are already seeing it happen.

And we gotta love the "love it or leave it" attitude by the resident socialists. Especially since they are the ones that were so critical of it coming from the right a few years ago,

Going forward, I think we are going to see a lot of "bad luck," in the Heinlein sense.

What love it or leave it attitude? I just want them to leave it. Conservative folks who are threatening to 'go Galt' should nut up and do it. Unfortunately, like I said, it's just spoiled prima donnas whining.

[ArtDeco]

I ain't got no issues...
....

Your English teacher does.

Again, you libs love to bitch when people bow up and say enough's enough. Show us YOUR 1040, dude. If there's alot of zeros on the end of your tax bill, I'll vamoose and you can criticize the rest of us all you want. I would think if you ever had to cut a big check to the government at any time in your life, you'd have a hell of alot more sympathy for those of us that do, and are then told that's not enough.

[ArtDeco]

I sure wish all the folks who are threatening 'going Galt' would go ahead and do it. But I'm afraid most of them are prima donnas who just want attention. Too bad. I'd really like to get rid of them and have them do their whining in some other country.

LOL at the lack of perspective on display in this thread.
The last time people like you and your ilk told someone to "do their whining in another country", they did exactly that, but you and your Yankee mongrels proceeded to unleash the dogs of war upon them, burn their cities, rape their women, and turn the Southern sharecroppers into the very slaves you said you were against. And now you dare to tell us to "go ahead and do it" again?

[dangolegators]

LOL at the lack of perspective on display in this thread.
The last time people like you and your ilk told someone to "do their whining in another country", they did exactly that, but you and your Yankee mongrels proceeded to unleash the dogs of war upon them, burn their cities, rape their women, and turn the Southern sharecroppers into the very slaves you said you were against. And now you dare to tell us to "go ahead and do it" again?

What a bizarre post.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

Obviously not that competent if they are advising that they can't get him below 60% taxes... :rolleyes:

I do not think you understand the difference between a marginal tax rate an an effective tax rates...

I don't believe the 60% number and even if it is true I know people who earn a lot more and they aren't paying 60%....


This reeks of BS....

Let's examine it, shall we?

Phil's marginal federal tax rate is now 39.6%. California' top marginal tax is now 13.3% Those two things alone put Phil at 50%. In fact, it come to 52.9%

http://www.oc-breeze.com/2012/12/27/26189_your-2013-california-marginal-tax-rate/

Now, maybe Phil is also counting the sales tax rate in California, which in some counties can be over 9%. That gets him to about what he claimed.

Math is hard.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

What love it or leave it attitude? I just want them to leave it. Conservative folks who are threatening to 'go Galt' should nut up and do it. Unfortunately, like I said, it's just spoiled prima donnas whining.

My goodness. Spoiled prima donnas, indeed.

We are about to run into some real bad luck here pretty soon.

[surfn1080]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a pu$$y Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

So wait someone trying to be smart with their money makes them a pu$$y???? It's his hard earned money. I say good for him!!!

[Minister_of_Information]

Class consciousness is one of the great divides between left and right. That's why it's like the other side is speaking a foreign language.

[harwil]

If he's in the top 1%, federal tax-wise it probably amounts to 6-9% reduction in post tax money. Can't imagine state rates would alter that all that much further.

Calif just went through increases on taxes of the 1%.Income taxes are 63 % of Calif state revenues.

I'd move in a minute

[CalSFGator]

I do not think you understand the difference between a marginal tax rate an an effective tax rates...

Let's examine it, shall we.

Phil's marginal federal tax rate is now 39.6%. California' top marginal tax is now 13.3% Those two thins alone put Phil at 50%. 52.9%

http://www.oc-breeze.com/2012/12/27/26189_your-2013-california-marginal-tax-rate/

Now, maybe Phil is also counting the sales tax rate in California, which in some counties can be over 9%. That gets him to about what he claimed.

Math is hard.

Sales tax? Really? At this rate, I could probably find more than 100% in taxes.

As another Californian that suffers through the above 50% marginal rates burden (plus SF city taxes), it's pretty annoying, but it's a typical business "good problem to have".

Threatening the society that taxes you with the bluff of your early wealthy retirement is sort of the height of self indulgence. Oh no, Phil....please don't quit earning $50M a year on us, whatever will we do.

[gatorman_07732]

I do not think you understand the difference between a marginal tax rate an an effective tax rates...



Let's examine it, shall we?

Phil's marginal federal tax rate is now 39.6%. California' top marginal tax is now 13.3% Those two things alone put Phil at 50%. In fact, it come to 52.9%

http://www.oc-breeze.com/2012/12/27/26189_your-2013-california-marginal-tax-rate/

Now, maybe Phil is also counting the sales tax rate in California, which in some counties can be over 9%. That gets him to about what he claimed.

Math is hard.

Math and 996 are not exactly friends

[Matthanuf06]

The left bashes the producers in this country, but when the producers threaten to stop the left bashes them. What happened to a free country? The truth is the left needs their slaves. They know if they all retired/left they'd have nobody to pay for their goodies.

[corpgator]

I do not think you understand the difference between a marginal tax rate an an effective tax rates...



Let's examine it, shall we?

Phil's marginal federal tax rate is now 39.6%. California' top marginal tax is now 13.3% Those two things alone put Phil at 50%. In fact, it come to 52.9%

http://www.oc-breeze.com/2012/12/27/26189_your-2013-california-marginal-tax-rate/

Now, maybe Phil is also counting the sales tax rate in California, which in some counties can be over 9%. That gets him to about what he claimed.

Math is hard.

Obviously, since you aren't doing it right. In order to get 9% more, he would have to spend his entire gross every year before paying taxes, which is obviously impossible. If he spent his entire post tax income, assuming 52% is correct, that only gets him to 56.5%.

His math is wrong and besides, his accountant makes sure he doesn't pay anything near that much.

[CalSFGator]

The left bashes the producers in this country, but when the producers threaten to stop the left bashes them. What happened to a free country? The truth is the left needs their slaves. They know if they all retired/left they'd have nobody to pay for their goodies.

Except, of course, when they ARE the producers, then they are bashed as elitist hypocrites by you and others. When Matt Damon or Alec Baldwin talk politics, the right goes into its typical and predictable frenzied hysterics, tells them to shut up and stop thinking anyone cares about their political opinion. When Buffett or Gates say they pay too little in taxes, the apopleptic right tells them to give it away to the government and stop whining.

Now, we get a little anti-tax tirade from a wildly successful golfer (of all things) and we aren't allowed to tell them to pipe down or just retire or move already?

And what do you mean "what happened to a free country"? I hope you are aware of the sheer nonsensicality of that statement, lest someone suggested that Phil not be legally allowed to complain and I missed it.

[theorangebluewinagain]

Cadies get 10-15% of earnings, PGA Tour Royalty fee of 7%, Some coaches take a % from 2-4%, Then his agent gets a cut from 2-5%. If you put all these in the mix add it to his Federal and state taxes I think he easily gets to 63%. All you rich haters owe Mickelson an apology, if nothing else for your stupidity.
I know this because I live in the same neighborhood with many PGA Pros.
BTW Did any of you so called gator fans realize the UF Athletic Hall of Famer Brian Gay(NC '93 at UF) won on the PGA tour yesterday at Hummana Challenge in Az.

[QGator2414]

While Phil will most likely end up in Arizona we would welcome here in Florida...

That said the envy is SAD!

[wargunfan]

LOL at the lack of perspective on display in this thread.
The last time people like you and your ilk told someone to "do their whining in another country", they did exactly that, but you and your Yankee mongrels proceeded to unleash the dogs of war upon them, burn their cities, rape their women, and turn the Southern sharecroppers into the very slaves you said you were against. And now you dare to tell us to "go ahead and do it" again?

Heah heah suh!

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

Obviously, since you aren't doing it right. In order to get 9% more, he would have to spend his entire gross every year before paying taxes, which is obviously impossible. If he spent his entire post tax income, assuming 52% is correct, that only gets him to 56.5%.

His math is wrong and besides, his accountant makes sure he doesn't pay anything near that much.

That is a fair point. I was just pointing out that even without things like sales tax, property tax and the like, Phil is already well over 50% with just income tax. Hell, I overlooked his self employment tax, which is right at 15% up to over $100k in earnings. It is not a stretch that considering the rest of those might raise his marginal rate to over 60%.

[MichiGator2002]

So, between Phil Mickelson doing what the obvious and predictable parts of human nature say he should, and California's tax code ignoring the obvious and predictable part of human nature, it is Phil that is wrong.

I imagine Jerry Brown screaming in memetic fashion "LEFTY!!!!! Y U NO STAY N PAY?!?!?!"

[QGator2414]

So, between Phil Mickelson doing what the obvious and predictable parts of human nature say he should, and California's tax code ignoring the obvious and predictable part of human nature, it is Phil that is wrong.

I imagine Jerry Brown screaming in memetic fashion "LEFTY!!!!! Y U NO STAY N PAY?!?!?!"

:)

[ArtVandelay]

Tell you what, Mr. I'm-not-a-pussy-and-pay-my-share-so-should-you.
Post your last 1040 on here, and we'll see how much leeway you have to call out other people's tax payments. To make it fair, I'll post my last ESTIMATED QUARTERLY tax payment. Easy for you to criticize other people when I bet your "skin in the game" is negligible at best. It's not like he's complaining about paying $20 for Bull Gator seats. If anything, it's more akin to paying thousands for the Sunshine Seats while chaps like you pay nothing for Champions Club seats. If you don't have to cut five-digit checks to the IRS every 3 months, I don't really see how you have the right to tell someone who does that he needs to pay more.
Or you could reflect on your error and apologize for calling real taxpayers the p-word.

I would gladly trade financial situations with him and i'll even chip in an extra 10% to the gov't... (even though I am sure he doesn't literally pay 60%) It not really any of our business, but I would love to see his tax returns showing that.

As usual, most people take what you say and change it to support their position.

I never said he was wrong to complain or to make changes to better his situation. I called him a pu$$y for talking about retiring because the taxes are too high and I stand by that.

Of course I am envious of him. He makes $40 million a year. I think most people would be envious of his financial position.

[QGator2414]

I would gladly trade financial situations with him and i'll even chip in an extra 10% to the gov't... (even though I am sure he doesn't literally pay 60%) It not really any of our business, but I would love to see his tax returns showing that.

As usual, most people take what you say and change it to support their position.

I never said he was wrong to complain or to make changes to better his situation. I called him a pu$$y for talking about retiring because the taxes are too high and I stand by that.

Of course I am envious of him. He makes $40 million a year. I think most people would be envious of his financial position.

And this is sadly a huge problem in this country...

[ArtVandelay]

And this is sadly a huge problem in this country...

I'm envious of Kanye West for being with Kim Kardashian. Is that part of the problem too?

[Swampmaster]

no big deal--just move to florida or texas--no state income tax, and build a huge mansion somewhere with low property taxes.

[ArtDeco]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a #$%^ Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

I am quoting this because, days after he took heat for being a socialist, the OP went back and tried to change his inflammatory quote to better match his new viewpoint.

[FearNoSpear]

If he's paying 63% in taxes, he needs to fire his accountant. Still, I think he can scrape by on the 15 million per year or so he takes home even after paying 63%.

It isn't about what he has left. It's about people keeping what they earn no matter the scale.

[ArtVandelay]

I am quoting this because, days after he took heat for being a socialist, the OP went back and tried to change his inflammatory quote to better match his new viewpoint.

???

You think I care if you call me a socialist?

What did I change?

[ArtDeco]

I would gladly trade financial situations with him and i'll even chip in an extra 10% to the gov't...

Aren't you the same guy who said you were unemployed for 6 months in another thread and complained that your unemployment benefit wasn't enough to pay your mortgage? Now you want to be loose with your money, throwing away this magical 10% instead of saving it away for your retirement or your kid's future?
It sure is easy to say you'll pay an extra 10% more tax than me (or Phil) when you never had any means of paying the original bill to begin with. I know your type, my disingenuous friend.
Instead of offering up dollars to the government that you have no intention of paying, why don't you go to church this weekend and put a $20 bill in the collection plate. Church of your choice- a mosque, a temple, a Mormon church, whatever. Would you do that for them, or is $20 asking too much for a charitable organization?

[harwil]

I'm envious of Kanye West for being with Kim Kardashian. Is that part of the problem too?

Kim Kardashian?Boy, you've got some kinky taste.

[ArtDeco]

Isn't it funny the OP of this thread is telling GatorBill in the other thread to either pay his tax increase or he's welcome to find another line of work. When Mickelson considers his options and listens to the OP's advice, he's a puss. Gotcha.

[ArtVandelay]

Aren't you the same guy who said you were unemployed for 6 months in another thread and complained that your unemployment benefit wasn't enough to pay your mortgage? Now you want to be loose with your money, throwing away this magical 10% instead of saving it away for your retirement or your kid's future?
It sure is easy to say you'll pay an extra 10% more tax than me (or Phil) when you never had any means of paying the original bill to begin with. I know your type, my disingenuous friend.
Instead of offering up dollars to the government that you have no intention of paying, why don't you go to church this weekend and put a $20 bill in the collection plate. Church of your choice- a mosque, a temple, a Mormon church, whatever. Would you do that for them, or is $20 asking too much for a charitable organization?

I stated that my unemployment wasn't enough to cover. I never complained about it.

I was grateful that I was able to use the unemployment to help offset some costs.

I'm not being loose or fast with money. I am saying that if I was earning $48 million dollars a year, I wouldn't be complaining about the tax rate going up a little. My 10% comment was making the point that its still a ridiculous amount of money.

Again, I never said he shouldn't complain about being taxed more. I said that its ridiculous to cry about it saying that he is better off retiring.

You don't have a clue about me. I'm Jewish so I don't go to church, but I do plenty for charity and I help those in need when I can.

[LittleBlueLW]

I stated that my unemployment wasn't enough to cover. I never complained about it.

I was grateful that I was able to use the unemployment to help offset some costs.

I'm not being loose or fast with money. I am saying that if I was earning $48 million dollars a year, I wouldn't be complaining about the tax rate going up a little. My 10% comment was making the point that its still a ridiculous amount of money.

Again, I never said he shouldn't complain about being taxed more. I said that its ridiculous to cry about it saying that he is better off retiring.

You don't have a clue about me. I'm Jewish so I don't go to church, but I do plenty for charity and I help those in need when I can.

The linked article didnt seem like he was complaining, just stating a fact. Just as no one knows you on this board, dont pretend to know that Phil was crying or complaining.

I would bet a hundred bucks to your one penny that he was looking big picture with investments, development and business opportunities. See Curt Shilling story for an example of a high earning athlete that made some stupid choices and went broke, in an instant. Phil's no idiot. He's being careful. Tax rates on high wager earners matter. He knows this.

[QGator2414]

I don't know how many of you watch Survivor but Jeff Kent cracked me up after he got voted out. This thread is a perfect place for the clip...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YIQGWY0woy0

[gtr2x]

Great, another whiner. The guy is making millions playing golf. Be happy with what you have and shut up. Not class envy in the least, just common sense.

[QGator2414]

Great, another whiner. The guy is making millions playing golf. Be happy with what you have and shut up. Not class envy in the least, just common sense.

The irony...

What is wrong with making millions playing golf?

You seem to have the envy (though you don't want to acknowledge it) to start lobbying people to stop watching golf...Then you won't have to listen to someone "whine" about keeping what they earn...

[Matthanuf06]

Except, of course, when they ARE the producers, then they are bashed as elitist hypocrites by you and others. When Matt Damon or Alec Baldwin talk politics, the right goes into its typical and predictable frenzied hysterics, tells them to shut up and stop thinking anyone cares about their political opinion. When Buffett or Gates say they pay too little in taxes, the apopleptic right tells them to give it away to the government and stop whining.

Now, we get a little anti-tax tirade from a wildly successful golfer (of all things) and we aren't allowed to tell them to pipe down or just retire or move already?

And what do you mean "what happened to a free country"? I hope you are aware of the sheer nonsensicality of that statement, lest someone suggested that Phil not be legally allowed to complain and I missed it.

Nobody cares about Matt Damon or Phil Mickelson. We shouldn't be taking political knowledge from someone solely based on income.

There is something fundamentally different between someone saying they should pay more (less) and saying you should pay more (less). You seem to not understand that.

If Matt, Alec or Warren want to pay more then yes, they should overpay. But they don't because what they really are saying is that I don't pay enough. Yet that's a fundamentally different question. I have no problem with someone wanting to pay more if it makes them happy. It's their money and their happiness. However when dictating about my happiness, my labor, and my life the burden shifts. What makes them the authority on my life? Why does their happiness matter more than mine?

And besides you didn't really fall for that Warren Buffet crap did you? What type of connection does his tax on his dividends have to do with my income tax?

[CalSFGator]

Nobody cares about Matt Damon or Phil Mickelson. We shouldn't be taking political knowledge from someone solely based on income.

There is something fundamentally different between someone saying they should pay more (less) and saying you should pay more (less). You seem to not understand that.

If Matt, Alec or Warren want to pay more then yes, they should overpay. But they don't because what they really are saying is that I don't pay enough. Yet that's a fundamentally different question. I have no problem with someone wanting to pay more if it makes them happy. It's their money and their happiness. However when dictating about my happiness, my labor, and my life the burden shifts. What makes them the authority on my life? Why does their happiness matter more than mine?

And besides you didn't really fall for that Warren Buffet crap did you? What type of connection does his tax on his dividends have to do with my income tax?

No, you just aren't listening. It would make no sense for them to overpay on taxes when they are trying to address a systemic problem. Only somebody utterly detached from any real world solution thinking would suggest as much. If someone says they want more money for education or homeland security, I am not so childish and naive as to tell them to learn to teach all the children or raise an army. When Buffett says we should pay more in income taxes, he is saying it willing to give up more of his own (as am I), but with the adult knowledge that the real value is in a broader change that could actually make a difference. It's either crazy or willfully idiotic that righties can't see that. Warren Buffett has also proposed higher capital gains taxes, but that proposal never gets any air time in their knee-jerky echo chamber.

Then you move into another meaningless rant about me having authority on your life. Why does even the most marginal tax rate increase invoke these absurd and whiny statements? Whatever you or I pay is based on what society thinks is reasonable and/or necessary. It goes up and down over time. Reagan cost me more than Obama ever has, and yet I never asked these inane questions about why Reagan thought he could take my livelihood or had sway over my life. It's all so petulant and hysterical. When can we be adults again and have human being conversations in the world of reality? I am no "love it or leave it" guy, but honestly it is getting absurd. Most of us are well educated and can work anywhere. These wild histrionics are so overwrought and self-indulgent, I find myself looking around for the slow-witted girl everyone is trying to impress and depants.

[CHFG8R]

Sales tax? Really? At this rate, I could probably find more than 100% in taxes.

As another Californian that suffers through the above 50% marginal rates burden (plus SF city taxes), it's pretty annoying, but it's a typical business "good problem to have".

Threatening the society that taxes you with the bluff of your early wealthy retirement is sort of the height of self indulgence. Oh no, Phil....please don't quit earning $50M a year on us, whatever will we do.

Fact is, retirement is right around the corner for Phil. Yes, there is the Champion's Tour, but the prize money is much less and, with less exposure than the regular tour, endorcements will probably slip too. Though, Phil being Phil, he could be like Arnie and be earning gazillions in endorcements well after his playing career ends. That said, though, the time is now for Phil to maximize his earnings. He's at his top earning potential now and is likely to fall off that very shortly (arthritis, age, etc.). So, I get it.

As to why he hasn't already moved? Any of you ever been to San Diego? I'm a native Floridian and San Diego is one of the very few places (provided I had to means to enjoy it) I'd leave here for in a second.

[CHFG8R]

I stated that my unemployment wasn't enough to cover. I never complained about it.

I was grateful that I was able to use the unemployment to help offset some costs.

I'm not being loose or fast with money. I am saying that if I was earning $48 million dollars a year, I wouldn't be complaining about the tax rate going up a little. My 10% comment was making the point that its still a ridiculous amount of money.

Again, I never said he shouldn't complain about being taxed more. I said that its ridiculous to cry about it saying that he is better off retiring.

You don't have a clue about me. I'm Jewish so I don't go to church, but I do plenty for charity and I help those in need when I can.

Call me when you earn 48 million and fork away 20 million in taxes and don't bitch. Till then, I'm just going to come out and call it like it it: You're full of crap! I don't know anyone who wouldn't be, at the very least, taken aback by that.

[ArtVandelay]

Call me when you earn 48 million and fork away 20 million in taxes and don't bitch. Till then, I'm just going to come out and call it like it it: You're full of crap! I don't know anyone who wouldn't be, at the very least, taken aback by that.

Either most of you are illiterate or you just like ignoring what people write so you can try to prove some point.

I never said that he shouldn't be pissed or complain about high tax rates. I said that for him to talk about retiring because of it, is ridiculous. He can retire anytime he wants. I couldn't care less if I never see him play golf again. The point that you would retire just because they are taking more taxes out is just stupid.

And yes, most of us are enviously, jealous of someone making $48 million a year playing golf. I don't see anything wrong with that. I am sure you are a little too. Doesn't mean that I wish him ill will or anything. I think he should appreciate the fact that he is able to earn as much as he does and somehow try to survive on the $20 million he will get to keep each year.

It's a little insensitive considering the troubles that millions of people have financially. I sure don't feel bad for him.

[Minister_of_Information]

I don't feel any envy towards Mickelson whatsoever. I have a vague sense of "oh, good for him" and nothing more. I do not feel diminished by his prosperity. I really don't care much about it.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

Tiger also said he moved from California to Florida primarily due to taxes. (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2266830/Tiger-Woods-admits-left-California-tax-rates.html)

Interesting that it took a UK paper to report this.

[ArtDeco]

Great, another whiner. The guy is making millions playing golf. Be happy with what you have and shut up. Not class envy in the least, just common sense.

That's not the point. If you want to start a thread about whether a person deserves to get paid millions for hitting a ball, that's another argument/thread. Knock yours elf out.
The point is, does the government have the right to play Robin Hood and change the existing rules on a guy who's already paying high taxes, and does the same guy not have the right to adjust his plans accordingly?

[DeanMeadGator]

Either most of you are illiterate or you just like ignoring what people write so you can try to prove some point.

I never said that he shouldn't be pissed or complain about high tax rates. I said that for him to talk about retiring because of it, is ridiculous. He can retire anytime he wants. I couldn't care less if I never see him play golf again. The point that you would retire just because they are taking more taxes out is just stupid.

And yes, most of us are enviously, jealous of someone making $48 million a year playing golf. I don't see anything wrong with that. I am sure you are a little too. Doesn't mean that I wish him ill will or anything. I think he should appreciate the fact that he is able to earn as much as he does and somehow try to survive on the $20 million he will get to keep each year.

It's a little insensitive considering the troubles that millions of people have financially. I sure don't feel bad for him.

Who, exactly, is not trying to make a point? If someone does not want to make a point, perhaps they should consider why they post anything.

As to most of "us" being illiterate, it appears that everyone who posts can read, write and think.

[gator7_5]

I'm not being loose or fast with money. I am saying that if I was earning $48 million dollars a year, I wouldn't be complaining about the tax rate going up a little.

Yes you would. Because you would have earned that money. It's easy to give someone else's away.

See our government.

[gator7_5]

And yes, most of us are enviously, jealous of someone making $48 million a year playing golf.

I can say with a straight face that I am not at all. I am 100% happy for those who have what they've earned, including myself.

And what, you think these people have no stress?

You act like he plays 9 holes at the local country club, drinks a cold beer after, and a million a week just appears in his checking account.

You truly have no idea what it takes to be extemely successful, no offense.

[ArtVandelay]

I can say with a straight face that I am not at all. I am 100% happy for those who have what they've earned, including myself.

And what, you think these people have no stress?

You act like he plays 9 holes at the local country club, drinks a cold beer after, and a million a week just appears in his checking account.

You truly have no idea what it takes to be extemely successful, no offense.

Actually I do.

I am 100% happy for those who have what they earned. I can also be jealous and envious of them.

I'm sure you would like the burden of earning $48 million even if it means you have to pay more in taxes.

[DeanMeadGator]

And this is sadly a huge problem in this country...

If we all stop paying to go to movies, stop watching professional sports, and stop watching everthing else on TV, the high salaries paid to professional athletes, actors, actresses and TV personalities will go away. Problem solved. :laugh:

[ArtVandelay]

That's not the point. If you want to start a thread about whether a person deserves to get paid millions for hitting a ball, that's another argument/thread. Knock yours elf out.
The point is, does the government have the right to play Robin Hood and change the existing rules on a guy who's already paying high taxes, and does the same guy not have the right to adjust his plans accordingly?

Actually, that is the point. I started the thread about how it is ridiculous for him to say he is going to retire just because the taxes are too high.

If you want to start another thread about how the taxes are too high or how the new law is unfair, that is fine.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

Actually, that is the point. I started the thread about how it is ridiculous for him to say he is going to retire just because the taxes are too high.

I think he said he was going to move?

[ArtVandelay]

Who, exactly, is not trying to make a point? If someone does not want to make a point, perhaps they should consider why they post anything.

As to most of "us" being illiterate, it appears that everyone who posts can read, write and think.

Trying to make their point based on stuff that I am not saying, that is not relevant to the thread topic. (See ArtDeco's last post)

"Most of us" was related to the ignoring what I post and the illiterate was only towards a few of the usual suspects. It's pretty annoying to have to post the same thing over and over again.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Although I understand the frustration with high taxes, its a shame to see the greed that is out there. Not saying that they shouldn't try to hold onto as much as you earn. I feel the same way. But not being grateful for what you do have is not a good look.

[gator996]

Robert Frank, CNBC

Mickelson likely pays less taxes than he thinks
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/mickelson-likely-pays-less-taxes-he-thinks-1B8057229#/business/mickelson-likely-pays-less-taxes-he-thinks-1B8057229

But let's consider those numbers.

Under current tax rates, Mickelson would pay 13.3 percent in state income tax and 39.6 percent in federal income tax. That's 52.9 percent combined. Medicare and Medicaid is an additional 2 percent. The new health-care levy is .9 percent on earned income and 3.8 percent on investment income.

Self-employment taxes could total an additional 15.3 percent -- but that's only on income up to $113,000, accountants say. After that the rate is 2.9 percent.

Mickelson would also pay local taxes where he plays tournaments. That could add another one percent or two percent.

So the maximum Mickelson could pay in state and income taxes, payroll and other income-related taxes would be around 60 percent.

But that rate is only if he did absolutely no tax planning or basic deductions. He would, for instance, get a deduction on his state income taxes from his federal. He would also deduct any golf-related expenses as a business expense. He probably puts money in a retirement plan, which is tax-favorable.

I would guess that Mickelson has some investments, which would be taxed at the lower capital gains rate of 20 percent (or 23.8 percent with the new health-care tax). And I would guess he might have a mortgage deduction, or other deductions related to kids and education.

And we know that Mickelson gives money to charity. So that would be deducted as well. If he has trusts (which he likely does) that also reduces his tax rate.

Steven Piascik, president of Piascik – the accounting firm that works with dozens of professional athletes – said that he easily could bring Mickelson's rate to around 50 to 52 percent with some "basic tax planning."
"I couldn't guarantee it, but 8 to 10 percent off that 62 percent rate seems normal," he said. "I would guess he's doing a lot of these things already."

Either Mickelson misspoke – or he needs to hire a new accountant.

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

So the maximum Mickelson could pay in state and income taxes, payroll and other income-related taxes would be around 60 percent.


So why is this materially different than what he claimed? It does not change his point at all.

[gator996]

To Mickelson's credit is that he never said he would retire...

...that appears to be a creation of the media.


But when its all said an done, Phil's tax burden went up less than 10%....around 8% YOY


My issue was that threatening retirement was ridiculous...and that the number had to be wrong.

It was.

[QGator2414]

If we all stop paying to go to movies, stop watching professional sports, and stop watching everthing else on TV, the high salaries paid to professional athletes, actors, actresses and TV personalities will go away. Problem solved. :laugh:

EXACTLY!

Until then be happy for those who earn their money entertaining...

[MichaelJoeWilliamson]

To Mickelson's credit is that he never said he would retire...

...that appears to be a creation of the media.


But when its all said an done, Phil's tax burden went up less than 10%....around 8% YOY


My issue was that threatening retirement was ridiculous...and that the number had to be wrong.

It was.


One of these (bolded) things is not like the other. And his numbers were not materially wrong, as clearly he was talking about marginal tax rate.

[myamiG8R]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/golf-devil-ball-golf/phil-mickelson-warns-drastic-changes-because-state-federal-165909894--golf.html

stop being such a #$%^ Phil!!!

most people would love to earn just 1% of the money that he is taxed...

well then work harder... practice more... hone a skill... do something...

[MichiGator2002]

Here is a question I have -- the stamped and approved apology Lefty gave to... well, lefties, included at its core the belief that his taxes were not for public consumption. Is he now free and clear to run for President on that premise, or will the goalposts (or pin placement) get moved on him?

[wgbgator]

Here is a question I have -- the stamped and approved apology Lefty gave to... well, lefties, included at its core the belief that his taxes were not for public consumption. Is he now free and clear to run for President on that premise, or will the goalposts (or pin placement) get moved on him?

If he had quietly moved to Arizona or Florida like any other anonymous rich guy, there is probably no story. Celebrities airing greivances in public or in the press usually get held to the fire (rightly or wrongly), whether they are politicians or golfers. Public speech is not without consequences. Hence the quick, but probably not heartfelt apology.

[MichiGator2002]

If he had quietly moved to Arizona or Florida like any other anonymous rich guy, there is probably no story. Celebrities airing greivances in public or in the press usually get held to the fire (rightly or wrongly), whether they are politicians or golfers. Public speech is not without consequences. Hence the quick, but probably not heartfelt apology.

Well, I flatly reject that he was wrong, rude, impolitic, or indiscreet in any way. There is absolutely nothing to apologize for. If anything, he should he apologizing for the spinelessness of the prior apology.

When do PETA nut celebs apologize for airing their grievance, for example?

[wgbgator]

Well, I flatly reject that he was wrong, rude, impolitic, or indiscreet in any way. There is absolutely nothing to apologize for. If anything, he should he apologizing for the spinelessness of the prior apology.

When do PETA nut celebs apologize for airing their grievance, for example?

Probably when their earnings or career might suffer. Anyways, obviously given Phil's general likability among vast swaths of people, a fact which earns him lots of endorsement deals, its probably common sense not to even give the whiff of appearing like an entitled jerk, even if you, me or he feels he is entitled to be a jerk, concerned citizen or whatever. Tiger was certainly free to hook up with as many waitresses and pornstars as he wanted. But it cost him some dough, and tarnished his sterling image. We, the people didnt "need" his apology for that either, but his earning potential did.

[CHFG8R]

I don't feel any envy towards Mickelson whatsoever. I have a vague sense of "oh, good for him" and nothing more. I do not feel diminished by his prosperity. I really don't care much about it.

I'm completely envious. . . but not so much the money (which I'd love to have but don't begrudge him for) but the access to all those exclusive, top-notch courses and that fact he PLAYS GOLF FOR A LIVING.

[Minister_of_Information]

I'm completely envious. . . but not so much the money (which I'd love to have but don't begrudge him for) but the access to all those exclusive, top-notch courses and that fact he PLAYS GOLF FOR A LIVING.

Envy means you desire that he be laid low if you cannot rise similarly. I doubt you feel that way, though. America is the land of opportunity, and I applaud those who use it to their advantage. I don't feel cheated by their success. Perhaps this is because I don't feel that the successful are a higher caste that is impenetrable without government agency, which is unfortunately the foundation of most left wing thought.

[gator996]

I'm not envious....at all....

Love Phil's game (especially the short game)...


He's public republican...it was a political statement...just like the "poppa john's" CEO, Denny's, Chick-fil-a, etc...

How many people would believe that Obama has cut Govt Expenditures vs. Bush & Clinton?

Not even a contest...he hasn't just slowed the growth but actually delivered less spending in real terms vs Bush...


Tells you something about socio-economic fear in real terms...

[CHFG8R]

Envy means you desire that he be laid low if you cannot rise similarly. I doubt you feel that way, though. America is the land of opportunity, and I applaud those who use it to their advantage. I don't feel cheated by their success. Perhaps this is because I don't feel that the successful are a higher caste that is impenetrable without government agency, which is unfortunately the foundation of most left wing thought.

Agreed. Just saying I'd trade my 7 a.m. sales conference call for a daily range session all day. :yes: